Life After The Indian Hunting Ban

[grand veneur]

I was only a captain by the French naval infantry forces , but I would also be interested in where the cartridge 30-06 springfield is still in use by the US Army. I am not aware of anything.

 

[Bullhunter]

.....I won’t any longer.

That will be great, Sir, "Mister General".

 

[grand veneur]

...and now , where is the cartridge in use ?

 

[PSRaghav]

Dear Mark-Hunter
Mr Lakhpat Singh is on WhatsApp
It's a simple application which can be downloaded on a phone
You can then make a WhatsApp call and speak with him .....just like you speak with someone on skype
Yes . Language may be a problem with him as he speaks hindi.

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

I have also had a busy day and have returned to my hotel just now. Let us now assess the statements made .
Firstly , l have already provided links in my previous posts on this thread. They will let the truth become clear about the situation of beef eaters in India , the issue relating to imported arms and the definition of Nilgai. It is up to my dear respected forum members as to decide which source is more reliable : International media or two gentlemen posting on this forum who's views do not match anything the international fire arms and hunting community knows about India.
Furthermore , here are the names and contact details of three arms shops in India.
Varun Armoury - +917006995434
Pitamber gun house - + 919312504522
East India Arms company -
+ 919864091813
A simple telephone call to any of these shops and asking about imported fire arms should lay any controversy to rest.
Three arms shops cannot lie .

Nilgai does not mean blue cow . It is an antelope and not even a bovine . Call me a liar if you will. Then go call wikipedia a liar as well .

Furthermore , what you two are attempting to do here is basically pretend that anything you do not agree with , simply did not happen . Let us get something very clear here and now . People appointed by the government to occasionally deal with a man eating leopard or a man eating Royal Bengal tiger have my utmost respect ( regardless of what you think of me ) . They save lives. However , these people do not represent the international hunting community , which is what this entire site is about . I am not gloating , but l used to be a professional Shikari guiding foreign clients from 1962 to 1970 . Perhaps , l am not the most knowledgeable person about fire arms or hunting , but it can be safely said that l do know a thing or two about both fire arms and hunting in India .

This is a piece of the Wildlife Protection Act - 1972 . " Hunting wild animals is prohibited " is clearly written here . This means that after 1972 , anyone hunting in India was committing a criminal offence ( yes , many did continue to hunt anyway , but l am talking about legally hunting , not hiding from the police and hunting ) .
Being an Indian myself , by birth and having lived there until 1979 , l admit that l have written things here that others may take offence to , but so what ? Does this mean that if you take offense to some one else's views , you will try desperately to make them look like fraudulent people ?
And is it a mere co incidence that everything l said about Indian hunting laws and fire arms laws , match what the international hunting world knows to be true ?
About photographs , people seem to be fond of repeating the same issue again , no matter how many times we resolve it . The photographs were removed long ago and l despised putting them there in the first place , doing so only because l believed another forum member here who l entered into a contractual agreement with ( to his credit however , he was quick to publicly admit his mistake like a true gentleman ) .
The only way a person can own an imported fire arm in India is by :
1) Becoming a " renowned shooter " and
achieving the minimum qualifying score at the NSCC . Good luck to ordinary citizens and casual shooters , accomplishing this .
2) Obtaining a fire arm on a Transfer of Residence certificate ( TR ) . So , go live in a foreign country long enough to get a citizenship there . Purchase a fire arm in THAT country and then return to India . But best of luck passing on this fire arm to your son or daughter after you pass away
3) Obtaining a second hand fire arm that was imported into India prior to 1986 . So , you are getting a fire arm which is at least 33 years old ( if not more ) and has been used by a wide plethora of users ( who may or may not have improperly taken care of the gun ) . Good luck finding an imported fire arm made prior to 1986 in India in good condition . Just yesterday , l have seen a gun shop which had four imported shot-guns there ( l actually went there to see if any Belgian shot-guns or Astra shot-guns were there ) . EVERY shot-gun there either had a cracked stock , a bulged muzzle or in one case , a broken external hammer .
And one more thing . In India , you cannot legally own any shot size larger that number 1 . So that means , no AAA , SSG , SG or LG .
Finally , l have read about Prasant Singh and l have nothing but admiration for that selfless gentleman . He uses ( last time l have read ) a .3006 calibre rifle , although to be fair , l have not read about him in a year.

 

[mark-hunter]

Language may be a problem with him as he speaks hindi.

Thank you sir, for clear answer!

thus validity of source cannot be established by estimated 90% of forum non-hindi speaking members.

 

[PSRaghav]

During your shikar days in India
Was hunting Neelgai considered Sacrilidge by Hindus ?

 

[PSRaghav]

Yes
But he is a school teacher
I am sure he can organise an English speaking student and have a detailed discussion at a later date
Infact he does speak some English as well . Though not fluently

 

[Red Leg]

That will be great, Sir, "Mister General".

...and now , where is the cartridge in use ?

This guy is a troll. Over talked and was caught out as not knowing what he was talking about. A problem when you forget who may be in the audience. When they start throwing out their mysterious relationship with "SF" it is usually a pretty clear sign - particularly to those of us who have actually served.

Our SF soldiers have had available 7.62, .300 WM (seldom now), .338 Lapua, and .50 cal as "sniper" weapons. Even in Vietnam, our primary sniper weapons were built around the 7.62 NATO. Though interestingly, some of the more famous shots were taken single shot with the .50 Cal M2 MG in single shot mode. We have not used a 30-06 in any form for a couple of generations. I would not be surprised if this small misrepresentation is a indicator of a far broader one. As I say, a troll - no matter when he supposedly joined.

 

[mark-hunter]

I still own my greatgradfather's .32 bore Browning pistol . The old model .

Dear Sir,
I conratulate you, and I am glad for you.

You own this pistol now as state employee, offical shikari?
Not as a civilian?
Can you confirm that, in case I am not mistaken?

 

[PSRaghav]

I have owned it after my grandfather's death .who inherited it from his father
Much before I became a registered shikari
I am a civilian.

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

During your shikar days in India
Was hunting Neelgai considered Sacrilidge by Hindus ?

Good . Finally , we can have a civilized discussion . Those Hindus who oppose all hunting , of course considered it wrong ( and yes , those kinds existed even in the 1960s decade ). But many Hindus did not . Nilgai is not a bovine . It is an antelope .
It is not a cow in any sense of the word . However , to be fair , l have seen many Hindu villagers consider them holy .

 

[Red Leg]

All privately owned guns confiscated ?
I still own my greatgradfather's .32 bore Browning pistol . The old model .
Yes the quota for owning weapons .....like Atari correctly pointed out was reduced to 3 plus 1 per member of the family (where the plus one was a 22 ) . I retained a big bore rifle, a 12 bore shotgun , a pistol and a ,22 rifle.
As mentioned earlier
All my weapons are imported .
No one is forced to use IOF products

So educate me please. How does the average person get around the Firearms act of 1959? It is available on the web in English, and seems rather draconian. It also seems to have led to the immediate confiscation of those collections still in the country that were owned by the newly displaced aristocracy. Most of these fine guns have a paper trail and seem to have simply vanished by the sixties. One would assume they were destroyed if not collecting rust in some government armory?

 

[PSRaghav]

I would also like to point out that being a Shikari in India is an honorary job . We do not get paid for it by the Government. It's something we do our of our passion .
We are not hired but issued a permit . Basically authorised to do the job

 

[PSRaghav]

I will ask a friend Mark to answer that for you
As for my family
My father and my grandfather retained 6 of the best they had and sold / gifted the others

 

[PSRaghav]

Mr Rehman
My next question
Why would a Hindu consider this antelope holy?
It's the name Neelgai
Which literally means a blue cow/bull and it's association to beef

Interestingly . This name was given by Aurangzeb (a Muslim ruler) ,so that the majority Hindus do not hunt the animal. The change in name actually went in his favour . Before which the antelope was called Van Rozara
Anyways
To cut the long story short
All that is expected is that you stick to the facts and only use your own photographs in your stories . If you do use from other sources . Kindly acknowledge it

 

[mark-hunter]

We are not hired but issued a permit . Basically authorised to do the job

So, some people are issued a permit to hunt after hunting ban? (as "honorary")
And in same time some people are banned from hunting in India?

Also, if we agree that some guns are confiscated in seventies, and some were not (like yours .32)- it means that there was some selection on owners who can keep an imported weapon, and some who cannot?

Is there any legal grounds for such discrepancies?

Finally, for my own education, if you please - for confiscated firearms - has there been compensation in payment to owner, proper, symbolic, or no compensation to legal owners at all?

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

Mr Rehman
My next question
Why would a Hindu consider this antelope holy?

Because SOME Hindus considered them Bovines due to the word Gai . But they are not . They are antelope . Think of it as different interpretations of religion.
Also,Nilgai has been officially allowed to hunt in Gujarat. The process is that you need official documents from the district officials and the village sarpanch or mukhiya. And that you cannot consume the animal.

 

[Red Leg]

I was only a captain by the French naval infantry forces , but I would also be interested in where the cartridge 30-06 springfield is still in use by the US Army. I am not aware of anything.

Never served with your naval infantry, but some of my lads provided a lot of fire support (MLRS) for your army elements deployed during the first Gulf War. They were fine soldiers and well led by real professionals. Your field mess was also a lot better than ours!

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

And PSRaghav , l know that we will probably keep arguing after this . But take a moment to know this : If you really are Prasant Singh , then l am truly apologetic that we met under these most unfortunate set of circumstances .
Even though l am not a member , there is an other internet group called " Indians for guns " where Prasant Singh is a poster and l have followed his stories with great enthusiasm for quite some time now . Even though l do not take kindly to people attempting to discredit me , let it be known that l am a massive admirer of Prasant Singh and this is not just a new admiration . Politics aside , many of his field experiences with leopards matches my own from six decades ago .