PHASA hearing results

[Moe324]

Many of you seen my post about the nightmare hunt. Today I received this email. I was told this is all the information they can disclose. Needless to say I want to appeal. I feel it's just a slap on the wrist. Has anyone heard ever got such a vague results email from PHASA.

 

[K-man]

Well, congratulations on even getting a reply. Of course, nothing can replace your trip/time/memories.
I am quite shocked they (PHASA) did anything at all. As you know, PHASA has no legal "teeth" other than privilege of membership. Glad to see you at least got some response. Probably need legal help should you decide to go further. Good luck with however you continue. Thanks for posting.

 

[375Fox]

What else do you expect them to do? They are not a legal organization. I’m also surprised they did anything at all.

 

[Rare Breed]

Did the operator give you your trophy fee back? I know it is SA so a package

 

[coreydb]

I agree. PHASA is a professional organization like the NRA. supposedly being a member of PHASA implies your business employs ethical and fair practices.

 

[Jared640]

What else do you want? It was no doubt a nightmare hunt. But he got suspended for 2 years that seams like a big deal.

 

[coreydb]

His membership was suspended but not his business. He can still advertise and book clients. I'd get on the web, post your story and let it dissuade people from selecting him.

 

[sureshot375]

As best I can recall from the thread I think you in some ways contributed to your own problems. This certainly doesn’t excuse the behavior of the PH.

You have trashed them pretty solidly here for all the world to see.

You filed a formal complaint and he has been formally disciplined.

I think maybe it’s time to move on.

 

[mark-hunter]

In my opinion PH will remember this hunt, and will learn his lesson. Any further appeals will not make any difference.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

As best I can recall from the thread I think you in some ways contributed to your own problems. This certainly doesn’t excuse the behavior of the PH.

You have trashed them pretty solidly here for all the world to see.

You filed a formal complaint and he has been formally disciplined.

I think maybe it’s time to move on.

Formally disciplined? Are you sure about that? What offense was the outfitter charged with? Passing gas in the dining room? PHASA won't provide the complainant with details of charges or punishment. That's pretty sketchy. Claiming that South African law prohibits disclosure is ... well ... sketchy in the extreme. PHASA is obviously trying to placate the complainant without putting the Association at risk of being sued by the so-called outfitter. It would not surprise me if the whole thing was a sham hearing.

 

[grand veneur]

I read the initial report of the TS and cannot really take sides.

The PH/Outfitter's behavior reflects a clear reluctance to conduct this hunt, for whatever reasons, but it certainly does not excuse his attitude. The client has taken a risk by booking a cheap hunt where the exact circumstances of how this hunt came about through the mediation of the PHASA are unknown. KoringKoppie Safaris seems to be a normal outfitter according to his homepage, but maybe he was obliged to organize this hunt or he was randomly selected, but he does not seem to have had any desire to do so. Taking your girlfriend with you when you don't know what to expect, is also associated with risks. Unfortunately, there is also a certain amount of self-culpability involved, because anyone who buys something cheap cannot make too many demands.

 

[grand veneur]

The package involved to shoot a giraffe within four days, a short time for hunting more game in Africa. It should have stayed that way for many reasons; to shoot the giraffe only and to accept the outfitter's conditions regarding the trophy's handling. Perhaps this could have saved us a lot of trouble.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Not much self-culpability in my opinion. The outfitter was/is a bona fide lowlife. Speaking that way to the help in front of client's Asian lady was pretty trashy.

As far as the giraffe, I can understand why the PH might take the reins to finish a giraffe. They need to be put on the ground where heavy equipment can get to the carcass. I guess the client gets a shot at it (pun unintended) and after that anything goes. But outfitter should knock something off the price if client can't finish the job.

I don't get too bent out of shape over the food. No onions for me either but if that's what is on the menu, I'll put up with it. Had one sub-contracted outfitter serve up pickled ostrich appetizers which weren't at all appetizing but the lady of the house put lots of effort forward so I ate the stuff. Another su-contracted outfitter made us BBQ lambs tails for dinner main course. Very fiddly and greasy. I went to bed hungry but oh well. Went there to hunt, not eat. He also wanted me to shoot from the vehicle but my PH put his foot down on that. Diplomatically.

 

[GuttormG]

His membership was suspended but not his business. He can still advertise and book clients.

Do we really want a world where one complaining customer shuts down a business?

The decision from PHSA is fair, 2 year probation. More complaining clients and he is probably out the door.



ps-One of my big learnings from hanging on this forum is stay the h..l away from free/donated hunts....

 

[grand veneur]

No matter how, in order to be able to take a stand you have to listen to the presentation of the incident from side of both parties. It is clear that the PH has lost his temper, but I would like to ask him why.

 

[deewayne2003]

I read your LONG report and it’s a shame that a trip was ruined.

I learned my lesson early on with outfitter donated trips; myself and a buddy each bought a donated fishing trip when we graduated highschool.

We talked to the outfitter and wanted to book the trips quick before we went to college at different universities…. My buddy called him and let him know we won the trips in an auction - he would never answer the phone again or return our messages.

Lesson learned early

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I read your LONG report and it’s a shame that a trip was ruined.

I learned my lesson early on with outfitter donated trips; myself and a buddy each bought a donated fishing trip when we graduated highschool.

We talked to the outfitter and wanted to book the trips quick before we went to college at different universities…. My buddy called him and let him know we won the trips in an auction - he would never answer the phone again or return our messages.

Lesson learned early

I wonder if he was using the "donation" as a tax write-off? If so he was guilty of tax fraud when he didn't come through with it. Would have been worth checking into.

 

[RLD]

As someone who has done professional disciplinary hearings (for lawyers, security guards and PI's), as a panel member or adjudicator, let me give you some insight into what we can tell from that notice and what we can't.

The most important thing we can't tell is whether there have been previous disciplinary findings or complaints about that person. That is a big deal. First time offenders are viewed with more of an goal of correction or improvement than punishment or deterrence. If that was his first time before the panel that counts in his favour.

The fact that he pled guilty to some of the charges is also very important. It shows that he was willing to admit that he has done wrong and knows he needs to do better in the future. It is a sign of remorse and accepting responsibility. It shows an appropriate mindset.

I think the punishment is fair if he is a first time offender. He got a long probation and "suspenders" (as we like to say) which is moderately heavy. You need to keep in find that purpose of the tribunal is to protect the public from unprofessional operators, not to deliver justice of any such for you.

I would be willing to bet that even if you appeal that sentence will be upheld.

If you do appeal, please check back and let us know how it turns out.