Myths and Facts of Africa Hunting

[tap]

One other note just so the prices are out there.

Gila area of New Mexico. If you draw a tag an outfitted hunt is $5,000 for a good outfitter, USO, chappel etc.
Arizona elk hunt fully guided is $6,000 on average, Kourey guides, McClendon, Mossback etc all charge this.
Utah elk 9 day hunt is $10,000 for mossback and $7500 for a few other good outfitters.
these are all hunts where you will probably take a 350 or better bull

For bulls less than 300 you can go to colorado and get 5 day fully outfitted hunts for around $3500 plus tag fees and gas and lodging etc. total for your colorado raghorn is about $5,500!

I've shot over 30 elk and even the 315 bulls I've shot in my area with drawn tags still run me about $2,000 just for the hunt due to fuel and food. Face it guys you forgot to add in all those scouting days and one scouting trip to your local mountains rund you $30 for food and at least $150 in fuel per day! I'm sorry but if you saved $300 a weekend and skipped your scouting trips you could easily save up for africa and kill ten times as many animals fast.

Now yes I'm sure some people actually live in the mountains they hunt but thats about as rare as finding someone in africa who will let you DIY hunt.

I have to jump to the side of the fence that says africa is much cheaper.

 

[tap]

Now back to your myths.

My first safari company I used told me and my wife to dress in plain clothing because we didn't want to stand out in bright clothing. They said it would draw undue attention to us and everyone would know we were americans and come after us!

We dressed about as colorless as we could. Then we flew into johannesburg and it seemed there were lots of people that looked like a rainbow vomited all over them.

That was the worst advice I ever heard.

 

[MarcelV]

Thanks Tap, that is a verry insightfull comparison, and that confirms part of my suspision,

It most likely ends up in effort, it is more effort to hunt Africa, and then there is the unknown that
plays a bigger role in the decision than price allone.

Based on this my conclusion is Africa outfitter then needs to find ways to make travling to Africa and hunting less of a effort and a unknown then more people would be comfortable taking the risk...

Do you agree ?

Thank you for the detailed response...

 

[MarcelV]

Now back to your myths.

My first safari company I used told me and my wife to dress in plain clothing because we didn't want to stand out in bright clothing. They said it would draw undue attention to us and everyone would know we were americans and come after us!

We dressed about as colorless as we could. Then we flew into johannesburg and it seemed there were lots of people that looked like a rainbow vomited all over them.

That was the worst advice I ever heard.

Colorless in Africa ????, The Rainbow vomiting is more of a fact, just look at Mandela's favorate shirts..

I agree, that is the worst possible advice... LOL
I would atleast hand it to the Outfitter he was concerned about safety, though that is a bit too much...

 

[billc]

I would say the real fact of why more people do not try africa is no myth.It is a long flight to a country that is really not understood by most of us here in the states.Getting on a plane for 18 hours or more is just what must people do not want to do.Then the cost of flying there hurts it to.Plus I think so many people from the states think there our going to get sick or hurt and be so far away from home.As good as the hunting could be there for most people here in the states they feel the risks out weigh the fun to be had there.Hard to overcome peoples fears sometimes no matter how you try.

 

[enysse]

I'm not going to kid you billc, I don't know hardly one person that enjoys being in a airport and going through the security checks, the delays...etc. The terrible long flight...the first time I went to Africa the plane ride was 23 hours...because of a security risk!

I frankly hate and dread it. But once you are in Africa...you tend to forget it fast!

 

[enysse]

One other note just so the prices are out there.

Gila area of New Mexico. If you draw a tag an outfitted hunt is $5,000 for a good outfitter, USO, chappel etc.
Arizona elk hunt fully guided is $6,000 on average, Kourey guides, McClendon, Mossback etc all charge this.
Utah elk 9 day hunt is $10,000 for mossback and $7500 for a few other good outfitters.
these are all hunts where you will probably take a 350 or better bull

For bulls less than 300 you can go to colorado and get 5 day fully outfitted hunts for around $3500 plus tag fees and gas and lodging etc. total for your colorado raghorn is about $5,500!

I've shot over 30 elk and even the 315 bulls I've shot in my area with drawn tags still run me about $2,000 just for the hunt due to fuel and food. Face it guys you forgot to add in all those scouting days and one scouting trip to your local mountains rund you $30 for food and at least $150 in fuel per day! I'm sorry but if you saved $300 a weekend and skipped your scouting trips you could easily save up for africa and kill ten times as many animals fast.

Now yes I'm sure some people actually live in the mountains they hunt but thats about as rare as finding someone in africa who will let you DIY hunt.

I have to jump to the side of the fence that says africa is much cheaper.

That is hardly the whole cost! Why don't you explain how getting a tag is the true difficulty! And that some of those hunts hinge on being a very good bowhunter in some cases...if you are after a really huge elk. I have been applying in Arizona, Utah and Nevada for forever now...to get a good tag. And I'm a blue collar guy and don't have money to buy a commissioner tag, governor tag, landowner tag, auction tag....and the other ways people get around the public draw. Landowner tag is probably the cheapest and that even that cheap or practical!

If you are going to compare elk hunting Utah in the San Juan to kudu hunting in the Limpopo...you aren't even on the same planet....there absolutely no comparison! The costs are hugely different!

If you are going to compare spending $30000 to hunt elk...why don't you compare it Bongo or Lord Derby Eland hunting in Africa.

 

[James.Grage]

WE are looking at an apple to orange comparison.

When we should be looking for an apple to apple and an orange to orange comparison.

until the two hunts are matched they will never be the same...

so spend your dollars where you want and enjoy the hunt you have booked...

 

[tap]

You both are right in your own opinions. For me my san juan hunt last year was expensive and a good bull was taken but the excitement I get from hunting kudu will always be more than any elk hunt I can go on. For me hunting kudu is cheaper when you compare thrill hunt to another thrill hunt.

If however your passion is not kudu you can easily compare it to less expensive hunts. So maybe you guys are right and at the same time wrong. I guess the apples to apples comparison is in the mind of each hunter. For me I would consider a 58 inch successful kudu hunt for 15 grand a better deal than a sucessful hunt for a 190 inch rocky mountain bighorn sheep for 2 grand.

Thats just me and since I'm obsessed with africa I will probably always justify africa over elk and deer in America.

Hope I didn't offend anyone, maybe its just that I've killed a lot of elk and am not impressed with the challenge anymore. From my experiences the kudu I have taken were on a scale of at least 2x the difficulty of the hardest public land elk hunt I've been on. Keep in mind though that I always tell me ph I want to hunt the areas with the most elusive kudu and thats exactly what I get. I think in 3 trips to africa I've only seen about 30 kudu bulls. 30 bulls in 3 months. I live in South eastern New Mexico and I can go to the mountains on any given day and spot over 30 good bulls.

So I guess this question will never be answered except in the mind of each hunter only.

Tony

 

[enysse]

I would say you are kudu hunting fool Tony, you can join my club any day of the week! (lol).

I love hunting kudu too! But yes, I'd take that $2000 dollar hunt for Bighorn sheep any day of week too. I would like to hunt a monster elk someday, when I draw the right tag.

No offense taken, you love hunting Africa, a there is nothing wrong with that at all. And I wish you the best of luck on your sable hunt and your wifes leopard hunt.

 

[Nyati]

In some areas of Africa, while you are hunting, the lions are also hunting.

Do you get the same excitement when hunting elk ?

 

[enysse]

Hunting elk on well managed land is one of the most exciting hunts in the whole world. They are huge. Their bugles are great to hear. And a large antlered Elk trumps a kudu anyday to me....and I love kudu hunting.

Given a tag to hunt in Utah's best areas, or Arizona 9 and 10 every year...I'd pick the elk hunt.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Hunting elk on well managed land is one of the most exciting hunts in the whole world. They are huge. Their bugles are great to hear. And a large antlered Elk trumps a kudu anyday to me....and I love kudu hunting.

Given a tag to hunt in Utah's best areas, or Arizona 9 and 10 every year...I'd pick the elk hunt.

The sound of bull elk bugling 20 yards away from you with a look of I can't wait to kick your butt is something that any hunter should want to experience. It's addicting and no less fun than any other hunt in my opinion. However, I would never pay for the experience, then again I've lived in Idaho and now in Arizona and don't need to pay anyone to point me to a place to hunt.

 

[sestoppelman]

Tap,

No challenge to public land elk hunting? Try Washington State public land some time and tell me all about it! LOL! Kudu hunting can be difficult, but not like elk.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

In some areas of Africa, while you are hunting, the lions are also hunting.

Do you get the same excitement when hunting elk ?

Sometimes. Though fewer in number and smaller in stature, our mountain lions can be just as deadly. A friend of mine years ago unintentionally called in a cat while bugling for elk. He picked up the cat when he was about 150 yards away. Not having a tag, he decided to back out and head back down the trail he was on. Of course not being stupid he didn't keep his back turned on the critter. The cat decided to follow him. Each time my buddy turned to check on him he was a bit closer and would duck down trying to conceal himself. After two or three times of this, he leveled his 30-06 on him and took him out.

Ruined his elk hunt too. He was hunting in a wilderness area a long ways from a road. It wasn't until the next day he was able to get to his truck. He drove into the closest town to call Idaho F&G. It wasn't until late the next day that the game officer made it to his camp. The next day involved going to the kill site and after some discussion the officer cleared him of any wrong doing and then back to camp. By this point he was out of time for hunting and had to go home.

 

[enysse]

Phoenix Phil, most the U.S. wildlife managament programs to me are run super poorly. But they are run also by people that know nothing about wildlife management. If I go hunting out West, it's because I drew a excellent tag...period. Otherwise I'm saving for Africa.

That's the thing about Africa...for the most part they know how to manage wildlife!

We have too many tree huggers, bird watchers and environmental wacko's in the USA.

Botswana is getting to environmental wacky for me in some ways. They have some great plains game hunting and elephant hunting....but their park management is terrible....again the animal rights got to them.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Phoenix Phil, most the U.S. wildlife managament programs to me are run super poorly. But they are run also by people that know nothing about wildlife management. If I go hunting out West, it's because I drew a excellent tag...period. Otherwise I'm saving for Africa.

That's the thing about Africa...for the most part they know how to manage wildlife!

We have too many tree huggers, bird watchers and environmental wacko's in the USA.

Botswana is getting to environmental wacky for me in some ways. They have some great plains game hunting and elephant hunting....but their park management is terrible....again the animal rights got to them.

No argument there. Idaho F&G was always amazing to me, but I won't get started. Just couldn't understand their wolf "program" at all. Arizona has overall impressed me with their elk management. They made a few decisions this year that had me scratching my head but overall we sure seem to see elk whenever we hunt and of course there are some magnificent bulls.

I can understand why you'd pay a guide to elk hunt if you're not from elk country. If you can't spend time scouting, it can be a very expensive stroll in the woods if you're blind to the area. The difference sometimes between seeing elk and lots of them and none at all is sometimes bewildering. I will be headed up to my elk spot tomorrow to hang up my trail camera and start scouting some new areas within the unit. Last year we spent a lot of time around where I hung my camera. It was amazing to see how many pics I'd get in a week to two weeks between visits. At the same time, it was also interesting in how if that camera was set less than 0.5 mile away in one particular direction, I'd probably get little if any pics. It just didn't make sense as some areas had plenty of food and cover just like any other, yet no elk. Some say elk don't have patterns, and I would highly disagree with that. While maybe not whitetail like, it's not far from it.

If you ever draw down here, let me know if I can help you out.

 

[tap]

Well I can tell u Arizona unit 9 is gonna have some serious bulls in it this year. My wife ended up taking her Navajo Rez bull on the late hunt instead of the early hunt and we killed her bull right on the border with unit 9. The largest bulls we saw had no points left on their main beams but I assure you they were 400 class bulls and there were several of them. However I simply get more excitement out of coming around a corner and there stands a kudu of what looks to be 10 feet tall with 80 inch horns. You look away once to get your ph's attention and look back and he's gone without making a sound. That's what makes me infatuated with kudu. They just seem so mysterious and I can't quit thinking about hunting them. And yes I will be going back to the San Juan to hunt elk again but I will be wishing I was in Africa hunting kudu the entire time. Sorry but I'm a kuduaholic

 

[Code4]

I think people are very scared to try anything new without their hand being held. Humans are naturally scared of the unknown and it is a great survival tool for our species. This relates to the health/travel myth. There is a definant lack of intestinal fortitude in our species.

I am a member of some 'hunting' forums and the number of members who have been to Africa you can count on one hand. Maybe two hands hunters who have been overseas at all. Once you eliminate all the keyboard hunters and BS artists, that is still a very small percentage.

The myth that makes me laugh the most is that it is difficult to get your rifles into Africa. From Australia you need at most two forms out, one form back in and one form to fill in before you get there plus the letter of invitation. They are forms only that need to be completed in a specific time frame that requires personal organisation. Forms are not combination locks with no numbers or poisoned food hidden in a meal. It is not hard to fill in a form. Still, people are either too scared or too lazy or have too much money to fill in their own forms.

There are three qualitys when travelling that will get you out of and into just about anything. Patience, a sense of humour and respect. Some cultures have lost the ability and self control to apply any. I have problems with number one.

 

[enysse]

There are three qualitys when travelling that will get you out of and into just about anything. Patience, a sense of humour and respect. Some cultures have lost the ability and self control to apply any.

I think most people get afraid of officials and authority. But they are people too and realise most of the time mistakes can be made, things forgotten.

Still if I was a Canadian and crossing into the US. Yes, I would have the right forms. We USA residents complain about other countries rules, but ours are terrible too. Didn't mean to ruffle feathers. But some people are hunters and others aren't and they do try their best some days to ruin a hunting trip.

I like carrying my gun on hunts. Some outfitters have very good guns that match my tastes and others don't. It's luck of the draw sometimes.