New 1886 Winchester Miroku .45-70

[CoElkHunter]

CoElkHunter
What caliber was/is your 788
Bob

That scope had been on a .22-250 when I bought the rifle, but I had replaced the scope and have since traded that rifle towards my first large bore .375 Whitworth a couple of years ago. I still have a 788 in .308. It was my son’s first BG rifle and he killed three elk with it using HIS handloaded 165gr Sierra BT bullets. They are/were great, accurate low cost rifles.

 

[sestoppelman]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen You're Australian, so we all think you like the pain.
I'm trying not to laugh. This is getting ridiculous. Now the opponents of the lever gun are protesting .32/20 loads. Say it ain't so!
Those big guns must blast you all back just enough that your man cards slide back into your pockets...however the recoil impulse is slightly different on the crescent plate stocks that it just snakes right into the pocket and whisks away that man card. Before you know it you'll be rubbing your shoulder talking about how that .25-35 really kicks!

Best laugh I had all day and I needed one! Plumbers just left to come back Saturday to run a new main water line, the original gave up today! Be about $4K to the poorer for it!

 

[Fastrig]

I took delivery today of a very nice '86, the so called Short Rifle with 24" barrel. Pre owned but NIB, unfired. Discovered about 10 boxes of .45-70 factory ammo the other day kicking around and reasoned (?) I needed a new rifle to shoot it out of!
View attachment 368730

Congrats, she's a beauty!!!

 

[bruce moulds]

@Forrest Halley
I hate that mongrel bastard curved steel but plate. I would prefer to fire a box of my Whelen loads than my 32/20 loaded with 100grain XTPs and 13grain of 2400. That little bitch just don't fit in my 6 and a half foot 250 pound body at all. The bottom of that curve hurts like a bitch after 6 shots. It's like someone is trying to drive a 6 inch nails into the shoulder with small hammers.
Bob

bob,
just come out with it.
just say what you really men
bruce.

 

[Forrest Halley]

I understand an uneasy recoil and I have a 20 gauge single shot and with certain ammo is a concussion machine. It beat up young me and it gave me a ride some 20 years later. It doesn't matter who shoots it. It just plain makes you miserable. However I am still going to give you guys a ration for complaining.

 

[CoElkHunter]

I understand an uneasy recoil and I have a 20 gauge single shot and with certain ammo is a concussion machine. It beat up young me and it gave me a ride some 20 years later. It doesn't matter who shoots it. It just plain makes you miserable. However I am still going to give you guys a ration for complaining.

+1. My son’s friend had a single shot 20ga and I had a Mosin Nagant M44 carbine. Don’t know which one had the nastiest felt recoil, but I’d rather shoot my .338 WM any day over those. Those straight stock designs plus a lightweight firearm can be brutal!

 

[cpr0312]

Congrats on the new addition!

 

[crs]

SES,
Please cut Bob some slack as he has an upside down perspective in the big booming curved butt plate.

For the record, I still have the chronograph range logs from my first range session with my then new 9.5 pound 1886 45-90 TD with 26 inch octagon barrel. From a bench rest, I fired Cowboy Action rounds (slow and easy) up through good 300 , 325, and 400 grain hunting ammo at 100 yards.
Early on, I determined that mounting the rifle as if it had a shotgun butt with recoil pad was WRONG!
A bit of experimentation showed me that (for me) the secret was to tuck the lower point of the butt plate into my arm pit and all was well. Since then, never a bruise, cut, or uncomfortable shot.


Even with hot DG rounds (450 grain Kodiak FMJ bullet at 2150 fps) the recoil just raises the barrel a bit and then eases it back down on target (which has usually hit the ground by then) .

Maybe this little secret will help Bob handle the curved metal butt plates.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Hah! I forgot that they do it all upside down in Australia. Flip the gun over mate! Put the sights on the sky side. That should solve the problem with the butt plate hurting so much in recoil. Probably do wonders for accuracy too.

@crs your secret was something I had figured out early in my youth shooting for comfort with a T/C Hawken. Totally forgot that from an instruction perspective. Thank you for reviving it.

 

[CoElkHunter]

So, why the curved stock and butt plate anyway? Seems more labor intensive for the builder. Fashion back in the day, misplaced idea of ergonomics, recoil pads and flat butt stocks not discovered yet? Just curious?

 

[7x57Joe]

Very nice rifle sestoppleman! May I suggest the RCBS 45-300 FN running around 1600 fps for a pleasant yet deadly load.
I was taught the curved buttplate was not to be put onto the shoulder as is normal for flat buttplates but, place it just below the shoulder joint on the upper arm. That's how I always shot my Browning B78 and I shot some heavy kickers with it up to 510 grains at 1650 fps. Which wasn't as bad as a 350 at 2100 fps in that light rifle. That old rifle made a lot of meat for me. Sorry for your plumbing woes.

 

[crs]

"May I suggest the RCBS 45-300 FN running around 1600 fps for a pleasant yet deadly load. "
I have a similar 300 grain load with a different bullet for my Beretta 45-70 DR --works well.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

SES,
Please cut Bob some slack as he has an upside down perspective in the big booming curved butt plate.

For the record, I still have the chronograph range logs from my first range session with my then new 9.5 pound 1886 45-90 TD with 26 inch octagon barrel. From a bench rest, I fired Cowboy Action rounds (slow and easy) up through good 300 , 325, and 400 grain hunting ammo at 100 yards.
Early on, I determined that mounting the rifle as if it had a shotgun butt with recoil pad was WRONG!
A bit of experimentation showed me that (for me) the secret was to tuck the lower point of the butt plate into my arm pit and all was well. Since then, never a bruise, cut, or uncomfortable shot.


Even with hot DG rounds (450 grain Kodiak FMJ bullet at 2150 fps) the recoil just raises the barrel a bit and then eases it back down on target (which has usually hit the ground by then) .

Maybe this little secret will help Bob handle the curved metal butt plates.

@crs
Tried that Ann got bitten by the top of the curve. I must have a strange body shape as well most recoil pads are still to short to fit me properly but they do work fine. Being 6 and a half foot and 250pounds has its disadvantages.
Bob

 

[crs]

Bob, it is not unusual for a person of your height to have a longer stock made.
Also, you would likely find my 10 pound 1886 .45-90 to be easy to handle and more your size than many smaller rifles.
If you locate one in .45-90 , give it a try. If you wound a buffalo, you can just crack it's head open with the heavy octagon barrel and save your ammo.
Remember the rifle in Quigley Down Under? He knew how to use that thing for close combat.
as well as lobbing big bullets long range.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Bob, it is not unusual for a person of your height to have a longer stock made.
Also, you would likely find my 10 pound 1886 .45-90 to be easy to handle and more your size than many smaller rifles.
If you locate one in .45-90 , give it a try. If you wound a buffalo, you can just crack it's head open with the heavy octagon barrel and save your ammo.
Remember the rifle in Quigley Down Under? He knew how to use that thing for close combat.
as well as lobbing big bullets long range.

Except he used a .45-110 1873 Sharp's with a 34" barrel. Perhaps you are thinking of another movie?

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bob, it is not unusual for a person of your height to have a longer stock made.
Also, you would likely find my 10 pound 1886 .45-90 to be easy to handle and more your size than many smaller rifles.
If you locate one in .45-90 , give it a try. If you wound a buffalo, you can just crack it's head open with the heavy octagon barrel and save your ammo.
Remember the rifle in Quigley Down Under? He knew how to use that thing for close combat.
as well as lobbing big bullets long range.

@ CRS
I remember the movie it is a good one. Tried a 45/90 in a sharps configuration but it had a straight but plate, very nice to shoot.
Yes I need to have a stock length of around 14 and a half inches.
Bob

 

[sestoppelman]

@crs
Tried that Ann got bitten by the top of the curve. I must have a strange body shape as well most recoil pads are still to short to fit me properly but they do work fine. Being 6 and a half foot and 250pounds has its disadvantages.
Bob

Wimp!

 

[bruce moulds]

there was a lot of crock in quigley down under.
1) he fired repeat shots with great accuracy at long range without wiping the barrel.
with that cartridge he would not have been able to chamber round 2.
2) guys were falling before the sound of the shot reached them.
the bullets were subsonic long enough that the shot would have been heard before bullet strike.
3) the guy that loaded the ammo for him used english 450 bullets.
these were around 480ish gns, while the sharps bullets were around 550 gns.
point of impact would have been seriously affected even at closer ranges enough to clearly miss even large targets. it would have taken a lot of shooting to get new sight settings.
movie makers start new urban myths which become facts in peoples minds and are just plain wrong.
in doing such, they treat viewers with disrespect.
bruce.

 

[sestoppelman]

There is a lot of crock in all movies. My only complaint about that movie is that goofy broad!
The shooting stuff was all great, and btw, a top gunwriter and blackpowder shooter named Mike Venturino was heavily involved in training Selleck how to shoot that rifle and offer technical assistance.

 

[Forrest Halley]

I'm happy that a Sharp's rifle was prominently featured. Who cares about the transonic barrier? It's not like you'd step out of the way. I think that the man with one rifle could figure out a projectile change easily in the course of a day or two.