Sabatti Safari Double Rifle

[sestoppelman]

Sort of sad to see the continued bashing of C. Boddington going on here, he left months ago for that. I get the whole bankruptcy thing, but like most here I have no idea the actual story or circumstances. Some just cant miss an opportunity to bash him, seems a little egregious to me.

 

[HushHog]

I'm a new member but a long time reader here. I similarly came across a deal on a sabatti much like this one. AVOID AT ALL COSTS. I bought one, poured about another thousand into ammunition trying to get something, ANYTHING, that would shoot out of it. IFG told me to load above hornady recommended maximum load data. It didnt work. Then IFG told me to use the factory ammo, so I bought some. It didnt work. Then they told me hornady changed their loads and bullets and their rifles will only work with the factory load and bullet you can no longer get. Long story short, they told me to stuff it and sell the gun but there was nothing they would do for me. Mine was a 2015 production. I'm out a good bit of money for a rifle that will not threaten a paper plate at 50 yards.

 

[gizmo]

I'm a new member but a long time reader here. I similarly came across a deal on a sabatti much like this one. AVOID AT ALL COSTS. I bought one, poured about another thousand into ammunition trying to get something, ANYTHING, that would shoot out of it. IFG told me to load above hornady recommended maximum load data. It didnt work. Then IFG told me to use the factory ammo, so I bought some. It didnt work. Then they told me hornady changed their loads and bullets and their rifles will only work with the factory load and bullet you can no longer get. Long story short, they told me to stuff it and sell the gun but there was nothing they would do for me. Mine was a 2015 production. I'm out a good bit of money for a rifle that will not threaten a paper plate at 50 yards.

Is it a 450/400 and do you happen to work for Cooper firearms and is your name Josh Hill?

 

[gizmo]

Cause if you are I happen to know for a fact that The owner of IFG took the rifle I’m talking about and shot a 3 in group with it.

 

[gizmo]

I also have a picture of said target.

 

[HushHog]

Well Gizmo, yes you are correct. And as I mentioned in my post. With ammunition you can no longer get. I was told by James High the current produced ammunition will not work in that rifle. Is this James or Justin?

PS. I also have target of groups shot with current factory ammunition. From Sticks as instructed by IFG.

 

[gizmo]

It’s neither but I happen to know everyone at IFG very well and I talked to James about that today. It shot 3” off of sticks with the ammo (old Hornady) it was regulated with. That is a fact and I also know that you know that.
1) I dont like Hornady ammo anyway
2) I had my IFG Rizzini regulated with a different load as I didn’t buy an older rifle. Nothing wrong with the older ones but it’s not Sabatti’s fault that Hornady changed the load.
3) all double manufactures are having the same problem with the guns that were regulated with that particular ammo and no manufacturer in the world could have foreseen the change or regulate for something that didn’t exist.
4) it’s a small world so trashing people on a public forum and only giving half the story isn’t typically a good idea.

 

[gizmo]

Long story short, they told me to stuff it and sell the gun but there was nothing they would do for me. Mine was a 2015 production. I'm out a good bit of money for a rifle that will not threaten a paper plate at 50 yards.

This is not the case and I know that they paid to have the rifle shipped on their dime to check it. It shoots beautifully with what it was regulated with.

 

[HushHog]

Well Erik, I stated that i was told the rifle would only shoot with Old Hornady ammunition, only after I was told to buy a box of factory to try. When it didnt work James was not surprised and told me that of course it didnt work, hornady had changed the load. If i may ask where did you have your rifle regulated? I talked to Justin on the phone and mentioned about getting it regulated with current, and he said no one in the US regulates. They did not pay for the shipping of the rifle actually. I paid for shipping. James never even offered to pay for shipping. Had i known upfront that the ammunition that is was regulated with was no longer available I would have been able to make an informed decision.

 

[gizmo]

Well I happened to be sitting here with James at this exact second.
My only interest here is that I am a bit torqued off when someone jumps on and starts bashing someone when they have no defense or even know that it’s happening.
I personally have no dog in this fight but...... there are two sides to every story and what I am being told in person differs a bit from what you are saying here. I have seen the targets that’s the reason I can say I know the gun shoots.
I can tell you that I am being told Justin did tell you about a guy that at least did used to re-regulate their guns here in the US. I will, if you would like, get his name from Justin as soon as I am back in town next week. I would also recommend doing a simple google search on someone who re-regulates doubles in the states. I’m sure a simple search may at least point you in the right direction.
It is typically frowned upon for a new member’s 1-3 or 4th post to be an attack on someone. Hence the reason I piped up.
At the end of the day I have no affiliation with IFG outside of friendship and personally owning IFG guns and for the record I have had trouble with an older Sabatti shotgun.

 

[gizmo]

Sorry I forgot to address another question you asked.
My Rizzini was regulated in Italy at the factory with Sellier & Bellot ammo. When I bought it I specifically requested a rifle regulated with something other than Hornady (this was pre Hornady ammo change). The reason is I despise Hornady DG ammo as I damned near ended up as lion crap as a result of junk Hornady DGS/DGX ammo.

 

[gizmo]

This article may help you, it also recommends buying a life supply if regulated ammo when one purchases the rifle.
http://www.buehlercsa.com/regulating-of-double-rifles/

 

[wesheltonj]

No dog in this fight either but you might try here:

http://jjperodeau.com

And I would have him use Norma Ammo, yes it more expensive, but it's excellent ammo.

 

[HushHog]

Erik, I would appreciate that. I understand it is frowned upon. I do have a dog in this fight, although I believe Justin made it clear there is no fight to be had, I stretched and sold possessions to make this deal happen. It was a dream come true to finally own a double, and now what was a dream will be at the very least a grueling slog through the mud that I was not expecting to have to undertake. I would accept reimbursement for my Shipping since you have James right there. Now i get that you are good friends with them, and its natural to want to to defend your friends, but I feel that a consumer (especially of a high end product) should have all the information available at the time of purchase. I purchased the rifle directly from James, and only found out about the factory ammunition issue after several months of working on loads, and after he had told me to buy a box of factory which he then later was not surprised that it didnt work. Would have been nice to know that before buying the ammo. Anyone know where theres a lifetime supply of this old hornady ammo? LoL

Thank you Wes, I'll check them out.

 

[gizmo]

As a double owner, and I’m sure others here will agree, they can be very very finicky as soon as one strays from the regulated load. I’m currently in the process of trail and error loading for mine as I’d like to be able to shoot Barnes TSX’s out of it. We’ll see how that goes.

 

[gizmo]

Erik, I would appreciate that. I understand it is frowned upon. I do have a dog in this fight, although I believe Justin made it clear there is no fight to be had, I stretched and sold possessions to make this deal happen. It was a dream come true to finally own a double, and now what was a dream will be at the very least a grueling slog through the mud that I was not expecting to have to undertake. I would accept reimbursement for my Shipping since you have James right there. Now i get that you are good friends with them, and its natural to want to to defend your friends, but I feel that a consumer (especially of a high end product) should have all the information available at the time of purchase. I purchased the rifle directly from James, and only found out about the factory ammunition issue after several months of working on loads, and after he had told me to buy a box of factory which he then later was not surprised that it didnt work. Would have been nice to know that before buying the ammo. Anyone know where theres a lifetime supply of this old hornady ammo? LoL

Thank you Wes, I'll check them out.

Well all I can say is that I am hearing a bit of a different story. To that point I was not present for the conversations between you and James/Justin so there is absolutely no point in me getting into a he said/he said conversation as I wasn’t there.
I can tell you that I have known James for a very very long time and he is an honest and stand up man. I know Justin but not very well but he has always treated me very well as a client even when I have had problems with the above mentioned shotgun.
I can empathize with you as I know what it’s like to dream of something only to have it turn out to be disappointing in some way/shape/form.
I wouldn’t give up on developing a load. If you are an avid reloaded I would absolutely keep trying.
Also I will do my absolute best to get you that name as soon as I get back. I can either pm it to you or post it here whichever you prefer.

 

[HushHog]

Thank Erik, Either works for me. I am a good (not great but good) reloader. I worked with 8 different powder and multiple loads for each one trying to get something that would work. The only reason I went back to IFG is I have a hunt coming up and had dreamed of taking this rifle. With every load I have tried the right barrel consistently impacted 4-6" right of point of aim, and left barrel consistently impacted 2-4" left of point of aim. Elevation of impacts changed with velocity, but left and right did not. I reached out to Hornady, and of course could not get them to share what the original load for their factory ammunition was; which I expected but you have to try.

 

[gizmo]

I will get that name for you.
I am a moderately decent loader so I’m a bit apprehensive about tackling this task but wth worth a try. S&B softs are great ammo but certainly not something I would hunt buff or giraffe with which is my intention.
They key is to get the right barrel to regulate, the left should, from my very limited understanding, follow suit. Of course the will only print at regulated distance.
There is gunsmiths here in the US that are perfectly capable of re-regulating a gun. Kicker will be doing the homework to find a competent one so your not further chasing your tail.

 

[cal pappas]

Before all this talk of re regulating a double, how about adjusting the load (powder weight and type and bullet weight) to play with the regualtion target a bit? I've only had a 'smith re regulate a double once because the barrels were cut. Every other double I've owned (and it is in the dozens) I develop a load to shoot well. It's worth a try.
Cal

 

[HushHog]

I have been working on loads since I got it and everything has shot in the same area. I have not tried a different bullet yet which I guess will be my next step after the holidays. I have been looking at woodleighs but haven't taken that plunge yet. Working on a budget atm, saving for my trip this fall and trying to get this rifle working simultaneously.