In search of a used double for first hunt in Zimbabwe

[aminkus]

IDK anything about doubles - Gordy and Sons in Houston has a used Bernardelli in 475 No 2 for 12K

Seems like that'd be a bit of a challenge on projectiles anyway...caliber .483?

thanks for your suggestions but that caliber might be just to hard to get ammo for

 

[rookhawk]

thanks for your suggestions but that caliber might be just to hard to get ammo for

Sort of a moot point. No double rifle can shoot factory ammo indefinitely. They ALL change their recipes. Then you’re stuck with handloads that will shoot better anyway. There is no Cabelas you can run into and get the load you want to shoot for a double rifle for very long before you resort to handloading.

 

[Ray B]

If it were me, I'd be inclined to go on a hunt with an outfitter who would have a proper double rifle for me to rent for the hunt.

 

[Foxi]

was /is on egun
a Heym .470 NE for € 14.000.-
Its in Germany and not to export in your country,I presume.
Just for dreaming

 

[BeeMaa]

I agree with @rookhawk. Buy a bolt action magazine rifle and invest that double rifle money into more ammo (for practice) and animals for hunting. You will have more enjoyment from the experiences on the safari than hunting with any particular firearm.

Buying a rifle chambered in 458LOTT will have all the advantages of a stopping rifle (like a 470NE) but with all the benefits of not needing specific ammo to regulate the barrels.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

@aminkus , I started a this thread, "Dreaming if a Double Rifle" on 10 April of this year.
https://www.africahunting.com/threads/dreaming-of-a-double-rifle.91624/

It is a compiling of thoughts from many experianced AH members especially @rookhawk along with my own experiance of having to own a double rifle, then another, and another.

Having owned six different doubles, I am presently down to two, my 40 year old Heym 88B in .458 Win Mag, and a Blaser S2 in .375 H&H which is as accurate as it is ugly! My Heym, other than being chambered for a high pressure, rimless cartridge, is perfection in gunmaking. I will take it as my only rifle on an upcoming tuskless elephant hunt. My Blaser is still in my safe because of its modern design. One can regulate these themself, although that isn't a simple task. The S2 has crisp triggers and accepts standard Blaser scope mounts. Oh, did I mention how accurate the Blaser S2's are?

Please read my thread and all the responses. I lot of us have been exactly where your desires are taking you. Sometimes one has to live out their dream, even it they and everyone else know it will cost them in the long term.

Also, please forgive my occasional typos in the subject thread. I admit that although I proof read prior to posting, its hard for me to edit my own writing with it fresh in my mind. Professionally, I wait a day to proof read but I am here for enjoyment of a passion. Waiting a day takes some of the fun out of it...

 

[richteb]

From my observations about 90 percent of guys hunting with doubles are very poorly prepaired or efficient in shooting them. The saying goes, just because you can doesn't mean you should. Rings true if you are not happy with recoil. A good fitting 375 bolt gun is about the best option for someone who isn't experienced with larger calibers. Need to follow the 5 step plan even with that. Practice, practice, practice, practice and practice. Be smooth, efficient on the bolt, and ready with the second shot. Watch some filmed hunts on YouTube and you will see point.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Coveting a DR is a curse many of us have had or still have. I am not cured of the affliction myself.

I could not abide a rifle that cost 4x the amount of a quality magazine rifle and produced a group 4x as large.

But! I still can’t get over the desire to find that one “perfect” DR. I have found that between the wars SxS shotguns have given me a distraction from DRs. They look and feel similar. Can be used behind my house or many places on upland and small game.


My Amateur opinion is to only buy a double rifle from somebody that can prove what load it likes and that will help you with your journey.

To buy it from an auction house or out of state is a huge mistake unless you have somebody locally that can walk you through and help you through all the pitfalls and help with custom loads.

It’s worth paying thousands more to someone that has all the bugs worked out. the perfect load it likes. and will help you with the DR in the future.

 

[cwickgo9]

View attachment 705007
was /is on egun
a Heym .470 NE for € 14.000.-
Its in Germany and not to export in your country,I presume.
Just for dreaming

What a nice set up!

 

[Russ16]

I’ve been on a similar journey and really want to find a vintage British gun.

What I find interesting is the split opinions on the Chapuis. I’ve handled a couple of them and they seem well made and solid but that’s obviously a superficial opinion. I also find it interesting that I rarely seem to see used examples for sale.

 

[cwickgo9]

I completely agree with the staying away from a " bargain " double but i have a 404 Jeffery that i plan on bringing as well but the idea of hunting a Bull Ele with a double is just something i cant seem to shake

I feel this last statement fully. I just know unless I win the lottery, I'll never need or use a double. As others have mentioned the mere fact that you would need to hand load (which I do but not the point) custom ammunition for it to even come close to point of aim at 50 yards bothers me.
I think you'll find Oullette's thread above helpful to some degree. But I totally get the "passion" if you will to take a big animal with a big bore double - that's a vision that is very hard to shake once its in your mind.
Best of luck on your quest.

 

[rookhawk]

Can anyone point me to the threads about the guys that bought Heyms, hated them, and then went out and got a Krieghoff, VC, Chapuis, Merkel, Sabatti, or Searcy and lived happily ever after?

When I search those parameters all I see is classifieds selling the latter.

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

Stick to your dream Aminkus, get a double and go hunting in Africa. Life is too short, just find the money and do it. Search for a Heym, Krieghoff or Chapuis, they will serve you well and the chances of redeeming your investment one day, should you wish to do so, is high.

 

[Rare Breed]

If it were me, I'd be inclined to go on a hunt with an outfitter who would have a proper double rifle for me to rent for the hunt.

In my experience practicing with a DR off sticks takes time versus renting a bolt action. Especially if you’re going after DG. I just can’t think of an outfitter that would want to rent a DR for a DG hunt

 

[Franco]

Aaron,
Hopefully you have read the thread by Mark. I can tell you this, dreaming of hunting DG with a double rifle will not go away, nor will it be satisfied by a bolt gun, dreams do not recognize reality, logic, or facts.

The question you have to ask yourself is; "What, exactly will it take to satisfy that dream?"

Will you be satisfied with one-and-done, or do you see a future filled with hunting with a double?

There's a difference between doing something just to say you did or check a box, and really doing it well.

You might see yourself wearing an Armani suit to your high school prom, but borrowing your cousin's, who is 2 inches taller and outweighs you by 40 pounds, doesn't exactly paint the picture you imagined.

To be effective and proficient, a double rifle has to fit you and you need to practice. A PH might let you shoot his double at a target, but I don't see him handing you his rifle to shoot an elephant.

With respect to shooting, there is nothing worse or more disappointing than shooting a rifle or shotgun which doesn't fit you. But, missing a pheasant does not compare to a poor shot on an elephant or cape buffalo.

I shot alongside another hunter whose double was too short and he was high on almost every shot. He was dead on with his bolt gun.

You have gotten some excellent advice from some extremely experienced people. I think it would be safe to say they all understand your dream.

You have to decide where the dream of what you want to do merges with the reality of what you can do.

I do not think I'm alone when I say, once shooting a double gets into your blood - it does not go away. You start looking for ways to use your double. On my recent hunt in Mozambique I spent 3 hours getting into position just so I could shoot a croc at close range with my double.

Be forewarned, they are addictive - I have a Heym 89B 450/400, I pick up my 89B 500NE tomorrow.

 

[JimmyJack54]

Solid experience here dealing with @aminkus in the AH classifieds!

 

[Whit]

View attachment 705007
was /is on egun
a Heym .470 NE for € 14.000.-
Its in Germany and not to export in your country,I presume.
Just for dreaming

Not a Heym. Custom riflemaker. Beautiful rifle, however…

 

[Jager Waffen74]

Buy a Heym and don't look back. Best working double on the market and holds it's value.

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

Aaron,
Hopefully you have read the thread by Mark. I can tell you this, dreaming of hunting DG with a double rifle will not go away, nor will it be satisfied by a bolt gun, dreams do not recognize reality, logic, or facts.

The question you have to ask yourself is; "What, exactly will it take to satisfy that dream?"

Will you be satisfied with one-and-done, or do you see a future filled with hunting with a double?

There's a difference between doing something just to say you did or check a box, and really doing it well.

You might see yourself wearing an Armani suit to your high school prom, but borrowing your cousin's, who is 2 inches taller and outweighs you by 40 pounds, doesn't exactly paint the picture you imagined.

To be effective and proficient, a double rifle has to fit you and you need to practice. A PH might let you shoot his double at a target, but I don't see him handing you his rifle to shoot an elephant.

With respect to shooting, there is nothing worse or more disappointing than shooting a rifle or shotgun which doesn't fit you. But, missing a pheasant does not compare to a poor shot on an elephant or cape buffalo.

I shot alongside another hunter whose double was too short and he was high on almost every shot. He was dead on with his bolt gun.

You have gotten some excellent advice from some extremely experienced people. I think it would be safe to say they all understand your dream.

You have to decide where the dream of what you want to do merges with the reality of what you can do.

I do not think I'm alone when I say, once shooting a double gets into your blood - it does not go away. You start looking for ways to use your double. On my recent hunt in Mozambique I spent 3 hours getting into position just so I could shoot a croc at close range with my double.

Be forewarned, they are addictive - I have a Heym 89B 450/400, I pick up my 89B 500NE tomorrow.

I would say I fired around 200 rounds through my Heym 89b before I was happy and competent with it. the first 80 or so in finding a load that regulated well. About 60 more in trying three types of red dot sight, and then zeroing the chosen one to perfection (Trijicon RMR, 1 MOA on Henneberger mount). Then about 60 or so more shooting Big Bore club competitions, 6 rounds each time.
In the field I have shot one buff bull, an impala and a wild pig. Very satisfied.

 

[AZDAVE]

Good morning.

I was once in the same place you are with wanting a double after shooting a friends 500NE Merkel.

In the last 25ish years I have owned 28 different doubles and shot maybe 20 other doubles. I have learned about doubles how to load for them and what to look for and what to walk away from. Mostly through the school of hard knocks. If I had saved the $ over the years I could of had a english best. But I digress. Owned a REM russian bakail, couple sabatti's, multiple Chapuis (My favorite double I own is a 9.3x74 RGEX), Hyem, Siace, a couple VC's, Sercey, Krieghoff, Simon, Rigby, couple British BPE's (500 and 577), Rizzini, I am sure there are a couple more that I just don't remember at this place in time.

Currently own 2 Chapuis, 1 Krieghoff, 1 Simon, 1 VC, and 1 Rigby.

I could write all the pro's and con's of what I learned the hard way about each one I owned, but that is a better conversation to have over a long phone call or a couple beers around a fire.

You have received alot of good advice from other's on this thread. so I will put my .02 in.

If it was my money I would buy
Classic English (would have it checked out by JJ and get his stamp of approval) Chapuis or Krieghoff or Hyem.