Recommended dangerous game bullets and cartridges?

[ActionBob]

I would not use Hornady or Accubond for cape buffalo There are much better choices. JMO Brian

I would agree but I wanted to use my 113 year old double hammer gun in 450 NE no. 2 3.5" it was regulated and proofed with 480 grain. The only 480 grain bonded bullet i could find at yhe time was the new Hornady DGX Bonded. It appears as though the bullets delivered to me are not bonded or if they are bonded, they are garbage anyway!

 

[ActionBob]

Back to subject.

What do you guys think about Nosler solid bullets for DG (Elephant)?
Acceptable, or not?

Why not? It appears to be an acceptable solid.

 

[ActionBob]

Yes the original Hornady “Dangerous Game Series” DGX was not bonded and had some bad feedback from Africa on dangerous game.
The new Bonded version is printed on the box “Bonded DGX” has gotten very good feedback…

That and being .458 bullets being available in DGX Bonded is why I used them. And that bullet totally failed. I bought 5 boxes of Bonded bullets and a box of solids. Waste of money because not all I can use them for is practice but I'm left trying to find an acceptable bullet to use in that 113 year old rifle. Or only use solids in it buy those need to be a metal clad lead bullet also. Not recommended to run a mono-metal bullet through those old barrels. Ironically I could have used a solid in that head on shot. But had those bonded softs loaded because I was hunting a huge bull in a herd.

 

[ActionBob]

Terrible, if there are no more Swift A-Frame bullets available, hunting in Africa will no longer be possible for some hunters, at least they believes so, but I can calm everyone down !

One can shoot buffaloes with other bullets, including classic SP bullets, also with those from Hornady, bonded or not, the difference is minimal.

Difference is minimal? Bullshit!

Even Tony Marcus who advertised Hornady is on video stating he always uses Solids on buffalo.

IMO that is a terrible choice when such better options are available. Especially when you consider the possibility of pass through bullets killing or wounding other animals.

I'm sure he was using solids because he didn't trust a Hornady soft!

He also quoted the use of solids having been advice from an older hunter telling him that when he was young.... That leads me to believe that in the "good old days" many if not most buffalo hunters used solids whenever possible.

 

[grand veneur]

That and being .458 bullets being available in DGX Bonded is why I used them. And that bullet totally failed. I bought 5 boxes of Bonded bullets and a box of solids. Waste of money because not all I can use them for is practice but I'm left trying to find an acceptable bullet to use in that 113 year old rifle. Or only use solids in it buy those need to be a metal clad lead bullet also. Not recommended to run a mono-metal bullet through those old barrels. Ironically I could have used a solid in that head on shot. But had those bonded softs loaded because I was hunting a huge bull in a herd.

Maybe I am misunderstanding it, but you seem to have shot a buffalo with your hammer gun caliber 450 N°2 Nitro Express and a 480gr SP bullet from Hornady. If It was the case, it seemed to have worked. For this reason I don't understand the Dislike when it comes to using classic SP for hunting. Sure, you don't always have, depending on the Ammo available, the choice of an ideal bullet, but then one has to be consistent and to renounce of shooting the game. Anyone who is willing to compromise should not condemn bullets in advance. I also read something between the lines about FMJ bullets, the next bullet on the critic list.

 

[ActionBob]

Maybe I am misunderstanding it, but you seem to have shot a buffalo with your hammer gun caliber 450 N°2 Nitro Express and a 480gr SP bullet from Hornady. If It was the case, it seemed to have worked. For this reason I don't understand the Dislike when it comes to using classic SP for hunting. Sure, you don't always have, depending on the Ammo available, the choice of an ideal bullet, but then one has to be consistent and to renounce of shooting the game. Anyone who is willing to compromise should not condemn bullets in advance. I also read something between the lines about FMJ bullets, the next bullet on the critic list.

YES YOU ARE MISUNDERSTANDING!

Go back to post 51... catch up on the facts. That bullet was sold as a 480 grain DGX Bonded. It totally broke up and did not penetrate. The buffalo ran for 8 days, charged some plains game hunters. Was finally taken down from a helicopter.

Hornady has proven once again that they have shit quality control and cannot be trusted to deliver what they claim.

And using a bullet that was sold and reputed to be a quality Bonded bullet, why should I have "renounced" taking that shot? It was close, like about 40 yards. Facing straight on. If that bullet had penetrated it would have dropped that bull stone dead in his tracks.

 

[grand veneur]

YES YOU ARE MISUNDERSTANDING!

Go back to post 51... catch up on the facts. That bullet was sold as a 480 grain DGX Bonded. It totally broke up and did not penetrate. The buffalo ran for 8 days, charged some plains game hunters. Was finally taken down from a helicopter.

Hornady has proven once again that they have shit quality control and cannot be trusted to deliver what they claim.

Read what I just wrote on the other topic and hold back with advices and dislike's.

 

[375er]

YES YOU ARE MISUNDERSTANDING!

Go back to post 51... catch up on the facts. That bullet was sold as a 480 grain DGX Bonded. It totally broke up and did not penetrate. The buffalo ran for 8 days, charged some plains game hunters. Was finally taken down from a helicopter.

Hornady has proven once again that they have shit quality control and cannot be trusted to deliver what they claim.

And using a bullet that was sold and reputed to be a quality Bonded bullet, why should I have "renounced" taking that shot? It was close, like about 40 yards. Facing straight on. If that bullet had penetrated it would have dropped that bull stone dead in his tracks.

Bob, was this the "new" bonded bullet or ones from some years back?

 

[ActionBob]

Bob, was this the "new" bonded bullet or ones from some years back?

Yes new Bonded. See my last quote below. Or go back to pages 3 and 4 on this thread.

Here is a picture of a 480 grain .458 Hornady DGX Bonded that completely failed on a cape buffalo.
View attachment 628848

That bull ran for 8 days before finally being darted because the wound was not obvious enough to know for sure it was the right bull. It never woke up. Died under sedation. Massive infection.

The shot was head on, on the nose. The bullet went up the nasal cavity and shattered when it hit the actual cranium. A better bullet would have hit the brain or at least neck vertebrae at the base of the skull.

Yes, I bought 5 boxes January 2nd, 2022 from Midway USA. Only loaded 17 of them out of that box. Also loaded 7 solids. Shot 2 DGX Bonded and 2 DGS just before leaving home and took the rest on that hunt.

Certainly looks like either a quality control issue at Hornady. Or they outright sold the old DGX as new DGX Bonded. Steve Hornady is on TV stating that the only reason they brought out a bonded DGX bullet was because some of their customers wanted it. But then adds that there is no reason for it as there is nothing wrong with the standard DGX.... With that type of leadership attitude, I could see why employees would not worry too much about getting them mixed up. View attachment 628959View attachment 628960

 

[mark-hunter]

Reading all this brought me to a question.

Does anyone test soft points (bonded), or premium expansion bullets on ballistic gel, before going to Africa? Or similar test?

Yes, most of guys develop the load, test velocity, zero the rifle, etc... But testing terminal performance before actual hunt?

(I must say, I did not. I went with reputation of bullet and used swift a frame, but then Hornady also is very famous brand, and failures look like really happen)

 

[375er]

Yes new Bonded. See my last quote below. Or go back to pages 3 and 4 on this thread.

Oh boy....

 

[ActionBob]

Oh boy....

 

[375Fox]

Reading all this brought me to a question.

Does anyone test soft points (bonded), or premium expansion bullets on ballistic gel, before going to Africa? Or similar test?

Yes, most of guys develop the load, test velocity, zero the rifle, etc... But testing terminal performance before actual hunt?

(I must say, I did not. I went with reputation of bullet and used swift a frame, but then Hornady also is very famous brand, and failures look like really happen)

I use water jugs and dig bullets out of the dirt. I also collect every bullet I can from game animals. Water jugs or ballistic gel is nice but doesn’t show what the bullets will do on heavy bone at various angles. Most bullets will give consistent performance in water or gel but only the best like swift A frame will give consistent performance on bone from different angles while hunting.

 

[375Fox]

Reading all this brought me to a question.

Does anyone test soft points (bonded), or premium expansion bullets on ballistic gel, before going to Africa? Or similar test?

Yes, most of guys develop the load, test velocity, zero the rifle, etc... But testing terminal performance before actual hunt?

(I must say, I did not. I went with reputation of bullet and used swift a frame, but then Hornady also is very famous brand, and failures look like really happen)

I used old trophy bonded bear claws on a recent hunt. I found out design is slightly different now. Performance was still ok but not what I’ve seen from the new trophy bonded bear claws. The 2nd and 3rd bullets up from bottom are both from an eland at 250 yards. The only difference was the amount of bone they hit. Ballistic gel unfortunately can’t show that. I didn’t weigh them but a significant difference in weight retention between the two. The 4th bullet from bottom is also a TBBC from waterbuck at about 50 yards.

 

[wildcatter82]

These are the only 4 bullets recovered from my 2020 Zambia safari. All shot with North Fork 400gr from my 416 Taylor. 1st from left is an SS recovered from a croc's neck. 2nd and 3rd are SS each from respective buff. 4th is a PP recovered from a tree after taking a waterbuck. Hippo was taken dry land with FPS....1st shot (body shot was pass through) with follow up frontal shot unfortunately not recovered (and not from lack of effort looking!). Trophy photo taken from the banks of the Luangwa...croc was still in the skinning shed.

Full disclosure I am a partner with North Fork Bullets.

 

[375Fox]

These are the only 4 bullets recovered from my 2020 Zambia safari. All shot with North Fork 400gr from my 416 Taylor. 1st from left is an SS recovered from a croc's neck. 2nd and 3rd are SS each from respective buff. 4th is a PP recovered from a tree after taking a waterbuck. Hippo was taken dry land with FPS....1st shot (body shot was pass through) with follow up frontal shot unfortunately not recovered (and not from lack of effort looking!). Trophy photo taken from the banks of the Luangwa...croc was still in the skinning shed.

Full disclosure I am a partner with North Fork Bullets.

View attachment 631178View attachment 631179View attachment 631183View attachment 631181

Perfect bullet performance. Impressive safari too.

 

[375er]

These are the only 4 bullets recovered from my 2020 Zambia safari. All shot with North Fork 400gr from my 416 Taylor. 1st from left is an SS recovered from a croc's neck. 2nd and 3rd are SS each from respective buff. 4th is a PP recovered from a tree after taking a waterbuck. Hippo was taken dry land with FPS....1st shot (body shot was pass through) with follow up frontal shot unfortunately not recovered (and not from lack of effort looking!). Trophy photo taken from the banks of the Luangwa...croc was still in the skinning shed.

Full disclosure I am a partner with North Fork Bullets.

View attachment 631178View attachment 631179View attachment 631183View attachment 631181

Hard to argue with those results!

 

[Rule 303]

Action Bob, if you can get some Woodleigh's. They are made to work well in old double rifles. Their Solids are a thou or 2 undersize because of the steel jacket, copper clad. As for monometals I know several use the Hydro because it is a bore rider that, in effect has driving bands. So the shank of the bullet is bore size and only the bands engage the rifling.

Mark Hunter, I have not tested bullets in water jugs for a long time. I go off reputation and animals I have shot with the same bullet only in a smaller calibre or actual cal, like a 416 Rigby on pigs. The way the early Hornady DGX blew pigs apart and there was no one exit hole told me they were too soft to use on big game. These were some of the very early jobs, when a box of them cost AUD$120. They also kicked way harder than my home loads and were over 100fps slower, go figure.

 

[CZDiesel]

View attachment 631166View attachment 631167View attachment 631168View attachment 631169

I understand your frustration and I’d be too! And again I believe everything you say but the only thing is I dint see the steel jacket? I’d contact Hornady

 

[Brian]

I am a true believer in NorthFork bullets for anything, however their standard expanding bullet may not give full expansion on smaller ungulates. ( Wildcatter82 please correct me if I am wrong.) If you are using them on the smaller PG try the "Lion" bullet. I think it is called the PP expanding bullet. It will expand better/quicker on the smaller animals.

NF has all the bases covered from small cats to the biggest dangerous game.

Also, Did you know that the ogive. ( bevel on the edge of the nose.) on the NF Cup Point Solid is 13 degrees. This angle was arrived at, through exhaustive testing, as the exact angle to give the largest most permanent wound channel and still feed through a bolt action rifle.

Did you know that the fine driving bands on the NF bullet give excellent internal ballistics and makes the NF bullet good-to-go in double rifles.

The NorthFork bullet and the Cutting Edge Bullet are my favourite bullet for cape buffalo. The CEB solid has the same nose design as the NF solid.
Next buffalo hunt I will be using mostly Peregrine BushMaster VRG3 bullet. This bullet has a plunger in the nose that initiates controls expansion.
I have found that I can adjust the amount of expansion to what I want by adjusting the velocity up or down from 1,800 fps to 2,100 fps. The expansion is always symmetrical. It is a very impressive bullet.

As far as I am concerned the above three bullets are the best for me on cape buffalo.