Viability of the Big Horn Armory Model 89 in .500 S&W (22" Barrel) for Cape Buffalo?

I don't know. If an arrow angers rather than dropping a buffalo, which then kills a PH, let's say a young father with a couple of children, I don't believe I care to know the person who is capable of rationalizing his death as someone who accepted the risk.
Well said, often men with families to feed will take whatever risk is necessary to pay the bills; I’ve seen it in construction and I’ve helped load the consequences into the back of an ambulance….

Carrying and loading the body is easier than telling a woman the father of her children isn’t coming home.

Red iron workers have a saying…..

“We do not die, we are killed.”
 
While we all strive to mitigate unnecessary risks, what we do always has risk.
not to hijack the thread, but, hunting "dangerous game", by its very name and nature is "risky" and to a large degree why we hunt them at all i suspect. Having 6 available 500 gr bullets quickly available would be a great way to mitigate risk. :)
 
I would really advise to follow what red leg and one day are saying.
For the romance of lever action, hunt white tail with them.
For the effect, safety and responibility hunt buffalo with bolt action or double rifle.
 
If it is legal and you want to give it a try why not. Is it the best choice and the smartest move probably not.

After seeing Tim Wells spearing a buffalo in Mozambique that is my ultimate hunt I want to pursue some day. Will it ever happen probably not.

If so I know I lived even if it will be my last moments on this earth if it goes haywire.
 
Archery tackle (long bow, compound or crossbow), handgun and lever cartridges each carry a greater risk for any number of reasons.

I also wouldn't stop anyone from engaging in a form of hunting as long as it is legal. But just because it's legal, doesn't mean it's a good idea. This includes the PH who takes on the responsibility of someone wanting to do this.

The risks are high enough when using "proper" rifle cartridges on DG.
 
I've killed exactly 1 buffalo with a 416 Remington. I shot the hell out of that buffalo starting about 20 yards away getting as close as 10 yards, twice, and never shooting more than 30 yards in 6 shots. I dont think I ever missed shoving one into his armpit or ribs, or throat, or frontal chest. Each shot delivering nearly 5,000 ft-lbs of energy...and he didn't seem to care about anything except for the amount or noise I was making. I would hate to shoot a handgun big enough to make an impression on a cape buffalo.

However, you do you.

God bless
 
Thanks one and all for your feedback. I gather from most it's probably not a good idea. What lead me down this path is just looking at the numbers and comparing DG Calibers and Bullets. I personally have never seen any of these rounds on a chronograph but I did dig into a lot of sources. When I put it together in a chart I thought this looks interesting at least on paper.

Dangerous Game Cartridge Comparison Chart


CartridgeBullet WeightMuzzle Velocity (fps)Muzzle Energy (ft-lbs)Notes – DG Load Type
.500 S&W Mag (22")500 gr solid2,150–2,2005,135–5,375Mono solid or Punch in BHA Model 89
.375 H&H Mag300 gr solid2,450–2,5504,000–4,320Swift A-Frame / TSX / Hydro
.404 Jeffery400 gr solid2,150–2,3004,100–4,700Woodleigh solid or North Fork FP
.450/400 NE 3"400 gr solid2,050–2,1503,730–4,100Classic NE load; soft then solid
.416 Rigby400 gr solid2,350–2,4504,900–5,340Trophy Bonded / TSX / Hydro.

No "herring or sardine" just data. How accurate Im not sure but I did look at multiple sources. Please remember this is just an Idea. I do have a 375 H&H and a 416 Rem Mag. When I do get a chance to go to Africa Im sure I would bring one or both of those rifles. Im just one of those people that likes to look outside the box and wanted to see what people who have been there think.
Once again I do appreciate the feedback.
 
I think you should shoot one of those guns with 500+ gr bullets before making any decision. Lever action are notorious for hard recoil to start with. I do not see much advantage to a lightweight short barreled thumper gun. The muzzle jump and recoil will negate much if not all the advantage of fast followup shots. True the gun will gain significant weight when loaded up with six stogies but the balance will be wrong. In my opinion fast followup shots are overrated. Well placed follow up shots are blue ribbon. Spray and pray has no place in dangerous game hunting in my opinion. I shoot a lot of skeet, clays, and birds and that's what I have learned over six decades shooting at moving targets. Being efficient does not necessarily mean being fast. My advice would be to spend your money on a conventional bolt in a conventional caliber (375, 404, or 416 Rigby) and a skeet club membership. Learn to shoot moving targets LOW GUN and you'll be in good shape to place an effective bullet into running buffalo if needed. Shooting skeet high gun is a waste of ammo. Teaches you nothing. Of course, also familiarizing yourself with your DGR at a rifle range goes without saying.
 
data below assumes modern handloads in the Big Horn Armory Model 89 (22" barrel):

Those velocities are very generous compared to buffalo bores published speeds, which are 1,650ish from what I see at a glance.

I think a 500gr .5" bullet over 2,000 fps is poison for anything that walks but I'm skeptical of reports of that much speed from such a short case.
 
If my memory is not failing me. I believe there was a hunting show (NRA Sponsored) in which the hunter hunted dangerous game with some type of lever guns. I do remember this hunter (can't remember his name to save my life) shot an older double and had an accidental double and he landed on his rear end. I'll see if I can find it.
 
Those velocities are very generous compared to buffalo bores published speeds, which are 1,650ish from what I see at a glance.

I think a 500gr .5" bullet over 2,000 fps is poison for anything that walks but I'm skeptical of reports of that much speed from such a short case.
True and I can assure you from personal experience with lever guns on DG that when you get anywhere near those velocities, the gun wants to come apart. I have sheared many screws from mag tubes and crushed a lot of springs trying to get there with lots of input from Ashley Emerson and others who understand it far better than I do. It's just not viable for very long. And in the light lever guns, it's punishing recoil that really slows reloading down. There is a big vertical lift with a lot of sideways torque. It can also pop the lever open on recoil...think about that...the action is opening itself.
 
Those velocities are very generous compared to buffalo bores published speeds, which are 1,650ish from what I see at a glance.

I think a 500gr .5" bullet over 2,000 fps is poison for anything that walks but I'm skeptical of reports of that much speed from such a short case.
You’re quoting Buffalo Bore handgun velocities. From an 18 inch Model 89 Bighorn 400 grain mono metal bullet 1840 FPS are listed on Buffalo Bores site. Perhaps add another 100 FPS for a 22 inch barrel.

There were published velocities of 2275 FPS from a 22 inch Bighorn M89 using 400 grain bullets. I believe these were extremely hot from Double Tap and I no longer see it listed. Since the 500 S&W was created as a handgun cartridge, most published velocities are from handguns. There will be a substantial increase with a rifle. How much only a chronograph can tell.

Michael458 has done considerable testing including field testing with a variety of cartridges of his creation. I believe his 50 B&M Super Short is very similar ballistically to the 500 S&W Magnum and it was used very successfully in Australia on multiple water Buffalo using CEB solids & Raptors, 375 grain North Fork solids and expanding. He likes the performance of these 375 grain bullets.

Rather than conjecture, Michael458 has actually put in the time and research and done considerable testing including the non traditional lighter weight mono metal bullets including field use on DG. Perhaps he could weigh in on his thoughts regarding the 500 S&W chambered in a rifle for Cape buffalo but I suspect since it’s ballistically similar to his own 50 B&M Super Short, with the right bullet, fully tested in a Bighorn Model 89, it would work fine on any Cape buffalo. While I have no personal desire to shoot a buffalo with one, I like my 375 H&H, 416’s and 458 Lott, I do not see this as a reckless stunt.

If this is what interests you, look at Michael458’s site and all the data he has compiled regarding the light for caliber mono metal bullets, especially for his 50 B&M Super Short. With a tubular fed rifle like the Bighorn Model 89, this of course rules out any pointed bullets which could detonate in the tubular magazine during recoil, so flat nose bullets or round nose only.

Competent handgun hunters have successfully used 454 Casull, 475 Linebaugh, 500 Linebaugh and 500 S&W on Buffalo. With the correct bullet, the Bighorn M89 500 S&W magnum is significantly more powerful from the rifle format. I’ve never owned a Bighorn but they were engineered for very powerful cartridges. I have extensively used a Marlin 1895 45-70 with magnum loads and it’s true, I had to constantly tighten the actions screws after a shooting session. The Bighorn strikes me as a better quality rifle and fully tested.
IMG_4797.jpeg
 
Buffalo bore lists their 500gr load at 1600fps from an 18" barrel. If it actually picked up 50 fps per inch than you could get to about 1900 from a 24" barrel but i doubt thats the case. Standing by what I said, those numbers in the OP seem very optimistic for such a small case.
 
From @michael458 regarding solid bullet performance...

There are 8 Absolute Known Factors for Solid Penetration and are as follows in Order of Importance.....

#1 Meplat Percentage of Caliber

Meplats that attain 65% Meplat of Caliber are terminally stable.... Above 70% Meplat bullets remain stable, however depth of penetration begins to decrease with every step up in meplat size. 70% Meplat or larger does increase trauma to, and destruction of tissue. 70% Meplats start to get difficult to feed, even in Winchester M70s...... From 65% Meplat to 68% Meplat is OPTIMUM for Stability, destruction of tissues, and feed and function in most quality rifles..........

#2 Nose Profile
There are many and varied Nose Profiles of solids on the market today, from the angled Nose Profiles of CEB and North Fork, to the straight nose profile of the older North Forks and GSC, the Barnes/Hornady Profiles (like a RN cut off at the top) to many more... Not all of these are created equal, and some are better performers than others. In recent tests in comparison between the old North Fork Profiles and the Newer North Fork Profiles I was getting 20% deeper penetration with the Newer North Forks than the older, with the same bullet, just difference in Nose Profile is all.... John at North Fork agrees, and in their work there they were getting more along the lines of 25% deeper penetration. One major thing that I noticed here, the stability at the end of penetration was 100% better. In most all tests here the last 2 inches of penetration of the old style North Forks would be unstable. Now this is and was of no consequence at the very end of penetration. The depth of penetration of these older nose profile bullets was always so deep that it had long accomplished its mission before loss of stability right at the very end. This new NOSE PROFILE of North Forks remains DEAD STRAIGHT to the very last of penetration, and always found NOSE FORWARD........

#3 Construction & Material
Construction of a solid is a major part of its ability to penetrate. To deny this is foolish to say the least. Some of our solids out there, lead core, are very very weak in construction and absolutely do not have the ability to bust through heavy bone and reach their intended targets. I have seen and have in hand failures of these bullets from the field..... A shame as well, as some of these bullets are promoted as Dangerous Game Solids, and some of them flatten out like pancakes when hitting heavy dense material. Some FMJ Have steel inserts, while this solves a problem in one area, it creates problems in other areas.... Brass is harder than Copper... No surprise there, but I have busted elephant heads with both copper and brass, and never had one distort, but, these solids were of a very STRONG NOSE PROFILE as well........ So you see, combinations of different factors work together to strengthen or weaken other factors..... A good strong Nose Profile, can overcome some material deficiencies and in the case of copper solids this is extremely important.

#4 Nose Projection
Nose Projection above the top bands was the last factor discovered. There may be more factors, but currently they remain undiscovered at this point in time.... We found that nose projection above the top of the bands of current CNC monolithic bullets is very important to depth of penetration. Some bullets designed to work through lever actin riflers require a SHORT NOSE PROJECTION in front of the bands so that they can be loaded deep enough to work through the actions of these guns... Nose Projection of these same bullets for bolt guns, single shots, and double rifles are longer, from .600 to .700 in front of the top band. The LONGER NOSE PROJECTION solids will penetrate on average 25% deeper than the shorter nose projection. Now, these bullets already have all the other required factors for stability, nose profile, construction and radius, so it is ONLY DEPTH Of penetration that is effected with properly designed bullets.

#5 Radius Edge of Meplat
We found that the radius edge of the meplat made a difference, small, but a difference none the less. A nicely radius edge penetrates about 5% deeper, and has more stability at the end than a sharp edged radius.... No more to go into here, thats it.......

All the Above Factors Deal with Bullet Design........

#6 Velocity
Velocity is a factor, but it also goes hand in hand with Nose Profile and Construction/Material. If we assume that the Meplat is optimum, the nose projection is optimum, and the bullet has a nice radius then velocity becomes a factor in combination with nose profile and construction/materials. Different Nose Profiles react differently with velocity. Some nose profiles at very low velocity cannot maintain stability, but this would be in the extreme, and other factors may come into play with some of this. In essence with some Nose Profiles, added velocity will equate to added depth of penetration, and of course trauma and destruction of tissue. Some nose profiles react better than others, but if properly designed, then all will get some gain from added velocity, UNTIL you reach the point that you get distortion of the meplat by TOO MUCH VELOCITY. Once you begin to distort that meplat, then all sorts of strange things begin to occur. One is depth of penetration will decrease, stability will decrease as well....... Normally you will only get this at extreme velocities at 2700-2800 fps or more, which in our big bore rifles is somewhat extreme.......... Lead core bullets will be effected in a serious manner at extreme velocities, followed by copper, and then brass........ Nose Profile and Construction & Material are very important for Factor #6.........

#7 Barrel Twist Rate
Barrel twist rate really only becomes a factor when Factor #1 is DEFICIENT....... If the meplat of caliber is undersized, less than 65%, then faster twist rates WILL INCREASE the depth of penetration by increasing the stability of terminal penetration. A 65% Meplat of Caliber can stabilize in slower twist rates of 1:18, or even slower...... I have seen 65% Meplat of Caliber stabilize with ZERO TWIST....... I have seen 50% Meplat of Caliber stability increase with faster twist rates, and have documentation to prove it, several times...... If you are using a properly designed Solid, then twist rate becomes less important, and more important if you are not using a proper designed solid. Fast Twist Rates can also increase stability of even RN Solids of decent design, hardly anything can increase stability of a more pointy RN FMJ.......

#8 Sectional Density
Sectional Density will ONLY BE A FACTOR with two bullets that are exactly the same in every other Factor or aspect. Factors #1 and #2 far outweigh Sectional Density in the terminal performance of Solids. We can take a properly designed 458 caliber 325 gr Solid and far out penetrate in depth and stability a poorly designed 550 gr 458 caliber bullet....... My son recently shot a medium sized elephant at 10 yards, perfectly executed side brain shot, with a 350 gr .474 caliber properly designed solid at 2200 fps. This bullet exited the head on the far side and still may be going for all I know. A 350 gr .474 caliber bullet has a sectional density of .223, and I personally would choose this little 350 gr bullet over the Woodleigh 500 gr RN FMJ at .4725 (ones I have here) any and every day for any mission............

These are undeniable facts, and can be proven over and over and over again in all test work, and these factors have been exercised in the field and have proven themselves in the field, many many times over...... These are the 8 Known Factors of Terminal Penetration of Solid Bullets.................
 
Buffalo bore lists their 500gr load at 1600fps from an 18" barrel. If it actually picked up 50 fps per inch than you could get to about 1900 from a 24" barrel but i doubt thats the case. Standing by what I said, those numbers in the OP seem very optimistic for such a small case.
Sorry, you didn’t initially specify a bullet weight, thought it was their 400 grain mono metal so not really any disagreement then.
 
I have the bighorn armory 500 model 90 and have taken numerous water buffalo and did some penetration testing on a giraffe. On the giraffe i shot thru the brisket up thru the chest broke thru the spine/shoulder girdle and a couple feet into the neck. It was a ceb 400gr solid at a sedate 1750 fps. I can easily get over 2000fps which is plenty. That load has had full penetration thru every water buffalo i have shot it at. Of note those loads are much much more tolerable out of the model 90 than any marlin or winchester variant. It is designed very well. My ph in africa thought it was perfect due to how rapidly it can reload and it will cycle sideways and upside down. According to the logic some use we shouldnt use a 470 or 500ne because a 577 exists and bigger and therefore the better tool. This model 90 doesnt have the power of a 500ne but has a huge advantage on the 3rd shot on as far as follow up speed goes. Ill return to my prize fighting days and stick with the mantra that once one has enough power speed is king.
 
I don't know. If an arrow angers rather than dropping a buffalo, which then kills a PH, let's say a young father with a couple of children, I don't believe I care to know the person who is capable of rationalizing his death as someone who accepted the risk.
I dont know why. If you get into any dangerous field of work you know the risk you are taking on.

And the risk for hunting dangerous game by non standard equipment is it really as high as the risk of a bad shot by someone over guned because there going after something dangerous?

I knew a old bear hunter that would rather you bringing a 243 and put the bullets where they needed to go than a 338 mag.

He singled out the 338 because of the number of them that showed up brand new .
 
I dont know why. If you get into any dangerous field of work you know the risk you are taking on.

And the risk for hunting dangerous game by non standard equipment is it really as high as the risk of a bad shot by someone over guned because there going after something dangerous?

I knew a old bear hunter that would rather you bringing a 243 and put the bullets where they needed to go than a 338 mag.

He singled out the 338 because of the number of them that showed up brand new .
Truth. On my trips to africa ive still yet to see someone shoot large double well. On my first safari the assistant ph couldnt shut up on the lack of capability of my FA 454 and my buff went down with one well placed shot with a 325 aframe at 1600 fps. Pit a finisher in at 5 yds as it was lying on the ground. The next hunter up couldnt shoot his 458 lott well shot too far back and the goat rodeo started 6 hrs and 7 more shots it finally ended. When people say placement is key, there is no but…… after that statement.
 

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Most of my hunts are solo — just me, my rifle, and a good map. Sometimes I tag along with an old buddy for a week in Zimbabwe or South Africa, but more often than not, it’s just me.
Big fan of classic hunting — bolt-action rifles, old-school tracking, and taking the time to really be in the moment.
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