The 243 Winchester for Australian Game

[Peterwho]

Thank you Bob. I would love to catch up sometime. I presume we do the contact stuff via pm. regards

 

[CBH Australia]

@ Peterwho
Welcome mate you are just a round the corner from me at wyong.

Careful @Peterwho Bob is an Avid .243 anti, he's on the prowl for more Tomato stakes.

 

[Peterwho]

I have a second sin to confess - I also have a 9.3x62. I guess they make larger shrub or tree stakes.

 

[Marcos Rodriguez]

@rdog
You make some valid points BUT I personally have seen to much game wounded with the 243 to deem it worth while as a hunting round.
Here are some examples
243, 87gn federal blue box ammo. Bullet passed straight thru a big western grey kangaroo zero expansion.
Hand loaded 87gn VMAX, 3 chest shots to dispatch a mature Billy.
Hand loaded 95gn nosler balistic tip. Pig 1, 30kg weight bullet pass thru zero expansion, pig 2 same bullet exploded on the hide of a 50kg pig not mud encrusted large superficial wound. Pig 3 same bullet actually worked.

The problem with the 243 in Australia is most people select the wrong bullet for the game hunted. Most like the 87 grainers for general use on every thing and suffer failures. Loaded with a good 95gn SST or 100gn round nose it would probably be a fine cartridge within 200 yards for medium game but the majority of people don't see this.

When it first came out in a blaze of glory with Winchesters advertising it was supose to be the best thing to come down the turnpike since buttonup boots and sliced bread. It didn't live up to the velocity chain that Winchester made for it and they lowered the velocity.
I have loaded for a couple of 243s for friends working up to max charges and in no case could I get anywhere near the book velocity
87 grainers managed 2,900 fps in a tikka t3 light and just a tad over 3,000 in another rifle. The 100 grainers were struggling to get 2,800fps out of either rifle,closer to 2,700fps.
Book velocity for the 87s was 3,300 and the 100s were supposed to be 3,000 fps, a big difference.
I was at the range and a gent was trying out his new Sako 243 with factory Winchester 87 grainers and Hand loaded 87s. The factory loads chronoed at a bit over 2,800 and the Hand loads were only fractionally better.
My case is why would anyone want to use a cartridge that can't live up to its claims and advertising hype as a hunting cartridge with projectile that just don't work on their chosen game.
The little 250 Savage and mild mannered 257 Roberts have been around for a lot longer than the 243 and have been doing a better job than it for years but Winchester advertising killed them off and people started using the inferior cartridge because Winchester convinced people this is what they needed.
If you want to use a 243 by all means use it just stop asking me to finish off your wounded animals, I have done it to many time for hunters that are great shots.

One person I used to hunt with had a nice Tikka T3 lite in 243 that would shoot tiny little groups. He was give an old M17 converted to 25/06 that he asked me to look at. I glass bedded it, fitted a Timney trigger set at 2 pounds. That rifle grouped 2 inches at 200 yards. It was over 2 pound heavier than his beloved 243. After using the 25/06 he left the 243 at home and stated the 25 was far superior and killed how he was led to believe the 243 should. He has shot a 14 point red stag and a mountain brumby with it using federal 117grain blue box ammo and said if he had the 243 at the time he wouldn't have taken a shot at either.
Now you can understand my strong dislike for the 243, I just don't trust it and why I love my 25s for use in Australia, the 25s just seem to make Moe sense to me.
Bob

I agree!!!
Some people here in my coutry LOVES the 243, but shot quirurgical shots... A big pig fall in they´re shadow if are shooted in the ear... or in the base of the neck, but with "real hunt shots", mmmmm.... I not shure!
In small game, the bullet destroy the prey... So, for varmint shooters, are great, not for meat hunters...
Even with a .22 in the base of the ear, every middle game can be downed! But... hunteds?
A hunter uses the caliber rifle who allows to the fastest and clean kill as posible even he shot the animal in a bad place
I see many animals run wounded away with the 243 more than witth another calibres

 

[CoElkHunter]

@Dr Ray
You won't be disappointed and will wonder why you didn't do it sooner.

Because Dr Ray has a .270. No need for a .25 Souper?

 

[Dr Ray]

Because Dr Ray has a .270. No need for a .25 Souper?

I think a 258 Weatherby

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Careful @Peterwho Bob is an Avid .243 anti, he's on the prowl for more Tomato stakes.

@CBH Australia
Don't worry Chris just because he has a 243 all is good as long as if we hunt together he doesn't use it.
I will play nicely if I meet him, he doesn't need to worry. I'll even wear proper clothes and leave the broken heel outfit at home.
I have enough tomato stakes at the moment.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I agree!!!
Some people here in my coutry LOVES the 243, but shot quirurgical shots... A big pig fall in they´re shadow if are shooted in the ear... or in the base of the neck, but with "real hunt shots", mmmmm.... I not shure!
In small game, the bullet destroy the prey... So, for varmint shooters, are great, not for meat hunters...
Even with a .22 in the base of the ear, every middle game can be downed! But... hunteds?
A hunter uses the caliber rifle who allows to the fastest and clean kill as posible even he shot the animal in a bad place
I see many animals run wounded away with the 243 more than witth another calibres

@Marcos Rodriguez.
Thanks mate that is what I have been saying for years. To big for small game and not big enough for medium game and most people use the wrong bullet for the game intended.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Because Dr Ray has a .270. No need for a .25 Souper?

@CoElkHunter
We are talking about a 257 Weatherby or a 25-06, a bit quicker than the souper. The souper would have been a great cartridge. As @CBH Australia said it would be interesting if they introduced a 270/308, from the numbers I ran it is pretty impressive for its size.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I think a 258 Weatherby

@Dr Ray
I think you meant 257 Weatherby.

 

[Dr Ray]

@Dr Ray
I think you meant 257 Weatherby.

Yes
My fat thumb
And very early Monday morning

 

[F. Vaccaro]

Which ever one you have close is the correct answer. They are commonly referred to as Ballistic twins.
I do like the 7mm-08

Bob,
.243 or .244? What difference does point 001 make?
.243 has a pretty good following.

Not a fair comparison of case capacity relative to everything else.

Obviously

No doubt but the 7mm-08 is well supported or the .260 is also has factory offerings.

Years ago I wondered why there was no 270 based on a .308 cased round readily available.
Seems viable but I'm not going to spend the extra $ to have something different.

I’d hate to have to try to live on the differences between the 6.5X55, .260Rem, or even the hated 6.5 Creedmoor, Or the 7-08, & 7X57, for that matter.
Ballistics so similar in the two groups that it’s almost flip a coin.
now if you want a 6.5X55 or 7X57 because they have a long well documented history & they are a classical ctg. I’m with you.

 

[F. Vaccaro]

I have talked to two different people up here who use a .243 for Elk. I didn't ask bullet weight.

I should have added I don’t agree with their choice. Deer/antelope, ok, elk I’ll choose larger.

 

[Dr Ray]

I agree!!!
Some people here in my coutry LOVES the 243, but shot quirurgical shots... A big pig fall in they´re shadow if are shooted in the ear... or in the base of the neck, but with "real hunt shots", mmmmm.... I not shure!
In small game, the bullet destroy the prey... So, for varmint shooters, are great, not for meat hunters...
Even with a .22 in the base of the ear, every middle game can be downed! But... hunteds?
A hunter uses the caliber rifle who allows to the fastest and clean kill as posible even he shot the animal in a bad place
I see many animals run wounded away with the 243 more than witth another calibres

I shot a Rusa deer in the heart.
The poor deer had been suffering from a previous wound in much the same area and I am very sure it was a 243 wound

 

[hawkeyesatx]

I shot a Rusa deer in the heart.
The poor deer had been suffering from a previous wound in much the same area and I am very sure it was a 243 wound

From my experience, it could have been a 120 gr Winchester Protected Point bullet from a .25-06!
My shot left a nasty wound like that as well, and if it weren’t for other hunters to dispatch the poor animal, it would have died a horrible, lingering death.


Hawk

 

[Marcos Rodriguez]

@Marcos Rodriguez.
Thanks mate that is what I have been saying for years. To big for small game and not big enough for medium game and most people use the wrong bullet for the game intended.
Bob

That´s right!
But the passion makes te owners blind to the facts!... It´s a shame...
I love to shoot with the 243, but i never prefer them to hunt having another rifle calibers!
So, for the big boars, a good heavier bullet, as the 100 gn Sierra in example, with a good shot placement (neck or head only) makes the job... but the boar don´t pose for the picture!!!

 

[Dr Ray]

I agree!!!
Some people here in my coutry LOVES the 243, but shot quirurgical shots... A big pig fall in they´re shadow if are shooted in the ear... or in the base of the neck, but with "real hunt shots", mmmmm.... I not shure!
In small game, the bullet destroy the prey... So, for varmint shooters, are great, not for meat hunters...
Even with a .22 in the base of the ear, every middle game can be downed! But... hunteds?
A hunter uses the caliber rifle who allows to the fastest and clean kill as posible even he shot the animal in a bad place
I see many animals run wounded away with the 243 more than witth another calibres

That’s because shooters/hunters use a 243 on game that it too big/tough for it

I call the 243 too heavy for light work
And
Too light for heavy work
Sort of in no man’s land

 

[rdog]

That’s because shooters/hunters use a 243 on game that it too big/tough for it

I call the 243 too heavy for light work
And
Too light for heavy work
Sort of in no man’s land

Yes that's a good way to describe it, but i love shooting cats with 75 grain bullets at night with my 243, its a bit like the 22/250 with 55 grain bullets only better. And if a pig shows up it will handle that too.

 

[CBH Australia]

That’s because shooters/hunters use a 243 on game that it too big/tough for it

I call the 243 too heavy for light work
And
Too light for heavy work
Sort of in no man’s land

Bob would say it's neither Fish nor Fowl.

Yes that's a good way to describe it, but i love shooting cats with 75 grain bullets at night with my 243, its a bit like the 22/250 with 55 grain bullets only better. And if a pig shows up it will handle that too.

All hunters like to shoot cats, It makes grown men smile.
I'm sure the .243 is an outstanding performer on cats and has cleanly taken thousands of pigs.

 

[Forrest Halley]

I love how the .243 in neither fish nor fowl. Too heavy, but too light, yet move up to .257 and all if a sudden magic happens. Not buying it.

The .35 Whelen is in the same boat, as is the .30-06 if properly cherry picked. Too powerful and not powerful enough. Hogwash.

Your 9.3 and .375 can also be classed this way. Any cartridge really can fall victim to cherry pickers.

I'm thinking of hunting Oz with Townsend and my .243. I think he'll have a pretty uneventful day as my backup...hahaha