My Hats off to Hornady

[Eric Anderson]

Research the history of school shootings in the UK. And, while at it, look into Australia’s history, also. 1996 was a particularly bad year in this regard for each, and they did something about it, and it hasn’t happened since.

Murder rates didn’t drop off though. They continued their slow slide downward. So instead of people getting shot up in groups, they now get killed one at a time.

 

[charleslabounty]

And yet I know so many in the UK who spend their weekends shooting, often busting clays with a splendid double. Funny how that works...

Sure Mr. Dolan, huge numbers of Brits out for a day smoothboring with their high dollar doubles, just common folks. Probably not many $300 Mossberg owners in that crowd. (Probably not many $300 Mossbergs on the shelves of the local Walmart’s in the Kingdom.) But then again, I don’t know anyone in England. Only been there once.
And king Georgie probably wished he would have limited the Colonists to smoothbores. After all, why would anyone need to be able to shoot hundreds of yards with those terrible looking Kentucky Longrifles.

I will not take the bait of “most Americans want reasonable gun control”.
We have plenty of gun control laws, and laws about everything. Criminals do not follow the laws.
No, we in the NRA should not give another inch. I read the signs at the antis protests “give us an inch and we’ll take a mile”, “ no guns”, “confiscation”.
I will not delude myself or be cajoled into believing the antis want reasonable gun laws. They want total confiscation and the 2nd repealed and will not give up. I quote Diane Feinstein again, “if I would have had the votes it would been Mr and Mrs America turn them in”.
Maybe, People should ask themselves, why would a politician want the citizenry disarmed.
I know why the 2nd is in our Bill of Rights. It is an essential part of our two core principals, Individula Responsibility and Individual Freedom.
I own two AR style guns. I plink with them, I occasionally compete with them and I hunt with them. I do not own an assault rifle, nor an assault car, nor an assault fork. I have never assaulted anyone.
I have not heard any mocking of the “Parkland kids”.
Nor I have I heard much praise for the student walkout last week in support of the 2nd.
Again, Good Job to Hornady on standing up to the onerous gun laws in NY.
My opinion.
And I am sorry you went through a threat of an active shooter at your child’s school. I can not imagine.

 

[CTDolan]

My fear is that the numbers are not on our side. Despite the fact that there are more guns in circulation than ever, only about 30 percent of the population owns a gun (about 60 percent of the population lives in a home which has no firearms whatsoever). Further (and perhaps worse), only about 5 percent of the population hunts. We are in the minority and in a democratic system (to the extent ours actually is...there is a valid argument against) that is a recipe for loss. Therefore, one must appeal to sentiment (to sway the broader electorate) and this is the beef I have with the NRA as, with regard to the general population, the majority, their hard-nosed stance (which most see as heartless pandering to the gun manufacturing sector) has led to a loss of respect, in some cases to the point of revulsion. The outliers, the radicals on the fringe make a lot of noise and all but it’s the sensible ones in the middle whom we stand to lose if we do not show a willingness to consider alternatives.

 

[Just4fun63]

CTDolan, I can see where you are coming from, but once they get you to agree to “alternatives” and ban or heavily regulate something they won’t stop! They are never going to stop until all guns a heavily regulated and registered.
I’m an ex Californian I watched all the little laws pile up until, when taken as a whole, it is an insult to the constitution.
I watched California bam the .50 BMG because “no one should be able to own a gun that shoots that far!” Well your beautiful Mauser can shoot along ways also. They will come after those “Military Sniper Rifles” as soon as they finish the “Assult Rifle” laws

I have no use for AR-15s; I do own a few but much prefer bolt guns ( old Mauser's )

I don’t support the students who “want to do something “ because they seem to have chosen to go after the NRA and guns and seem to be ignoring all the other issues that lead to that and other tragedies.

I just feel we need to draw a line in the sand and say no more.
Sadly we will loose because they understand media better than we do. They will use those same tactics to go after hunting also.

Sorry for the rant!

 

[CTDolan]

"Sadly we will loose because they understand media better than we do. They will use those same tactics to go after hunting also."

This has been my largest fear (and one of the main reasons I am concerned about the rhetoric coming from the NRA).

 

[Just4fun63]

It should be a great concern for all of us. My boys don’t hunt on their own! They will go with me if I ask but it’s just to be nice to me.
My oldest son says it’s just to time consuming and expensive.
I now live in a western state with a long and deep hunting and shooting heritage.
Every year I read comments from the “hikers” we were hiking and saw a man with a gun and wearing camouflage. I was scared! I’m calling my legislators! They shouldn’t be able to hunt in the National Forest where people hike!

They are experts on using emotions and facts don’t matter, experts on divide and conquer and will use our changing social demographics against us!
Look what they did to the Dr who shot that lion (100% legally)
They scream and shout and whine and riot and vandalize while we act like responsible adults and the media loves it and the politicians cave.

 

[CTDolan]

As long as most Americans continue to consume meat on a regular basis we’re likely secure in our right to hunt (because hunting is viewed as vastly more ethical than confinement agriculture...further, it is widely recognized that hunting license fees contribute much to conservation). However, be careful to not conflate the right to hunt with the right to keep and bear arms! One could easily be maintained, alongside the loss of the other.

As an aside (sorta), I think Aldo Leopold’s “A Sand County Almanac” should be required reading in the secondary school system. It’s an amazing collection of thoughts/observations, recorded by one with a gift for words, by a man who was an unapologetic hunter AND an individual widely considered as the father of modern conservation.

 

[CTDolan]

BTW (very much an aside...my apology), I came across the below the other night. Priceless.

 

[CTDolan]

“As long as most Americans continue to consume meat on a regular basis we’re likely secure in our right to hunt (because hunting is viewed as vastly more ethical than confinement agriculture...further, it is widely recognized that hunting license fees contribute much to conservation). However, be careful to not conflate the right to hunt with the right to keep and bear arms! One could easily be maintained, alongside the loss of the other.“

Again, with regard to the right to own firearms, no analogue exists. In other words, in my opinion, the risk of loss is vastly greater (the tie to hunting being sympathetic alone). This is not of minor significance!

 

[Just4fun63]

Wonder what my .375 looks like. It’s an oldie so maybe......

 

[Jfet]

My fear is that the numbers are not on our side.

So let's change that. The Outdoor Tomorrow Foundation has a year long curriculum that is accepted by many state educational agencies. This curriculum teaches sustainable conservation. A correct interpretation of the 2nd Amendment. The students leave the class with their hunter safety certification and their boater safety certification. 10% of my school population takes this class every year. There would be more if I did not have to teach a human anatomy class. These are standard numbers from schoosl in Texas that offer this course. So in Allen High School in Allen, TX that means 600 kids take this course every year. The Outdoor Tomorrow Foundation will help train teachers and point you to grants and donations that will help your schools to start this class. Let's get this program in Minnesota. The link is below

https://www.dallasecologicalfoundation.org

 

[Dr Ray]

Research the history of school shootings in the UK. And, while at it, look into Australia’s history, also. 1996 was a particularly bad year in this regard for each, and they did something about it, and it hasn’t happened since.

A mass shooting did occur this week in Western Australia.
Now we’ll hear all about tough new gun laws but no one bleated about the other mass murders using a hammer and deliberately burning a house to murders everyone inside.

 

[lwaters]

If the humane society peta and the NRA get their way there wouldn't be any need for them. All are really just lobbyists. All of people make money on this stuff.

 

[PG Veltman]

I guess the concern I have is that the NRA having been too rigid will result in a situation worse than were they willing to listen to the other side.

We start by repealing Roe v Wade and limiting welfare. 30 years later human life and the family unit will matter again. Fathers used to teach sons about firearms.
When people have to be personally responsible for their actions, they will think before they act.

 

[Don458]

I guess the concern I have is that the NRA having been too rigid will result in a situation worse than were they willing to listen to the other side.

You state too rigid a stance , the NRA is here for us To protect our American rights not to act on emotions or a knee jerk reaction as the left does to implement ridiculous regulations. The other side will do what ever possible to take everything away from us . If you do not believe that than i am sorry When I first read your post I looked to see where you were ? Where you lived i was sure you did not live in America I don’t mean this to insult you but there is a movement here in the US to disarm everyone So when one reads this,Especially on a Hunting Forum i have to ask why would you take the side of people who do not know or acknowledge the difference between a semi auto rifle and an M4 military rifle.

 

[Don458]

"Sadly we will loose because they understand media better than we do. They will use those same tactics to go after hunting also."

This has been my largest fear (and one of the main reasons I am concerned about the rhetoric coming from the NRA).

Again. Rhetoric? Really. As far as i have researched Facts do not lie. Only people who cannot deal with facts lie.

 

[CTDolan]

You state too rigid a stance , the NRA is here for us To protect our American rights not to act on emotions or a knee jerk reaction as the left does to implement ridiculous regulations. The other side will do what ever possible to take everything away from us . If you do not believe that than i am sorry When I first read your post I looked to see where you were ? Where you lived i was sure you did not live in America I don’t mean this to insult you but there is a movement here in the US to disarm everyone So when one reads this,Especially on a Hunting Forum i have to ask why would you take the side of people who do not know or acknowledge the difference between a semi auto rifle and an M4 military rifle.

My opinion? The NRA is here to serve the gun manufacturing sector, not common people such as you or I (assuming you are, of course).

If you want to appeal to facts (the true, historically embedded facts, not some post-modern, self-serving interpretation) research the history of the Second Amendment.

Truth always rises to the surface and makes itself unquestionably known, given time. In other words, to pretend, no matter the “convenience”, is to cheat opportunity (in other words, to pretend is to fall prey to blind hope).

 

[Don458]

My opinion? The NRA is here to serve the gun manufacturing sector, not common people such as you or I (assuming you are, of course).

If you want to appeal to facts (the true, historically embedded facts, not some post-modern, self-serving interpretation) research the history of the Second Amendment.

Truth always rises to the surface and makes itself unquestionably known, given time. In other words, to pretend, no matter the “convenience”, is to cheat opportunity (in other words, to pretend is to fall prey to blind hope).

Ok research the history of the 2nd amendment ? So you are interpreting it how ? People should not have a right to keeps arms ? The people of the New Nation were not protecting themselves from an overreaching and encroaching Tyrannical government? Hunting and the 2nd amend have nothing to do with each other.

 

[Don458]

My opinion? The NRA is here to serve the gun manufacturing sector, not common people such as you or I (assuming you are, of course).

If you want to appeal to facts (the true, historically embedded facts, not some post-modern, self-serving interpretation) research the history of the Second Amendment.

Truth always rises to the surface and makes itself unquestionably known, given time. In other words, to pretend, no matter the “convenience”, is to cheat opportunity (in other words, to pretend is to fall prey to blind hope).

I would like to bring up operation Fast snd Furious. The American government under the Obama Administration gave weapons (military grade weapons) to the Mexican Drug cartel in an attempt to blame it on the 2nd amendment as being a Reason to eliminate the 2nd . It was not denied by them the A G refused to answer questions about it and was held in contempt of court . Holder has repeatedly stated in past his beliefs that no citizen should have firearms. This all backfired on them when a Border agent was killed. This is the reason(example) our founding fathers had in mind . So if it cannot be done in one fast confiscation, they do it in all pieces. Slowly making people think it’s an object that causes these disasters.

 

[charleslabounty]

My opinion? The NRA is here to serve the gun manufacturing sector, not common people such as you or I (assuming you are, of course).

If you want to appeal to facts (the true, historically embedded facts, not some post-modern, self-serving interpretation) research the history of the Second Amendment.

Truth always rises to the surface and makes itself unquestionably known, given time. In other words, to pretend, no matter the “convenience”, is to cheat opportunity (in other words, to pretend is to fall prey to blind hope).

Mr. Dolan, would you please state specific actions you believe the NRA and we members should take.
Also, please state what personal gun law ownership changes you believe the federal government should enact near term. Please be specific and concise as possible.
(I promise to try and refrain from making a sarcastic reply.)
I probably won’t agree with you, but at least I’ll know what is on you mind.
Thanks.