Scope and red dot combo

[Scrumbag]

Agree. For hunting as opposed to forced entry, just get an illuminated dot reticle scope with a 1 or 1.5 lower range. Crank it up when you want to shoot far. Simple and no strange cheek welds or aiming techniques.

In someways not a bad idea.

I do like my 8x56 for low light, very few elements, good No.4 ret with a single illuminated dot and great light transmission as very few elements to go through.

Just wondering about making it a bit more versatile.

Scrummy

 

[Scrumbag]

In my former career, they were common. Some guys swore by them; others swore at them. I have always tried to keep it simple. I found a low power scope with an illuminated reticle or dot served me well and eliminated the need for multiple optics.

Very true sir. Just the 8x56 is so good for low light shooting under the moon etc and trying to make the set up a bit more versatile.

Scrummy

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@Scrumbag
Scrummy the 8x56 give 7mm exit pupil for night shooting fixed.
The 1-8×34 set on 5 power is 6.8mm exit pupil, set on 3 power its over 10mm exit pupil so more than enough light gathering power as the human eye can only dilate to 7mm.
Where the problem

 

[Scrumbag]

@Scrumbag
Scrummy the 8x56 give 7mm exit pupil for night shooting fixed.
The 1-8×34 set on 5 power is 6.8mm exit pupil, set on 3 power its over 10mm exit pupil so more than enough light gathering power as the human eye can only dilate to 7mm.
Where the problem

Well, for me, more elements (lenses) in a zoom scope drop transmission a bit and an 8x zoom helps with the detail for a pig on a not terribly bright night.

I get the 7mm argument. Maybe I should just see if I can get a good QD weaver / pic rail and walk in with the red dot and change to the 8x56 in the stand...

Still, will experiment a bit and report

Scrummy

 

[Nhoro]

I tried a Vortex 1-6 red dot scope. At 1x it was as good as a red dot reflex-you could keep both eyes open and just put the dot on the target. So I would go with something like that on a heavy hitter. You shouldn't need more than 6 x magnification for dangerous game and it will work on 1x as a traditional red dot sight. As for running and gunning pigs - well I dont really know-it might lack a little magnification but I am generally happy with low magnification scopes out to about 250 m anyway.

 

[Scrumbag]

I tried a Vortex 1-6 red dot scope. At 1x it was as good as a red dot reflex-you could keep both eyes open and just put the dot on the target. So I would go with something like that on a heavy hitter. You shouldn't need more than 6 x magnification for dangerous game and it will work on 1x as a traditional red dot sight. As for running and gunning pigs - well I dont really know-it might lack a little magnification but I am generally happy with low magnification scopes out to about 250 m anyway.

Oh have no fear, this is going on a deer / plains game chambering

Scrummy

 

[Frederik]

Burris RT6 with Fastfire 3 Reflex.

I helped a good friend of mine sight the above on his Daniel Defense AR. Afterwards got to play with it the illuminated sight inside the scope was good and even non illuminated it was working great. Sighted in the short 16" barrel to be spot on at 50 meter shooting 2" low at 25meter and 3 1/2" high at 100 meters which should give it a zero at 200 meters. The reflex red dot 3MOA we sighted in for close targets at 25 meters and closer.
Also worked great but the Balistic AR recticle was good as well. Lot more practise will make this a superb combo and you are able to shoot night and day for close combat and very quickly.

Would I put this on a hunting rifle? No, but it will work great on a tactical rifle.

 

[Forrest Halley]

This is an interesting idea indeed @Scrumbag . I differ in my setup intentions than you by half the angle. I would run a maximum of 45° offset. THIS comes with an unmentioned bonus of the ability to acquire targets quickly in the RDS and then transition to the scope my flipping the rifle. Guess what you happen to be centered on? The target. Kevin Owens (long time Green Beret and prior to that Irish Special Forces) talked about doing this setting up an AR in a Garand Thumb video. He cited time savings by not having to power scale to combated decreased FOV. I believe it will work for quite a lot of calibers despite what has been said. If the scope and RDS will bear the recoil you're golden. What's missing is the fact that most of us are going to naturally wrap our thumbs over the barrel with the rifle canted at 30-45° as the forestock purchase diminishes. You recoil control will be improved and the stock weld will slightly improve in the shoulder pocket. The only other thing I would consider is dot brightness. You don't want to have it so bright that it blanks out the target beyond or compromise your transition to the scope.

The thing that I would mount on the gun at 3:00/90° or 9:00/270° would be a light or laser of some sort. Weapon mounted lights are great and lasers rule the night. With a pressure pad or well positioned momentary button you have all kinds of options for making hits in low light.


+/- 9:00 mark for insight on optics positioning.

 

[Scrumbag]

This is an interesting idea indeed @Scrumbag . I differ in my setup intentions than you by half the angle. I would run a maximum of 45° offset. THIS comes with an unmentioned bonus of the ability to acquire targets quickly in the RDS and then transition to the scope my flipping the rifle. Guess what you happen to be centered on? The target. Kevin Owens (long time Green Beret and prior to that Irish Special Forces) talked about doing this setting up an AR in a Garand Thumb video. He cited time savings by not having to power scale to combated decreased FOV. I believe it will work for quite a lot of calibers despite what has been said. If the scope and RDS will bear the recoil you're golden. What's missing is the fact that most of us are going to naturally wrap our thumbs over the barrel with the rifle canted at 30-45° as the forestock purchase diminishes. You recoil control will be improved and the stock weld will slightly improve in the shoulder pocket. The only other thing I would consider is dot brightness. You don't want to have it so bright that it blanks out the target beyond or compromise your transition to the scope.

The thing that I would mount on the gun at 3:00/90° or 9:00/270° would be a light or laser of some sort. Weapon mounted lights are great and lasers rule the night. With a pressure pad or well positioned momentary button you have all kinds of options for making hits in low light.


+/- 9:00 mark for insight on optics positioning.

That's very interesting @Forrest Halley

Lot's to experiment with.

Scrummy

 

[Scrumbag]

Hi folks,

Well I did a little experimenting with the offset red dot yesterday on the .22 lr.

For me I found a couple of things:

1) The red dot was better mounted up near the objective bell rather than rearward. Didn't obstruct the bolt directly but my hand tended to catch it
2) I did not like the 45 degree / "1:30" position as that was very much a "chin weld" still, much like 12 o'clock

I did a crude zero and practiced coming up into the shoulder, starting from rifle parallel to the ground with hands in position

This was the best 50 yd "group" (3 shots coming into the shoulder for each shot) free hand.

(Not wonderful shooting by any means but I think something worth spending time on)

ATB,

Scrummy

 

[Forrest Halley]

Hi folks,

Well I did a little experimenting with the offset red dot yesterday on the .22 lr.

For me I found a couple of things:

1) The red dot was better mounted up near the objective bell rather than rearward. Didn't obstruct the bolt directly but my hand tended to catch it
2) I did not like the 45 degree / "1:30" position as that was very much a "chin weld" still, much like 12 o'clock

I did a crude zero and practiced coming up into the shoulder, starting from rifle parallel to the ground with hands in position

This was the best 50 yd "group" (3 shots coming into the shoulder for each shot) free hand.

View attachment 435942

(Not wonderful shooting by any means but I think something worth spending time on)

ATB,

Scrummy

With the red dot I found that it works best for me mounted forward much like you described. It is out of the control space and comes to the eye more quickly.
With your chin weld concern, is it just uncomfortable as in unfamiliar or is there straining of the neck to get to a shooting position?
Also was the offset RDS in the same plane as the scope or was it higher or lower when you flopped it over?