Post Covid Rising Safari Cost

[Safari1]

Yeah I was really looking at Wyoming between tag decreases and price increases im done

Winterkill was the nail in the coffin.

 

[Doubleplay]

Yeah I was really looking at Wyoming between tag decreases and price increases im done

I'm sitting on 7 Antelope points and I'm very frustrated with how Wyoming jacking up non resident prices and reducing permits.
Antelope special draw went up to $1200!!!

 

[BRICKBURN]

Just for interest I looked up the exchange rate in RSA/USD in 2011 and compared to 2024.
I also collected diesel prices for the same time period.
Assuming:
All correct data. I do not necessarily trust what was posted to the penny.
Of course what you can buy Rand for and what is posted could vary widely.

DIESEL R9.3/L vs R 22.1/L
XRATE: R7.85/1USD vs R19.19/1USD

If an Outfitter actually made ALL his income in forex they are slightly ahead.
This comparison of one input component does not necessarily work across the board.

I sure would not want to be earning in RAND and paying all my bills in RAND.

 

[Doubleplay]

Hi Doubleplay, As far as American hunters being taken advantage of you may want to take a close look at what SOME agents are charging in comparison to what the operator charges. We as a company use no agents nor do we pay any commissions or offer any benefits to any agent. In recent times we had a hunt we did not know an agent was being used. The markup to the hunter was 100%. Unfortunately for his agent the client saw our posted price list then the fight started.

Lon

I understand and respect your business ethics.
However I'm seeing companies advertising different prices for the same hunts in European shows like Jagd & Hund and some others.
Part of it is, they see Americans like cash cows and get away with charging more and the other part is like you stated about the agents here who are doing the hand holding for the naive and clueless. (Present company excluded)

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

Hi Doubleplay, One of these days this what I consider as unethical up-charge is going to blow up. Is it legal yes is it ethical no.

What is going to happen when a foreign client pays his total fees to the agent something goes wrong. Maybe major animal not taken then the client wants the amount he paid refunded, but the outfitter only received 1/2 that amount and I sure as hell do not speak Russian, Hungarian, etc.

 

[CJW]

You are correct sir!… the only young people getting into hunting internationally are those born into generational wealth.

I passed over the wife and kids option and bought a farm instead of a house; if I’d taken the normal family route I wouldn’t be hunting or fishing internationally….. ever!

Having a family has always eaten away at fun money. My point is that in my area for example, in the last 10-15 years, retiring boomers escaping the cities and probably a growing number of remote workers have made it increasingly and almost prohibitively expensive for young buyers. That guy who may have been able to do one or two PG hunts in his lifetime will find it even more difficult when he's paying 200+k for a house with 7.2% interest rate that was 125k just 10 years ago. Lots of year round rural homes around here are being eaten up at a premium merely as summer getaways. One guy I work with was putting offers in on houses that were routinely going for 25k over asking. He ended up buying some land, but building even a small basementless, garageless ranch home is going to run 225+k and most builders are 3+ years out. Another made a comment a couple of years ago that he never though he would be looking at 200k starter homes. 200k won't get you much around here. Mind you that home will also be 50+ yrs old. I just looked at a property that a guy bought at auction for 99k, overpriced. 24 acres with no timber and a 1900 vintage, 1300 sq ft house that needs to be torn down or stripped to the studs and rebuilt. 168k, way overpriced, is current asking. That is ridiculous $$$ for rural acreage around here. There are some cheaper that come up periodically but if you're at work and not glued to zillow they'll be gone before you get home. Don't get me started on the price of lake properties.

A lot of people will say this sounds cheap but we have a limited number of good paying jobs. It's all relative.

 

[Juan Loco]

The cost for dipping and shipping have risen to the point of being a major factor.

 

[wesheltonj]

Does SCI or any other organization offer a fund. To help injured or disabled PH’s

Or guides in the US
Or does any of the countries fees or licensing go to fund injured or disabled guides and PH’s. This may be something to work out between hunters and outfitters. We could start a fee or foundation to help. This may help lower costs for all of us.
If there is already let me know

DSC has a fund for Safari workers that are injured in the course and scope of their employment.

 

[wesheltonj]

. . . However I'm seeing companies advertising different prices for the same hunts in European shows like Jagd & Hund and some others.
Part of it is, they see Americans like cash cows and get away with charging more and the other part is like you stated about the agents here who are doing the hand holding for the naive and clueless. (Present company excluded)

I've seen that pricing in Dollars and Euros. Sometime Dollars are cheaper and sometimes Euros are cheaper. My South Africa Hunt, I paid in the Dollar price in Euros.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Just kidding, but with you being RSA you should be saving quite a bit on electricity these days?

Lon

@Tokoloshe Safaris
As they say
What did the RSA do for lighting before candles
Answer.
Electricity
Apparently things are that bad, and getting like that in Zim according to a friend from church that has Family there.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Almost the same here in the USA.
Food up 50%
Fuel up 50%
Vehicles up 40%
Horses up 100-200%
Parts for anything up 50%
Our hunt prices up “only” 15%

@Scott CWO
Same thing in Australia mate but I think:-
Our HORSE prices have remained stabled or gone down because vet Bills have gone up. So horses are actually getting a bit cheaper.
Bob.

 

[0002S]

With the current trends in regulations, fees and inflation, hunting is going to suffer and ultimately only be available to the very wealthy.

 

[VertigoBE]

With the current trends in regulations, fees and inflation, hunting is going to suffer and ultimately only be available to the very wealthy.

To be fair, hunting overseas has always been a rather luxury product. It is only the last 40-50 years or so where it became attainable for more middle-class people.

 

[0002S]

To be fair, hunting overseas has always been a rather luxury product. It is only the last 40-50 years or so where it became attainable for more middle-class people.

To be real, if that trend reverses, conservation, the industry and the people who make a living from it will suffer greatly. There aren’t enough very wealthy hunters in the world, to support the industry, as it sits today, if the upper middle class stops international hunting.

The price increases across the board will ultimately create an opportunity cost that doesn’t make sense. A 10k ‘deal’ hunt is becoming a 20k+ hunt, all in, by the time the trophy is on the wall. New hunters don’t have an experience to relate to so they will have a hard time justifying the expense.

I don’t fault the safari operator. I feel sorry for them. They make a living off of my ability and choice to hunt. If I can‘t afford to hunt this year, I still eat.

Africa has been getting worse for the last 35 years. Imagine what happens to animal conservation once hunting monies dry up. Not to mention the lives of all involved.

 

[VertigoBE]

To be real, if that trend reverses, conservation, the industry and the people who make a living from it will suffer greatly. There aren’t enough very wealthy hunters in the world, to support the industry, as it sits today, if the upper middle class stops international hunting.

The price increases across the board will ultimately create an opportunity cost that doesn’t make sense. A 10k ‘deal’ hunt is becoming a 20k+ hunt, all in, by the time the trophy is on the wall. New hunters don’t have an experience to relate to so they will have a hard time justifying the expense.

I don’t fault the safari operator. I feel sorry for them. They make a living off of my ability and choice to hunt. If I can‘t afford to hunt this year, I still eat.

Africa has been getting worse for the last 35 years. Imagine what happens to animal conservation once hunting monies dry up. Not to mention the lives of all involved.

Fully agree with your points. When the Western middle class has gone extinct, so will the big 5 in wild Africa.

 

[Tally-Ho HUNTING SAFARIS]

I understand and respect your business ethics.
However I'm seeing companies advertising different prices for the same hunts in European shows like Jagd & Hund and some others.
Part of it is, they see Americans like cash cows and get away with charging more and the other part is like you stated about the agents here who are doing the hand holding for the naive and clueless. (Present company excluded)

i have one price list euro/usd, so actually american are slightly better off if they hunt with me, or europeans can pay in US$ is they choose

 

[Houston Bill]

Just for interest I looked up the exchange rate in RSA/USD in 2011 and compared to 2024.
I also collected diesel prices for the same time period.
Assuming:
All correct data. I do not necessarily trust what was posted to the penny.
Of course what you can buy Rand for and what is posted could vary widely.

DIESEL R9.3/L vs R 22.1/L
XRATE: R7.85/1USD vs R19.19/1USD

If an Outfitter actually made ALL his income in forex they are slightly ahead.
This comparison of one input component does not necessarily work across the board.

I sure would not want to be earning in RAND and paying all my bills in RAND.

@BRICKBURN,

This is great insight and I believe this is why we have not seen safari costs go up as much as others things like fuel, food, electricity, autos and auto parts etc. post Covid. If the USD weakens significantly against the RSA and other African country currencies over the next few years then you will likely see safari costs rise substantially as well. The USD certainly has the potential to significantly weaken globally given the horrible fiscal management of our government but other countries are fiscally mismanaged as well so hard to say what will happen. If China and others are able to displace the USD as the global reserve currency....look out the $ will plummet in value.

 

[flying sailor]

Flying Sailor,

Thank you for your wishes. Today was the first time I have been in a vehicle in many months. My wife and I went to talk to a land owner about doing hunts out of his lodge and on his large concession. The meeting went will and if we do start doing hunts there AH members will be the first to know and I promise never to exceed a 20% margin, wishful thinking I guess.

Lon

I hope it goes well for you! My first hunt was so fine, I know behind the scenes there is a tremendous amount of hard work to make my time there the best possible. I am sure every outfitter wants nothing but the best for their clients. I have worked in some industries where it is not apparent the amount of work on the back side of the operation. I appreciate every moment when I am in the bush. Making plans!