Politics

[Brent in Az]

Good thing they were not briefed, one, or more, of the D’s would have informed the enemy of what was coming.

Democrats have become the party of lawlessness and treason. No doubt there would be a leaker.
I wouldn't give them the time of day.

 

[skydiver386]

I wonder if these Chinese flights were removing key individuals and families or critical components of their nuclear program. Perhaps both.

Mystery of vanishing Chinese military planes: String of long-range, high-capacity cargo aircraft disappears in Iran

Chinese cargo flights, potentially linked to military logistics, have vanished near Iranian airspace, sparking speculation about Beijing's covert support for Tehran amid rising tensions with Israel. These flights, operated by Boeing 747s, disappeared from radar after departing Chinese cities...

economictimes.indiatimes.com

Media in India is all over this. Doesn't look like only Chinese commercial flights, but CCP directed military aircraft also.

You'd have to be pretty tight paisanos to fly into a shoot-em-up and fly out with the World's most wanted pax and prizes.

 

[Brent in Az]

B-2 mission ended up being 37 hours round trip.

 

[Altitude sickness]

I’ll stop whining about 16 hour flights with beverage service.

 

[RLD]

One other bit of data worth noting. No one that matters, neither Russia nor China nor any meaningful Arab state, only democrats are rushing to Iran’s defense.

You mean Saudi, Russia and China have not condemned this action?

I am pretty sure they have.

 

[Red Leg]

You mean Saudi, Russia and China have not condemned this action?

I am pretty sure they have.

Of course - though I think anyone would agree that the Saudi statement, issued by their foreign ministry not the King, is purely pro-forma. Tell me one meaningful action any state actor has taken to help Iran by opposing the US or Israel in this current conflict besides offering platitudes.

Tell you a little secret about the Arab world, it collectively despises and fears the Persians far more than Israel.

 

[Hunt anything]

I agree @Red Leg , I’m going to take most of the Arab state’s statements with a grain of salt. They may condemn the attacks but they will be pleased that Iran cannot produce a nuclear weapon.

 

[Doug3006]

Saudi lives in that tough neighborhood. They don’t want to appear to be cheering the US action, so they don’t become a target of retaliation. Behind the scenes, they must be happy. The crown prince has often said that Iran must not obtain nuclear weapons, and if they do, Saudi would have to get their own.

As for Russia and China, they oppose the US in everything. Xi must understand that those B2s could just as easily have put his 3 carriers on the bottom of the sea.

 

[RLD]

Of course - though I think anyone would agree that the Saudi statement, issued by their foreign ministry not the King, is purely pro-forma. Tell me one meaningful action any state actor has taken to help Iran by opposing the US or Israel in this current conflict besides offering platitudes.

Tell you a little secret about the Arab world, it collectively despises and fears the Persians far more than Israel.

Of course they have not acted militarily. But neither have the Democrats, who you were trying to make a comparison with.

Your “data point” was simply untrue.

There are definately elements of the Arab world that are in conflict with Iran. But they are no friends of Israel either.

 

[Red Leg]

Of course they have not acted militarily. But neither have the Democrats, who you were trying to make a comparison with.

Your “data point” was simply untrue.

There are definately elements of the Arab world that are in conflict with Iran. But they are no friends of Israel either.

My data point was exactly accurate as was my characterization of relative Arab enmity. In virtually every Arab capital of today there is nothing but a sense of relief.

 

[BJH65]

Those Chinese flights in out out of Iran 1-2 days before the U.S. launched precision strikes with the B2 bombers seems too coincidental that perhaps there may have been a leak somewhere? What were on those flights? Perhaps enriched uranium and other equipment that China would certainly have the knowledge and ability to safely transport and store for Iran so they could restart their nuclear weapons ambitions again?

Red Leg (General), I’m curious on your thoughts. To me this seems the most likely reason for those flights. I can see China wanting to help keep Irans nuclear ambitions alive so as to maintain a threat to U.S. interests, keep Iran as a thorn in our sides.

 

[Brent in Az]

Iranian news anchor stated they know where all the U.S bases are in the middle east are located, and they are in reach of Iranian retaliation.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Saudi lives in that tough neighborhood. They don’t want to appear to be cheering the US action, so they don’t become a target of retaliation. Behind the scenes, they must be happy. The crown prince has often said that Iran must not obtain nuclear weapons, and if they do, Saudi would have to get their own.

As for Russia and China, they oppose the US in everything. Xi must understand that those B2s could just as easily have put his 3 carriers on the bottom of the sea.

Doug, I’m sure you’re correct. Xi now knows Trump will follow through.


A minor correction though. The B2 is too valuable to risk, and not the best tool against a carrier group. We have much, much cheaper static and mobile undersea capabilities to deal with the young Chinese Navy.

Then add in another threat. Attack submarine’s and it’s check mate.

 

[LivingTheDream]

Iranian news anchor stated they know where all the U.S bases are in the middle east are located, and they are in reach of Iranian retaliation.

I think this is a bit of a difference in culture and how to posture with Trump. From my understanding (very limited at best), the middle eastern war culture is very much based on posturing and messaging, hence some of the tough talk and propaganda. Just yesterday morning the Iranian Foreign Minister coming out of the negotiations with the EU stated that stopping their missile capabilities was non negotiatable (paraphrasing). And I thought, that might not be the best statement to make with Trump in charge.

As much as we talk about "TACO", Trump has not shown that with regards to situations in the middle east. Though a news anchor, I am not sure, I would be posturing at the moment.

 

[Red Leg]

Those Chinese flights in out out of Iran 1-2 days before the U.S. launched precision strikes with the B2 bombers seems too coincidental that perhaps there may have been a leak somewhere? What were on those flights? Perhaps enriched uranium and other equipment that China would certainly have the knowledge and ability to safely transport and store for Iran so they could restart their nuclear weapons ambitions again?

Red Leg (General), I’m curious on your thoughts. To me this seems the most likely reason for those flights. I can see China wanting to help keep Irans nuclear ambitions alive so as to maintain a threat to U.S. interests, keep Iran as a thorn in our sides.

I do not think anything "leaked." There was an obvious (2-3 week) window of opportunity for the US to act if it was going to do so.

The general on line consensus is there were five flights by Chinese military 747's to and from Iran leading up to the attack. I would suggest that the most likely mission was invacuating Chinese nationals and senior Iranian government/military personnel and families. They may well have also brought in some specialized military equipment (for all the good it did), and it is possible some critical nuclear related equipment was salvaged ahead of time - even enriched Uranium - though that can not be transported casually, and would be difficult to accomplish under the noses of the IAEA.

Still, much of nuclear weapon development is industrial level. It requires large numbers of centrifuges and it requires nuclear reactors. None of that is salvageable with a 747.

Finally, such an action by China would carry enormous strategic risk with regard to the US.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

President Trump did something I’ve been wanting to see done for the last 45 years. Iran used to be one of the Middle East’s most civilized & forward thinking countries until the so-called “Islamic Revolution” there destroyed everything in 1979.

But I am concerned about one thing. Knowing radical Islam as I do, fanatical supporters of Iran & Palestine will probably try to have a terrorist cell inside the US try to do something very destructive on American soil within the foreseeable future (like a suicide bombing or a mass shooting or something). Probably the indoctrinated types that like to riot “Free Palestine !” on college/university campus grounds. And unlike Americans or Israelis, these people like to attack civilians.

I hope I’m wrong though…

I hope you're wrong as well, but I do not think you are.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

I’m sure that all the Sunnis are absolutely heartbroken about recent events…..

 

[Red Leg]

What do I hear about China knocking out StarLink?

They have attempted to thwart its use within its borders, but that is as much a competitive commercial concern as anything else. I suppose they could attempt to hack it, but my money would be on Musk's team in that sort of confrontation. I do not believe they have a realistic technological approach to actually attack a worldwide constellation of over 7500 satellites in low high-speed orbit.

Do you have another data point?

 

[Ray B]

The question re: moving enriched uranium out of Iran prior to the bombing- Since the uranium is highly radioactive would it not have required massive lead containers or otherwise been readily observed by the various sensors? In either case, it's movement would have been observed?

 

[Brent in Az]

It was stated by the talking heads that Iran has/had enough enriched uranium for approximately 10 nuclear bombs.

Where is it?