Mauser M98 Magnum VS Dakota Model 76 African

[Aussie_Hunter]

Have you ever considered a Heym Express Martini? They are built as well or better than any bolt gun out there. They are also available in 450 Rigby. I have one in 404 Jeffery. It's an extremely functional work of art.

@TOBY458 I certainly have considered them, especially after seeing your 404. The only thing putting me off the Heym is the price, they seem to be significantly higher in price here in Australia than the other brands mentioned.

 

[TOBY458]

@TOBY458 I certainly have considered them, especially after seeing your 404. The only thing putting me off the Heym is the price, they seem to be significantly higher in price here in Australia than the other brands mentioned.

I wonder if you have a Heym rep in Australia? If not, that might be whey they're so much higher priced over there.

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

I wonder if you have a Heym rep in Australia? If not, that might be whey they're so much higher priced over there.

Mate I doubt there would be a rep here inAustralia. There is a distributor but how much effort they actually put into selling the product would be fairly minimal I would say.

 

[One Day...]

Mauser 98 of course, but they are in the US about $2,000 more expensive ($11k) than the Dakota 76 African ($9k).

If you are going to spend this kind of money, you might as well go Mauser. In my opinion (others may differ) the Dakota is significantly overpriced, considering it is but a glorified Winchester 70. Not a bad rifle mind you, but where are the $7,000 value differential compared to a $2,000 Win 70?

Having handled both, I can vouch that the Mauser is definitely heavier built than the Dakota. Whether it is necessary for rifle robustness is debatable, but I can assure you that a Dakota 76 African weighing in at 7 1/2 lbs in any of the DG calibers is significantly too light. The Mauser 98 weighing in at 10+ lbs makes entire sense.

All this being said, if it is to be a hunting rifle (as opposed to a safe queen) I would personally buy a CZ 550 .416 Rigby for $1,500; re-bore or re-barrel it to .450 for another $1,000; and give it a B&C Kevlar stock and a AHR upgrade #2 for another $2,000. That would give me a Mauser 98 functional equivalent for $4,500 and I would use the $7,000 balance to get a second buffalo on my next safari

If it is to be a gun library adoration piece, then beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

 

[Hank2211]

A few observations/thoughts

.450 Rigby
- Proprietary cartridge - therefore, likely to die off it seems

I won't comment on the proprietary bit, since that's been done (!), but I do think the last part of the comment is worth of some reflection.

I have no inside information, but I'd suggest there is no evidence that the .450 Rigby is likely to die off. I know a number of African PH's who use the calibre, and many load their own ammo. I believe it's actually becoming more popular as a relatively manageable charge stopper. So I wouldn't let that influence my decision at all.

Having said that, I'm not an expert in ballistics. Both calibres will do whatever you need them to do (in terms of killing anything on the planet) with some room left over. I'd say since the OP already has a .458 Lott, he'd do better to get a different calibre. I don't find multiple guns in the same calibre that exciting, to say the least, and when it's happened, one or the other has left home permanently. Dakota makes an excellent rifle, but my advice is to get the .450 Rigby in a Mauser action. I won't say it's traditional (the .450 has been around for about 30 years or so), but the Mauser certainly is, and I would think has better resale value than Dakota (as good as Dakota is).

 

[Tanks]

...
.450 Rigby
- Proprietary cartridge - therefore, likely to die off it seems
...

If one is a reloader then what difference does it make. All my DG rifles are wildcats (.416 B&M, .458 B&M and .500 MDM), I'd guess there are maybe a hundred of us that use the B&M family of rifles. Most likely a lot less than the .450 Rigby guys.

Also, .450 Dakota is the proprietary cartridge for sure, .450 Rigby is regulated by CIP so I don't think it is a proprietary cartridge.

 

[Tanks]

...

All this being said, if it is to be a hunting rifle (as opposed to a safe queen) I would personally buy a CZ 550 .416 Rigby for $1,500; re-bore or re-barrel it to .450 for another $1,000; and give it a B&C Kevlar stock and a AHR upgrade #2 for another $2,000. That would give me a Mauser 98 functional equivalent for $4,500 and I would use the $7,000 balance to get a second buffalo on my next safari
...

I kinda do this for every rifle though I buy just the action for about $1,500 or so and then build a rifle around it. The final cost can vary +/- $2K depending on the stock quality I get built for it. Either way you still have lots of $$$ left over and get exactly what you want in the rifle.

Though my main reason for doing it this way is being a lefty.

It doesn't mean they are ugly either. Bastogne walnut on the one below.

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

Mauser 98 of course, but they are in the US about $2,000 more expensive ($11k) than the Dakota 76 African ($9k).

If you are going to spend this kind of money, you might as well go Mauser. In my opinion (others may differ) the Dakota is significantly overpriced, considering it is but a glorified Winchester 70. Not a bad rifle mind you, but where are the $7,000 value differential compared to a $2,000 Win 70?

Having handled both, I can vouch that the Mauser is definitely heavier built than the Dakota. Whether it is necessary for rifle robustness is debatable, but I can assure you that a Dakota 76 African weighing in at 7 1/2 lbs in any of the DG calibers is significantly too light. The Mauser 98 weighing in at 10+ lbs makes entire sense.

All this being said, if it is to be a hunting rifle (as opposed to a safe queen) I would personally buy a CZ 550 .416 Rigby for $1,500; re-bore or re-barrel it to .450 for another $1,000; and give it a B&C Kevlar stock and a AHR upgrade #2 for another $2,000. That would give me a Mauser 98 functional equivalent for $4,500 and I would use the $7,000 balance to get a second buffalo on my next safari

If it is to be a gun library adoration piece, then beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

To me it seems as though the Dakota is of similar build to the Kimber Caprivi I already have, great rifle but just not quite at the same level as a Mauser or a Rigby.

 

[One Day...]

Agreed!
"Standard" rifles pressed into DG role...
375 H&H actions with mag wells opened for Rigby-length cartridges; barrels too thin for proper weight to match DG caliber, etc. etc. ...

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

Mauser 98 of course, but they are in the US about $2,000 more expensive ($11k) than the Dakota 76 African ($9k).

If you are going to spend this kind of money, you might as well go Mauser. In my opinion (others may differ) the Dakota is significantly overpriced, considering it is but a glorified Winchester 70. Not a bad rifle mind you, but where are the $7,000 value differential compared to a $2,000 Win 70?

Having handled both, I can vouch that the Mauser is definitely heavier built than the Dakota. Whether it is necessary for rifle robustness is debatable, but I can assure you that a Dakota 76 African weighing in at 7 1/2 lbs in any of the DG calibers is significantly too light. The Mauser 98 weighing in at 10+ lbs makes entire sense.

All this being said, if it is to be a hunting rifle (as opposed to a safe queen) I would personally buy a CZ 550 .416 Rigby for $1,500; re-bore or re-barrel it to .450 for another $1,000; and give it a B&C Kevlar stock and a AHR upgrade #2 for another $2,000. That would give me a Mauser 98 functional equivalent for $4,500 and I would use the $7,000 balance to get a second buffalo on my next safari

If it is to be a gun library adoration piece, then beauty is in the eyes of the beholder

To me it seems as though the Dakota is of similar build to the Kimber Caprivi I already have, great rifle but just not quite at the same level as a Mauser or a Rigby.

I wonder if you have a Heym rep in Australia? If not, that might be whey they're so much higher priced over there.

So I got more details today, the Heym starts at $13'500 AUD for a base model and has a 12 month lead time. The Mauser with grade 5 wood is $11'500 AUD with a 6 month lead time. The Mauser requires a 25% deposit with order and the Heym requires a 50% deposit with order.

 

[damundsen87]

To me it seems as though the Dakota is of similar build to the Kimber Caprivi I already have, great rifle but just not quite at the same level as a Mauser or a Rigby.

So I got more details today, the Heym starts at $13'500 AUD for a base model and has a 12 month lead time. The Mauser with grade 5 wood is $11'500 AUD with a 6 month lead time. The Mauser requires a 25% deposit with order and the Heym requires a 50% deposit with order.

No shooting experience with either of these but I handled both at SCI last month. I feel like the heym is worth the extra money. The mauser was nice but felt more like a very upscale production rifle as far as fit and finish. The heym was absolutely gorgeous. Great balance, also I like that all of their magazine components are scaled to the specific cartridge and milled from a solid piece of steel.

 

[bruce moulds]

don't be too hard on Dakota.
the action looks m70, but is a hybrid of mauser and m70.
the receiver and rear of bolt are essentially m70.
the breeching is pure mauser 98, so an improvement over the m 70
the unique bolt stop/bolt release handles gas as good as anything.
the ejector is basically like a brno 600, leaving the left lug without the cut of a mauser.
Dakotas are extremely smooth.
they are heat treated prior to machining, meaning that they do not go out of true in the machining process or after it.
they are made to fine tolerances and respond to being kept clean more than a military mauser, but the latest mauser98 which might also be current rigby, is similar in this respect.
my 280 is built on a Dakota, and I absolutely love using it.
I bought the action and had pseco fit the barrel, bedding it myself in a brown precision stock.
McMillan or h s precision would be other stock considerations.
I would do this process again for a bigger calibre gun.
bruce.

 

[NWT]

To me it seems as though the Dakota is of similar build to the Kimber Caprivi I already have, great rifle but just not quite at the same level as a Mauser or a Rigby.

So I got more details today, the Heym starts at $13'500 AUD for a base model and has a 12 month lead time. The Mauser with grade 5 wood is $11'500 AUD with a 6 month lead time. The Mauser requires a 25% deposit with order and the Heym requires a 50% deposit with order.

Aussie,
$7428.00 USD for a new Mauser 98 Magnum Mauser would be a good price here in the US. We do not see many on the shelves

A new basic Heym Martini with very plain wood was priced at $9000.00, not sure if that was the final number.

New Dakota’s are overpriced in my opinion.You can find a like new (fired but not hunted) Dakota 76 Safari Grade ,upgraded wood for $4500. They are pretty common. Most have a issue or two that usually can be fixed .

My experiences have been most semi custom production rifles will have some quality control issues that will need to be addressed before it becomes a reliable performer. Same can be said of many very expensive custom rifles made by many of the top name rifle builders.

I still own and have used several Dakotas, one in particular was my go to gun for twenty years. In my opinion they are a level above the Kimber in detail, machining, and overall quality.
I also have one of the new Mauser Magnum Mauser rifles in .416 Rigby. I have not fired this rifle yet so the verdict is not out.
It really depends on what you are comfortable taking out into the bush and hunting with. I am careful with my rifles but I use them, after a year or two they start to show character. After a certain point once you get past function and fit the only thing you are really paying for is embellishments.

 

[Major Khan]

To the best of my knowledge , the Mauser 98 Magnum model comes in 3 calibres :
> .375 Holland & Holland magnum
> .416 Rigby
> 450 Rigby
To the best of my knowledge , the Dakota Model 76 " African " , " Safari" and " PH ( Professional Hunter ) " models comes in 6 calibres :
> .375 Holland & Holland magnum
> .404 Jeffery
> .416 Remington magnum
> .416 Rigby
> .450 Rigby
> .458 Lott
The Mauser 98 platform is a time proven classic , but the Dakota has a lighter weight ( this is not necessarily a good thing in the .400 series calibres , as the recoil may be counterproductive ) .

Have you given any thought to a " Marquis " model bolt rifle from " Lebeau Courally " . ? I had the privilege to see several of their excellent pieces on a trip to Belgium last year .

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

To the best of my knowledge , the Mauser 98 Magnum model comes in 3 calibres :
> .375 Holland & Holland magnum
> .416 Rigby
> 450 Rigby
To the best of my knowledge , the Dakota Model 76 " African " , " Safari" and " PH ( Professional Hunter ) " models comes in 6 calibres :
> .375 Holland & Holland magnum
> .404 Jeffery
> .416 Remington magnum
> .416 Rigby
> .450 Rigby
> .458 Lott
The Mauser 98 platform is a time proven classic , but the Dakota has a lighter weight ( this is not necessarily a good thing in the .400 series calibres , as the recoil may be counterproductive ) .

Have you given any thought to a " Marquis " model bolt rifle from " Lebeau Courally " . ? I had the privilege to see several of their excellent pieces on a trip to Belgium last year .

I've given thought to a lot of different makes and models, unfortunately there is a lot of rifles I won't have access to here in Australia.

 

[The_Wanderer]

Aussie Hunter- have look at QLD Gun exchange. They list a few Rigby models in the Rigby brand. Also have you considered a custom on a Granite Mountain Arms Action? Rob Bloomfield in QLD imports them and has a very good reputation, not sure on lead times though.

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

Aussie Hunter- have look at QLD Gun exchange. They list a few Rigby models in the Rigby brand. Also have you considered a custom on a Granite Mountain Arms Action? Rob Bloomfield in QLD imports them and has a very good reputation, not sure on lead times though.

Never looked at Granite mountain actions before. I will have a look online tonight

 

[Boomstick!]

What about a HEYM Express

 

[Boomstick!]

Well I only read the first page thinking it was the second. I’m late to the party about the HEYM

 

[BeeMaa]

@Aussie_Hunter
I'm a big fan of the M98, CZ550, M70, Dakota 76...etc CRF actions.
Just wondered if there a specific reason you are limiting yourself to CRF actions?
Not looking to start a CRF/PF debate...just asking a question.

I know there are several here who use a PF for DG hunting...some are even PH's.
I personally don't see a problem with it as long as the rifle is reliable and the hunter is competent.
I also believe the same goes for a CRF rifle, which can have issues as well.
Either way, the kinks need to be worked out with proper practice and training.