Suppressing a Dangerous Game rifle - 458 lott

[JG26Irish_2]

Did you use a suppressed rifle with red dot the whole time in your career to winning a national championship? Otherwise, I'm not sure how that comment is very relevant to what I said. For the record, I wasn't implying you're a bad shot (I know nothing about you), just that you must not have much experience shooting suppressed rifles with red dots

I only mentioned the precision marksmanship competitions since you stated earlier that I needed more practice. Lack of practice is probably my issue.

I do not use a suppressor at all during my precision competition shooting. It alters the bbl harmonics enough to change the POI. It can be adjusted but, that is just another variable I do not need and as residue collects in the can, the harmonics change. Another unnecessary variable. Albeit a small one.

Sometimes I use a suppressor when shooting practical long range courses where the actual precision is less critical. In a hunting scenario, none of those issues matter much since the little variables get lost in the noise. While I use red-dots in some applications, precision shooting is not one of them.

My DG hunting rig is equipped with a Swarovski Z6i with an illuminated red dot. The other uses a Kahles K16i. The field of view with both of them is very wide and that is when you can see the front half of the bbl in the sight picture but only when at very low magnification. That does not apply to a typical holographic red-dot sight.

As long as the bbl/suppressor total length is not too long it is OK. But, I like to carry hunting rifles using a Rhodesian carry when in the field on a long stalk unless the shot is imminent. It is fast, safe, and comfortable. That places the muzzle toward the ground off the weakside shoulder with a sling. Only works well if the bbl is not too long. I have a rifle or two with very long bbls that make such a carry more cumbersome (i.e 7mm Mag with 26" bbl). Adding any length to the bbl only makes that problem worse. That is my personal bias and may or may not be an issue for other hunters. Different strokes bro. Do what works for you and don't stress about it.

 

[Red Leg]

I find it funny that you assume a hunt must be in SA just because a guy wants to use a suppressor.

You seem very passionate about not using one on DG. We get it, you’re apparently not able to navigate brush with the way you carry your rifle and any additional overall length. I’m glad you found something that works for you. Others are using suppressors and Im glad that also works for them. I’m also glad we have so many options in weapons, optics, and accessories these days.

There are optic options that work well with suppressors attached. Red dots and LPVO for example. In a close quarter situation, one should be shooting with both eyes open utilizing the Bindon aiming concept. Are you familiar? You’ve mentioned that you prefer a detachable scope but what is your preferred optic?

Pretty solid assumption based on my experiences in Africa. It also drives the behavior and choices of the professional hunters. Perhaps your experiences are different? Preferred optic on a DG rifle? Swaro Z6 and Z8. 30 years a combat arms officer in the US Army. I know a little bit about various methods of instinctive close quarters weapons management. Were I using an AR based SBR in suppressed .375 (!) to hunt a buffalo in a stairwell, it might be just the thing. I don't.

You missed my earlier comments, I also find them fairly ridiculous for any stalked game, but especially dangerous game. They are a good option for hunting whitetail from a stand. I suppose they would be equally good potting a buffalo from a blind at a waterhole or feeding station at a put and take operation.

 

[samson7x]

Pretty solid assumption based on my experiences in Africa. It also drives the behavior and choices of the professional hunters. Perhaps your experiences are different? Preferred optic on a DG rifle? Swaro Z6 and Z8. 30 years a combat arms officer in the US Army. I know a little bit about various methods of instinctive close quarters weapons management. Were I using an AR based SBR in suppressed .375 (!) to hunt a buffalo in a stairwell, it might be just the thing. I don't.

You missed my earlier comments, I also find them fairly ridiculous for any stalked game, but especially dangerous game. They are a good option for hunting whitetail from a stand. I suppose they would be equally good potting a buffalo from a blind at a waterhole or feeding station at a put and take operation.

30yrs combat arms officer… wow, thank you for your service. I guess you do know the best way to utilize a suppressor in hunting scenarios.

I didn’t miss your earlier comments. We simply disagree and that’s fine.

 

[generalzip]

I assume this is a game farm hunt in South Africa? No criticism of the choice, but much of that model and experience, excluding the animals themselves, is looking more and more like fenced concessions in Europe or the Hill Country of Texas than the rest of the African continent. Paying by the inch and the use of suppressors are two examples. We had another commentator on this thread drawing conclusions about all PHs using suppressors eventually based upon a single set of observations in South Africa. The continent is a big place.

I also fully realize that suppressors are something of a generational thing. In my day it was tricking out the Model 1911. Next, and is to some extent still, was the tricked out AR. Now it is the suppressor on everything. As I noted above, both my midnight pig and things go bump in the night guns are suppressed. I should also note, I have no issue with a suppressed rifle from a deer stand. Indeed, on many properties, they can be an advantage.

A major part of my aversion to suppressors on a "stalking rifle" - dangerous game or otherwise - is the eventual length. As I noted earlier, in brush, I carry the rifle muzzle down over the left shoulder held by the left hand. The rifle in this photo is a Highland Stalker in Zambia. It comes up instantly - into a hasty sling if needed. It goes anywhere the body goes, and is far less trouble than even port arms with a rifle without a sling. Add any length and it would be digging a furrow with every bend of the knee.

View attachment 688914
On a dangerous game rifle, I want nothing that can interfere with sight picture - instinctive or otherwise. All my DG options have detachable scopes and excellent open sights for a possible follow-up in really tight quarters.

You sound very experienced. But I implore you just once try a reflex suppressor like the ab raptor. Adds maybe 5” and chop a rifle to 20” shoot it and you will start to believe.

 

[Red Leg]

You sound very experienced. But I implore you just once try a reflex suppressor like the ab raptor. Adds maybe 5” and chop a rifle to 20” shoot it and you will start to believe.

I use an R8 these days in order to have a full length barrel in a compact rifle. My other favorite DG rifle has been a Blaser S2 double which is equally compact. I also will not hunt dangerous game without an open sight option for my rifle. I would suggest that due to action length, an R8 would likely be the best option as a starting point for a suppressed stalking rifle.

 

[WI-2021]

I find it funny that you assume a hunt must be in SA just because a guy wants to use a suppressor.

You seem very passionate about not using one on DG. We get it, you’re apparently not able to navigate brush with the way you carry your rifle and any additional overall length. I’m glad you found something that works for you. Others are using suppressors and Im glad that also works for them. I’m also glad we have so many options in weapons, optics, and accessories these days.

There are optic options that work well with suppressors attached. Red dots and LPVO for example. In a close quarter situation, one should be shooting with both eyes open utilizing the Bindon aiming concept. Are you familiar? You’ve mentioned that you prefer a detachable scope but what is your preferred optic?

He assumed correctly, the trip is to South Africa. My experience so far is tree stands, blinds, drives, and some stalking locally. In all of those cases, an appropriately set up suppressed rifle has worked very well. The intent of my post was to relay that experience, not tell others whether or not to suppress their dangerous game rifle. As far as I'm concerned, that's a personal decision. Should I ever hunt DG, I'll base my choice of whether to use a suppressor on all of my experience up to that point and the advice of those more experienced than I. Either way, others may make their own decisions.

 

[mark-hunter]

Suppressor looks bad on classic hunting rifle.
it is clumsy extension of rifle, and not welcome in the bush.
Thats my view.

But if I was looking for a new rifle, and be open for modern solutions, I might seriously consider integrated suppressor. But finding such thing on a rifle in caliber larger then 375 would be very hard.
There already is a lack of rifles in 375 and up on the market. Below is picture from internet, sauer 101, integrally suppressed. Available up to 8.5x55 cal. Not a DG rifle.

 

[HankBuck]

Suppressor looks bad on classic hunting rifle.
it is clumsy extension of rifle, and not welcome in the bush.
Thats my view.

But if I was looking for a new rifle, and be open for modern solutions, I might seriously consider integrated suppressor. But finding such thing on a rifle in caliber larger then 375 would be very hard.
There already is a lack of rifles in 375 and up on the market. Below is picture from internet, sauer 101, integrally suppressed. Available up to 8.5x55 cal. Not a DG rifle.


View attachment 689055

@mark-hunter - I’ve seen some UGLY rifles but that pic you posted is a clear Winner, looks like a Slug gun barrel on a Handicap Stock….it should be sold with a cane & tin cup. I fully agree with You that any Suppressor on a classic hunting rifle looks atrocious, like putting football cleats on a Ballerina.

 

[generalzip]

@mark-hunter - I’ve seen some UGLY rifles but that pic you posted is a clear Winner, looks like a Slug gun barrel on a Handicap Stock….it should be sold with a cane & tin cup. I fully agree with You that any Suppressor on a classic hunting rifle looks atrocious, like putting football cleats on a Ballerina.

You know it’s kind of funny because I bet people said the same thing about rifle scopes when they came out. And yet now everyone uses them and they look “normal” now. It’s just enough time has passed for normalization to occur

 

[HankBuck]

You know it’s kind of funny because I bet people said the same thing about rifle scopes when they came out. And yet now everyone uses them and they look “normal” now. It’s just enough time has passed for normalization to occur

@generalzip - there are some things that will NEVER look “normal”, such as Rosie O'Donnell on the cover of Sports Illustrated Swimsuit issue…Not Now, Not in a 1000 years.

 

[Nomsag]

Integrally suppressed 375 h&h. My 14 year old daughter used to take her buffalo. The set up is based on a Model 70 CRF action. It is heavy and the overall barrel length is 25”, but sound and recoil reduction is great. She is 5 ft tall, and shoots it well.

 

[generalzip]

Nice rifle and buffalo!

 

[samson7x]

View attachment 689118
Integrally suppressed 375 h&h. My 14 year old daughter used to take her buffalo. The set up is based on a Model 70 CRF action. It is heavy and the overall barrel length is 25”, but sound and recoil reduction is great. She is 5 ft tall, and shoots it well.

Very cool and congrats to your daughter!

Who built the rifle and how much does it weigh?

 

[Nomsag]

Very cool and congrats to your daughter!

Who built the rifle and how much does it weigh?

Sws rifles made it. I supplied the action. I’ve never put the rifle on a scale, but it is heavier than my CZ 550 in 404 Jeffery

 

[VertigoBE]

I assume this is a game farm hunt in South Africa? No criticism of the choice, but much of that model and experience, excluding the animals themselves, is looking more and more like fenced concessions in Europe or the Hill Country of Texas than the rest of the African continent. Paying by the inch and the use of suppressors are two examples. We had another commentator on this thread drawing conclusions about all PHs using suppressors eventually based upon a single set of observations in South Africa. The continent is a big place.

I also fully realize that suppressors are something of a generational thing. In my day it was tricking out the Model 1911. Next, and is to some extent still, was the tricked out AR. Now it is the suppressor on everything. As I noted above, both my midnight pig and things go bump in the night guns are suppressed. I should also note, I have no issue with a suppressed rifle from a deer stand. Indeed, on many properties, they can be an advantage.

A major part of my aversion to suppressors on a "stalking rifle" - dangerous game or otherwise - is the eventual length. As I noted earlier, in brush, I carry the rifle muzzle down over the left shoulder held by the left hand. The rifle in this photo is a Highland Stalker in Zambia. It comes up instantly - into a hasty sling if needed. It goes anywhere the body goes, and is far less trouble than even port arms with a rifle without a sling. Add any length and it would be digging a furrow with every bend of the knee.

View attachment 688914
On a dangerous game rifle, I want nothing that can interfere with sight picture - instinctive or otherwise. All my DG options have detachable scopes and excellent open sights for a possible follow-up in really tight quarters.

Just to throw an oddball in. As you mention your main aversion to the use of a suppressor for a stalking rifle, what would you think of the Blaser R8 with integrally suppressed barrel, the R8 Silence?

Not a winner in the looks department, but at 18” of barrel, well within typical lengths I suppose. Not much caliber choice though: .308 / 30-06 / .300WM / 8x57IS / 8,5x55 Blaser / 9.3x62

 

[Datchew]

@generalzip - there are some things that will NEVER look “normal”, such as Rosie O'Donnell on the cover of Sports Illustrated Swimsuit issue…Not Now, Not in a 1000 years.

The magazine would need to be the size of a mainsail.

 

[Red Leg]

Just to throw an oddball in. As you mention your main aversion to the use of a suppressor for a stalking rifle, what would you think of the Blaser R8 with integrally suppressed barrel, the R8 Silence?

Not a winner in the looks department, but at 18” of barrel, well within typical lengths I suppose. Not much caliber choice though: .308 / 30-06 / .300WM / 8x57IS / 8,5x55 Blaser / 9.3x62

I think that would be a great choice for someone wanting a suppressed stalking rifle. But, until it is offered in .375, the 9.3 would be problematic. Because so many countries ban suppression systems, I suspect it will be a while before we see that .375.

 

[HankBuck]

View attachment 689118
Integrally suppressed 375 h&h. My 14 year old daughter used to take her buffalo. The set up is based on a Model 70 CRF action. It is heavy and the overall barrel length is 25”, but sound and recoil reduction is great. She is 5 ft tall, and shoots it well.

@Nomsag: The Buffalo, You, and Your Daughter all look Great !! What a wonderful photo (except That rifle is an eyesore)

 

[chase0109]

It’s a pretty good assumption considering they are only legal in South Africa and Namibia and the number of buffalo taken from Namibia is a very small fraction compared to those from South Africa. All other countries in Africa are a gray area at best to fully illegal in others.

FYI
Suppressor are legal in Mozambique. Plenty of buffalo and other DG killed there every year.

 

[375Fox]

FYI
Suppressor are legal in Mozambique. Plenty of buffalo and other DG killed there every year.

Getting a suppressor into the country and hunting with one doesn’t make it a legal item. I think it would be a gray area at best. I’m sure it has become significantly more common in Mozambique due to the number of South Africans operating there.