QR rings loosen when fired?

[rookhawk]

Just a tangent: I installed two QD ring sets today, both reputable options:

Stainless Tikka T3 rings and mounts from Talley

Blued QD mounts on ruger #1 by warne.


The warne are mandatory on a #1 as Talley doesn't make rings for them. The quality is night and day. The warne rings were out of square (front ring, 5 degree angle). Probably okay but I hate tension on the tube.

Bottom line, when possible, go with the $250 Talley system over the $125 warne system if you need the accuracy. Torqued all to 20-30 inch pounds depending on what screw.

 

[Rick Hill]

The guy who mentioned the physics got it right. I was sighting in 3 boomers and used a lead sled and got beaned by a scope flung off a 416 Rigby. Imagine stopping your car from 60 mph in 1 foot - that called a crash. Use a wadded up hand towel behind the butt (check how far the rifle will travel so you don't get scope eye) and pull the rifle tight into the padding. I was using 50 lbs of lead shot think 25 would have worked and stopped the rifle less abruptly. Stupid in retrospect and found this thread when searched. Scratch on head and scope but we are both fine.

Rick Hill

 

[Shootist43]

Rick, there is another thread on AH discussing the use of Lead Sleds with heavy recoiling rifles. You might consider adding your story to that thread. Glad you and the scope only suffered minor damage.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

@Clayton I think the string you up/heresy part would be using loctite on quick detach rings. It's like stapling your underwear on...fine if you never need to remove them again. For QD rings...sorta defies the point!

For non-QD rings, sure you can use loctite. I've found a high quality torque wrench with premium rings and good fasteners, all you need is 20-25 inch pounds applied consistently and nothing will ever move on a rifle 375 and lower.

Nothing is a sure thing if shooting something bigger than 375 off a lead sled due to the forces involved. I know someone that suffered brain damage from sighting in a 416 off a lead sled and getting the scope thrown at his head. He then brought the gun and mounts into Gander Mountain of all places and they said "looks great, must've been loose, you're fine now!" so he went back to the range and put it in the sled again and it flew off and hit his head a second time. Blood everywhere. Weatherby kiss x2. And now the guy has memory issues and the permanent effects of a traumatic brain injury. Point being: If you need loctite to hold stuff together please evaluate what you're shooting and how you're absorbing the recoil as the problem may not be the rings loosening...that may be a symptom of a larger issue.

Now that is scary. I no longer needed any encouragement to not use the lead sled I bought some years ago, but this is certainly fodder for advising against it for others.

Regarding loctite, I think it has its place with the bases. The screws for the bases are pretty short and using some blue loctite as I do, helps keep those in place. I've had far more trouble with these screws going loose than the screws on the rings. In fact since I've started using Warne rings, QD or non-QD, I've never had those screws loosen, but those screws are considerably longer and thus have more bite.

 

[colorado]

I always check my Talley QRs for snugness (almost never have to tighten them and I take the scope off and on about two or three times a year). From the bench I put 35 lbs on my lead sled and my 500 Jeffery with standard loads (570g at 2300 fps), lifts the front of it off the bench and slides it back four to six inches. I know it's hard on the scope but easier on my shoulder. I mainly shoot offhand or kneeling these days, since my load development for soft points is pretty much done. Before hunting season I put three rounds down range at 100 yards and three rounds at 200 yards from the bench, then replicate that off hand. Other than that it's shooting for fun, game or practice.

 

[Rick Hill]

The guy who mentioned the physics got it right. I was sighting in 3 boomers and used a lead sled and got beaned by a scope flung off a 416 Rigby. Imagine stopping your car from 60 mph in 1 foot - that called a crash. Use a wadded up hand towel behind the butt (check how far the rifle will travel so you don't get scope eye) and pull the rifle tight into the padding. I was using 50 lbs of lead shot think 25 would have worked and stopped the rifle less abruptly. Stupid in retrospect and found this thread when searched. Scratch on head and scope but we are both fine.

Rick Hill

I had a look at the scope mounts on the Rigby. There is not an aft locking lug on the scope ring base???? These are headed for the garbage bin and some new Talley scope ring bases are inbound. I don't know who made these bases but you guys might like to check your bases for locking lugs fore and aft!!

 

[Graham Hunter]

I use Leupold QR on my 375 H&H and had them on and off 3 times on my last Safari and have never had a problem and always close enough to zero when I have put them back on. Did a lot of shooting before my last Safari and checked them frequently. Never moved.

 

[Red Leg]

I had a look at the scope mounts on the Rigby. There is not an aft locking lug on the scope ring base???? These are headed for the garbage bin and some new Talley scope ring bases are inbound. I don't know who made these bases but you guys might like to check your bases for locking lugs fore and aft!!

View attachment 192229

The scope recoil force is against the scope base front lug not the rear. The rifle has far more mass and the attached device (scope) in this case exerts its resistance to movement - inertia - forward rather than to the rear.

Feel free to mail those to me bases if you don't want them.

 

[Ray B]

Further investigation showed the rings are Leupold Quick Release Weaver Style. I solved the potential loosening problem by swapping the rings so that the lever is on the starboard side, so recoil force would tend to tighten them. the lever is close enough and up enough to not interfere with the loading/ejection.

 

[nztimb]

Further investigation showed the rings are Leupold Quick Release Weaver Style. I solved the potential loosening problem by swapping the rings so that the lever is on the starboard side, so recoil force would tend to tighten them. the lever is close enough and up enough to not interfere with the loading/ejection.

I always set my scope rings with the QD lever on the loading port side of the rifle for that very reason. They do not intrude on loading and being right handed I hold the rifle in my left hand with my thumb over the scope at its midpoint and loosen (or tighten) the lever with my right hand. I set the levers so they are as close to 12 oclock but tending toward one oclock when they are firmed up. Works a treat.

 

[IvW]

Never had any issues with my QD mounts. None of them have come loose or lost zero after removal and replacement.

Lead sleds are bad news for big bore rifles. If you need to use one you probably need to step down in caliber. A rifle so sighted will also shoot to a different point of impact when shot just from the shoulder.

 

[Rob404]

I have all my QDs levers locking facing Forward on the left side of my rifles, they are out of the way and have never come loose. I own a led but never use it anymore, the nightmare stories of splitting stocks has convinced me.

 

[Rob404]

Just a tangent: I installed two QD ring sets today, both reputable options:

Stainless Tikka T3 rings and mounts from Talley

Blued QD mounts on ruger #1 by warne.


The warne are mandatory on a #1 as Talley doesn't make rings for them. The quality is night and day. The warne rings were out of square (front ring, 5 degree angle). Probably okay but I hate tension on the tube.

Bottom line, when possible, go with the $250 Talley system over the $125 warne system if you need the accuracy. Torqued all to 20-30 inch pounds depending on what screw.

I have a Wheeler Engineering Scope Align/Honing kit that I use for that very same problem, I also use Burris Zee rings with the nylon inserts to help keep the scope from being marked up with up to 20Moa Cams help with problem alignment

 

[Philip Glass]

I hav

Some years back I got a set of Leupold quick Release rings and several years before that I got a set of Griffin & Howe base/rings. They both tightened with a "reverse" thread so that when the lever was situated on the port side of the rifle, the lever was pushed forward to tighten the mount and back to loosen- so when the rifle recoiled, the lever would be tightened. Recently I got a set of rings and the lever tightens with a clockwise turn- standard right-tight, left-loose. Since I would like the lever to be on the port side of the rifle and away from the load/ejection opening, the rings will be subject to recoil that would tend to loosen the rings- Has anyone used quick release rings that tighten clockwise and had any loosening develop from recoil?

I have Warne on my .375 Ruger and Alaskan on my .416 Ruger with no problems. Warne on bolt side Alaskan on left side which I like better. No issues with loosening but I have never taken them off except at home.
Philip

 

[Rick Hill]

The scope recoil force is against the scope base front lug not the rear. The rifle has far more mass and the attached device (scope) in this case exerts its resistance to movement - inertia - forward rather than to the rear.

Feel free to mail those to me bases if you don't want them.

The scope recoil force is against the scope base front lug not the rear. The rifle has far more mass and the attached device (scope) in this case exerts its resistance to movement - inertia - forward rather than to the rear.

Feel free to mail those to me bases if you don't want them.

That is true for the initial movement of the rifle backwards under recoil. Don't forget that after it accelerates it also has to slow with an impact against you. Thats when the scope came off and bounced of my forehead. Those mounts are garbage for heavy recoiling rifles and that is where they are now.

Rick

 

[ZG47]

That is true for the initial movement of the rifle backwards under recoil. Don't forget that after it accelerates it also has to slow with an impact against you. Thats when the scope came off and bounced of my forehead. Those mounts are garbage for heavy recoiling rifles and that is where they are now.

Rick

@Rick Hill Yes ... a recoil buttress is not the same as a recess for a locking lug. A buttress has merit as a backup to a locking recess but what you have shown in your photo is simply stupid (on a centrefire hunting rifle) regardless of lead sled use.

 

[Red Leg]

That is true for the initial movement of the rifle backwards under recoil. Don't forget that after it accelerates it also has to slow with an impact against you. Thats when the scope came off and bounced of my forehead. Those mounts are garbage for heavy recoiling rifles and that is where they are now.

Rick

Now I am tracking. You are correct. If the recoil halt was sufficiently abrupt, it could indeed launch.

I put a set of the Alaskan Arms mounts on my new .275 Rigby, and I am impressed. The base is very substantial, and the locking lugs seem fool proof. The base screws would give way before any part of the mount itself. I am sure they would work very well for a big bore.

I use liquid electricians tape to coat the inside of scope rings. It's black, paints on very thinly, and will prevent any marring of the scope. And a bottle will last forever.

 

[Ernie Shipman]

I have a Merkel RX Helix in 9.3x62 & am using Leupold QR rings, levers mounted on left side. Have fired @ 50 rounds in prep for a hunt this summer in SA & have had zero issues. No issues with zero either.