Politics

[jpr9954]

Please excuse this interruption of our discussion of war in the Middle East but I am being overwhelmed by a feeling of schadenfreude coming from events in The Big Easy.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/soros-ba...ct-attorney-carjacked-gunpoint-mother-reports

I don't think social justice and bail reform is working out the way DA Jason Williams envisaged.

 

[Red Leg]

Let me start saying that I'm not a church goer and don't care much about any religion.
I feel like nature is my church and I believe in the supreme being, call it God, Allah, Shiva whatever.
However having a brother living in Canada, another one in London and having worked with many different religions, I can tell you with certainty that this article is full of lies.
In 2016, Sadiq Khan ran to become the mayor of London and was elected with 57% of the vote. He became just the third ever London Mayor and is London's first Muslim mayor and first ethnic minority mayor.
Remind you he got most of his votes from Christians which makes the %90 of London.
I'm guessing you live in Africa and have no idea how many patriotic Muslim men and women working within our intelligence services at Federal and local level to deter and prevent terrorist attacks everyday.
There are bad people in every religion and I think religion itself is the cause of many deaths and suffering in the course of history, be it Christians killing Jews or Muslims killing Christians, HIndus killing Muslims etc..
However it's a terrible and dangerous and a xenophobic thing to paint all the people with the same brush no matter what religion they believe in.

I think you make a very good point - but the author would agree with you. The vast majority of Muslims are indeed fine citizens of whatever country in which reside. Even in Gaza, Israel faces 25,000 members of HAMAS and perhaps a quarter of a million active sympathizers. The remaining 2 million Muslim residents simply want to get on with their lives. But the 25,000 HAMAS do exist, and they exist as a religious based movement with the goal of destroying the state of Israel. The vast majority of those in Gaza allow the movement to flourish there. I think that fits exactly the pattern suggested by the author.

Something the author doesn't mention, that is equally important is culture. Culture and religion obviously interact, but both can play a major disruptive force when planted in an alien culture like the West.

There is a good bit of evidence that along with the hard working patriotic Muslims who become part of a Western population, there is another group - often represented by refugees - who simply do not assimilate. They tend to congregate in specific regions are parts of cities. Many go to work in the "West," but they remaining firmly living in the "East." I recommend a visit to Vancouver, or Minneapolis-St Paul, or yes, London. These cultural enclaves are growing, not shrinking through assimilation.

The problem with unassimilated groups of profoundly different cultures is that they can become recruiting grounds for movements that are inspired by far different things than the Magna Carta or the Bill of Rights. We all saw the success ISIS had in activating young Muslims not so very many years ago and the effects of those successes in places like Boston.

I think it is a genuine concern, and I think the West generally would be extremely wise to squeeze off the flow of these disruptive cultures until the millions that have already arrived have had several decades to actually become Germans, Dutch, French, or American.

 

[DillonG]

I’m confused why so many people are blaming Israel for Gaza’s civilian casualties in the past week. Israel sent warning via pamphlet text message and bullhorn wherever possible to Gazans. They use a “knock” bomb many times before delivering actual explosives. Hamas and many terror groups promote and have historically used innocent civilians as shields. It is a healthy combination of cowardice and good propaganda, in my opinion.

I don’t think anyone that is living in the West can judge the actions of Israel. I can only imagine what would happen if Cuba decided to perform the same attack on American soil. The US military would act in a very similar fashion to the IDF.

Unless all of the rednecks get the ARs loaded and jon boats pointed toward Cuba first.

 

[Doubleplay]

I think you mischaracterize the piece and the poster, who is indeed from Africa. The piece says repeatedly it refers to the fanatics of religion, in this case mostly Muslim fanatics, but Nazis and others too.
Fanatics of any type of religion can be problematic.
The piece does not paint all Muslims or all of any group as fanatics.
Remember that while not all Muslims are fanatics/terrorists, most terrorists today are Muslim, and their goal is to bring all people to Islam, or kill them if they wont.

The way I see it piece has a lot of false info and religious bias in it.
It's a dangerous way to approach to any issue regarding religion.

 

[Ray B]

a Hamas-run hospital in Gaza suffered an explosion that reportedly left hundreds dead.

blast at the Al-Ahli Arab Hospital, where the Gaza health ministry said more than 500 were killed. The IDF determined the blast was caused by a rocket misfire launched by the Palestinian Islamic Jihad.

Was it determined if the rocket was fired and on course against Israel then malfunctioned and hit the hospital
OR
Was fired from the hospital and detonated as it misfired?

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

Was it determined if the rocket was fired and on course against Israel then malfunctioned and hit the hospital
OR
Was fired from the hospital and detonated as it misfired?

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

 

[Doubleplay]

I think you make a very good point - but the author would agree with you. The vast majority of Muslims are indeed fine citizens of whatever country in which reside. Even in Gaza, Israel faces 25,000 members of HAMAS and perhaps a quarter of a million active sympathizers. The remaining 2 million Muslim residents simply want to get on with their lives. But the 25,000 HAMAS do exist, and they exist as a religious based movement with the goal of destroying the state of Israel. The vast majority of those in Gaza allow the movement to flourish there. I think that fits exactly the pattern suggested by the author.

Something the author doesn't mention, that is equally important is culture. Culture and religion obviously interact, but both can play a major disruptive force when planted in an alien culture like the West.

There is a good bit of evidence that along with the hard working patriotic Muslims who become part of a Western population, there is another group - often represented by refugees - who simply do not assimilate. They tend to congregate in specific regions are parts of cities. Many go to work in the "West," but they remaining firmly living in the "East." I recommend a visit to Vancouver, or Minneapolis-St Paul, or yes, London. These cultural enclaves are growing, not shrinking through assimilation.

The problem with unassimilated groups of profoundly different cultures is that they can become recruiting grounds for movements that are inspired by far different things than the Magna Carta or the Bill of Rights. We all saw the success ISIS had in activating young Muslims not so very many years ago and the effects of those successes in places like Boston.

I think it is a genuine concern, and I think the West generally would be extremely wise to squeeze off the flow of these disruptive cultures until the millions that have already arrived have had several decades to actually become Germans, Dutch, French, or American.

Good points. However assimilation does not happen overnight.
I met old Cajuns in LA 30 years ago while duck hunting telling me they were beaten in the classrooms because they were speaking French(cajun) among themselves.
Remember pictures of NO Irish allowed at the entrance of bars, restaurants..
How long did it take these people to get assimilated in our country?
Point is people becomes less assimilated and more enclaved when they are painted all with the same brush and all called terrorist or sympathizers.
Do you think Hamas will have a hard time recruiting in Gaza in the next decade?
I can't get into specifics but I'm sure as a flag rank officer you how many attacks we have thwarted by the work of people some call all terrorists.

 

[Hunt anything]

I’m confused why so many people are blaming Israel for Gaza’s civilian casualties in the past week. Israel sent warning via pamphlet text message and bullhorn wherever possible to Gazans. They use a “knock” bomb many times before delivering actual explosives. Hamas and many terror groups promote and have historically used innocent civilians as shields. It is a healthy combination of cowardice and good propaganda, in my opinion.

I don’t think anyone that is living in the West can judge the actions of Israel. I can only imagine what would happen if Cuba decided to perform the same attack on American soil. The US military would act in a very similar fashion to the IDF.

Unless all of the rednecks get the ARs loaded and jon boats pointed toward Cuba first.

To some people Israel can do nothing right, they don’t think Israel even has a right to exist. They could watch a hamas rocket launch from a building in Gaza and land on a mosque and say Israel did it.

 

[sestoppelman]

The way I see it piece has a lot of false info and religious bias in it.
It's a dangerous way to approach to any issue regarding religion.

Piece went out of its way to ensure it was talking about fanaticism, not any race or religion in and of itself.

 

[sestoppelman]

I’m confused why so many people are blaming Israel for Gaza’s civilian casualties in the past week. Israel sent warning via pamphlet text message and bullhorn wherever possible to Gazans. They use a “knock” bomb many times before delivering actual explosives. Hamas and many terror groups promote and have historically used innocent civilians as shields. It is a healthy combination of cowardice and good propaganda, in my opinion.

I don’t think anyone that is living in the West can judge the actions of Israel. I can only imagine what would happen if Cuba decided to perform the same attack on American soil. The US military would act in a very similar fashion to the IDF.

Unless all of the rednecks get the ARs loaded and jon boats pointed toward Cuba first.

To further the idea that Israel is the evil party here, the occupier of Gaza, they want them viewed as the monster, so when anything happens, its their fault.
The evidence of the hospital bombing fault was quickly shown to be Islamic Jihad, by intercepted Hamas phone calls among other things.
Blaming IDF gets more traction from the devout and the mostly liberal mainstream media, they jumped right on it.

 

[lwaters]

On the news that drones were shot down that were targeting US bases in Iraq. Maybe Iran.

 

[VertigoBE]

Not fact checked this or figures or anything....so don't give me shit....but to me its pretty true in what's written...and how people in general unfortunately roll over ....

Brilliant read

Antoinette Dick

A German's View on Islam - worth reading.
This is one of the best explanations of the Muslim terrorist situation I have ever read.
His references to past history are accurate and clear. Not long, easy to understand, and well worth the read. The author of this email is Dr. Emanuel Tanya, a well-known and well-respected psychiatrist.
A man, whose family was German aristocracy prior to World War II, owned a number of large industries and estates. When asked how many German people were true Nazis, the answer he gave can guide our attitude toward fanaticism.
'Very few people were true Nazis,' he said, 'but many enjoyed the return of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools. So, the majority just sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us, and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come.'
'My family lost everything. I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies destroyed my factories.'
'We are told again and again by 'experts' and 'talking heads' that Islam is a religion of peace and that the vast majority of Muslims just want to live in peace. Although this unqualified assertion may be true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff meant to make us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the spectre of fanatics rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam.'
'The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history. It is the fanatics who march. It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50 shooting wars worldwide. It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking over the entire continent in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who bomb, behead, murder, or honor-kill. It is the fanatics who take over mosque after mosque. It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals. It is the fanatics who teach their young to kill and to become suicide bombers.'
'The hard, quantifiable fact is that the peaceful majority, the 'silent majority,' is cowed and extraneous. Communist Russia was comprised of Russians who just wanted to live in peace, yet the Russian Communists were responsible for the murder of about 20 million people. The peaceful majority were irrelevant. China 's huge population was peaceful as well, but Chinese Communists managed to kill a staggering 70 million people.'
'The average Japanese individual prior to World War II was not a warmongering sadist. Yet, Japan murdered and slaughtered its way across South East Asia in an orgy of killing that included the systematic murder of 12 million Chinese civilians; most killed by sword, shovel, and bayonet. And who can forget Rwanda , which collapsed into butchery? Could it not be said that the majority of Rwandans were 'peace loving'?
'History lessons are often incredibly simple and blunt, yet for all our powers of reason, we often miss the most basic and uncomplicated of points: peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.
Peace-loving Muslims will become our enemy if they don't speak up, because like my friend from Germany , they will awaken one day and find that the fanatics own them, and the end of their world will have begun.'
'Peace-loving Germans, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, Rwandans, Serbs, Afghans, Iraqis, Palestinians, Somalis, Nigerians, Algerians, and many others have died because the peaceful majority did not speak up until it was too late.' What do statistics tell us: not later than 2051 French will have more Muslims than Christians, The Netherlands to follow just a couple of years later, Belgium probably by the year 2060, and Germany already has over 8 million Muslims which is to say, 10% of its population and every week new ones coming from war-torn countries.
Mosques are mushrooming all over the E. U. receiving construction permits on a daily basis. Go and ask for a church construction permit not even as far as Saudi- Arabia, just start asking in Turkey and you'll feel a hard kick in your butt.
'Now Islamic prayers have been introduced in Toronto and other public schools in Ontario , and, yes, in Ottawa , too, while the Lord's Prayer was removed (due to being so offensive?). The Islamic way may be peaceful for the time being in our country - until the fanatics move in.'
'In Australia , and indeed in many countries around the world, many of the most commonly consumed food items have the halal emblem on them. Just look at the back of some of the most popular chocolate bars, and at other food items in your local supermarket. Food on aircraft have the halal emblem just to appease the privileged minority who are now rapidly expanding within the nation's shores. Why - because they dare in the name of God.
'In the U. K, the Muslim communities refuse to integrate and there are now dozens of "no-go" zones within major cities across the country that the police force dare not intrude upon. Sharia law prevails there, because the Muslim community in those areas refuse to acknowledge British law.'
'As for us who watch it all unfold, we must pay attention to the only group that counts - the fanatics who threaten our way of life, and they do so in the name of God.
Let us hope that thousands world-wide read this, think about it, and send it on before it's too late, and we are silenced because we were silent!!!
Extend yourself and spread the truth.

A refreshing read

 

[Hunt anything]

A refreshing read

More like a scary read, the problem to me is many in the west will sit back and watch it happen.

 

[Red Leg]

Good points. However assimilation does not happen overnight.
I met old Cajuns in LA 30 years ago while duck hunting telling me they were beaten in the classrooms because they were speaking French(cajun) among themselves.
Remember pictures of NO Irish allowed at the entrance of bars, restaurants..
How long did it take these people to get assimilated in our country?
Point is people becomes less assimilated and more enclaved when they are painted all with the same brush and all called terrorist or sympathizers.
Do you think Hamas will have a hard time recruiting in Gaza in the next decade?
I can't get into specifics but I'm sure as a flag rank officer you how many attacks we have thwarted by the work of people some call all terrorists.

My point exactly. It takes time and it won't occur at all if we succeed Balkanizing the country creating permanent self-sustaining enclaves.

I'll preface these thoughts by noting I am Arab speaker (or at least I was - it is a very perishable skill set) and have held a fellowship at the Walsh School, Contemporary Arab Studies, Georgetown. That doesn't mean I know squat but it does mean it is a subject I have thought about over the years. I would appreciate your perspective.

In my view, an aspect of Islam that is uniquely problematic is that unlike Christianity, it has never gone through a reformation. There have been schisms, Sunni and Shia are the best known in the West, but never a reform movement, particularly one tied to something so revolutionary as the Enlightenment.

Much Western culture is in conflict with traditional Islamic social mores. Whether it is women's rights and freedoms, our explicit entertainment, or simply sitting around a really good bottle of wine with friends. There is no Islamic movement yet that would make embracing these cultural norms appropriate for a "good" Muslim. One of the real release valves we have in the West is our broad array of religious options. From fundamentalist evangelicals, to the ceremony of Catholicism, the orderliness of Episcopalian prayer books, the pragmatism of Presbyterianism, or nothing formal at all there is a choice which supports Western culture coupled with being a "good" Christian.

The Jewish faith has had its own reform movement offering the choice of very traditional or very contemporary cultural environments for belief.

It is much more difficult for a Muslim. It is true that a Muslim is allowed to subordinate his beliefs while in Dar al-Harb (the world of conflict) until it or he is returned to Dar al-Islam. But that is a poor base upon which to build a permanent life in a foreign culture. All too often, I think we fail to understand the appeal of the siren song of Islamic revolutionary movements to young Muslims, growing up in a academic or technocrat home, who all too often are adrift from their faith.

I don't pretend to have an answer to this challenge. Of one thing that I think I am certain is that such cultural differences reinforced by a fundamentalist religion will make assimilation a far longer process than for many other groups.

By the way, I was born in Thibodaux, Louisiana and grew up in Lake Charles. I am very familiar with the French diaspora in Southwest Louisiana. Yet, I would argue their challenges are nothing compared to those faced by many Muslims in the West.

 

[spike.t]

Let me start saying that I'm not a church goer and don't care much about any religion.
I feel like nature is my church and I believe in the supreme being, call it God, Allah, Shiva whatever.
However having a brother living in Canada, another one in London and having worked with many different religions, I can tell you with certainty that this article is full of lies.
In 2016, Sadiq Khan ran to become the mayor of London and was elected with 57% of the vote. He became just the third ever London Mayor and is London's first Muslim mayor and first ethnic minority mayor.
Remind you he got most of his votes from Christians which makes the %90 of London.
I'm guessing you live in Africa and have no idea how many patriotic Muslim men and women working within our intelligence services at Federal and local level to deter and prevent terrorist attacks everyday.

There are bad people in every religion and I think religion itself is the cause of many deaths and suffering in the course of history, be it Christians killing Jews or Muslims killing Christians, HIndus killing Muslims etc..
However it's a terrible and dangerous and a xenophobic thing to paint all the people with the same brush no matter what religion they believe in.

I think you need to go back and read it again....its talking about the radical ones and specifically talks about the majority of the people if whatever religion or nationality being not part of the radical behaviour....but ending up in some cases being dragged in and taking part....nowhere does it tar all muslims with the same brush.... and as for Khan I think you will find he isn't exactly too popular these days....and as for where I live or come from....well i do live in zambia....which yes is part of the African continent, but come from somewhere in the European area....so probably know a bit more about the situation regarding some of the things you brought up....

 

[mdwest]

[QUOTE="Red Leg, post: 1129782, member: 656"
By the way, I was born in Thibodaux, Louisiana and grew up in Lake Charles. [/QUOTE]

I spent a lot of time during my youth not too far down the road from there… my mother’s side of the family are all spread around Amite, Tickfaw, Independence, and Hammond.

Wonderful memories… and even better food!

 

[spike.t]

I was going to post a don’t let them run you off post but I’m getting close to being done with some of the rudest people on earth myself.

Mmm...who are they then?...I think if you come out with bullshit its probably going to be called.....

 

[spike.t]

Good points. However assimilation does not happen overnight.
I met old Cajuns in LA 30 years ago while duck hunting telling me they were beaten in the classrooms because they were speaking French(cajun) among themselves.
Remember pictures of NO Irish allowed at the entrance of bars, restaurants..
How long did it take these people to get assimilated in our country?
Point is people becomes less assimilated and more enclaved when they are painted all with the same brush and all called terrorist or sympathizers.
Do you think Hamas will have a hard time recruiting in Gaza in the next decade?
I can't get into specifics but I'm sure as a flag rank officer you how many attacks we have thwarted by the work of people some call all terrorists.

There is a difference between people wanting to assimilate into the way of life in the country they have moved to, and the people who move there and have no intention of it at all.....you say you know about uk and other countries, well I am surprised you don't know about the areas in towns that British women can't walk in without being abused or attacked for how they are dressed, or whatever other reason the Muslim men decide has pissed them off...simply being British and white is enough....forget your naive assimilation ideas it is not going to happen.....simple fact.....

 

[Hunter4752001]

I have no reason to believe anything that comes out of the mouths of the IDF spokespersons. They have a long track record of lying. Unfortunately, US government spokespersons also have a long record of lying in support of the Israelis. Maybe some of our younger members would like to look up the USS Liberty incident were the Israeli navy and airforce tried to sink a US Navy vessel. Both the Israelis and the US were quick to claim an accidental mistaken identity. The few US crew members who have spoken have claimed their signals monitoring showed the Israelis new exactly who they were.

Also it goes without saying that Hamas are even further from being a trustworthy source, the expression 'murderous lying bastards' comes to mind. So this leaves us with that which we can see for ourselves and a lot of unknowns.

Which brings me to a question that maybe some of our more experienced members might comment on. I have seen the coverage of the damage done by Hamas rockets on Israeli homes and buildings, normally a bit of courtyard damage or blowing out a couple of rooms. I have also seen the coverage of the damage to the Gaza hospital. To my eyes the photos of the hospital aren't enough for a definitive forensic appreciation, but it does seem to be an order of magnitude greater. Likewise the damage seems less than that created by the delay fused munitions used by the Israelis to bring down Gaza apartment blocks. Putting aside who said what, or who is the most reprehensible actor, anyone care to comment from the perspective of damage analysis verses capability of known weapon systems. Bearing in mind that the footage indicates a single explosion, not a barrage.