If this is lion hunting…. You can have it

[archer36]

I thought that I conceded your point that Cross bows are accurate and close to rifle accuracy out to 100 yrds (1”-2” MOA). I tried to discuss that there are differences that affect a bow or cross bow that do Not affect a bullet (as much). The main difference is speed - the fastest arrow is 4x SLOWER then most rifle bullets used. And because they travel much slower then the speed of sound - an animal can react & move after hearing the sound and before the arrow/bolt arrives. This is the difference from shooting a target at 50-75-100 yrds and an animal. The crossbows launching bolts at 400-500 fps are often measured using the lightest arrow/broadhead weights which sometimes can affect penetration (it’s a tradeoff). I think Compound Bows and Cross bows are now incrediblely advanced from 10 years ago and light years ahead of stick bows. I enjoy hunting and target shooting with both. I still do Not think they compare with a rifle despite similar accuracy under some conditions. Most Deer can “jump a string” even from a Cross bow if the distance is over 30-35 yrds and even at 400-500fps the “sound” reaches the deer before the arrow. Assuming a Deer has a 10” vital zone and you are aiming dead center, the deer only needs to drop 4”-5” and its an “off hit”. A deer standing at 40 yrds “hears” the string pop before the arrow is at 20 yrds. Now, that was my point - I might be off by a few feet or yards but I believe my concept is on fairly solid ground and admitt there are many variables - including some deer are so relaxed that they do Not flinch or “string jump” at every shot. I certainly do Not argue that a cross bow is an improvement over most bows and has a slightly longer range. I do Not belittle any crossbow hunter and I have done much cross bow hunting....although I prefer a compound and I “wish” I was good enough to use a traditional long bow (But I’m Not good enough). I think I understand your point and respect your experience - we are actually fairly close in our opinions. Good Hunting to You

Broadheads kill by hemorrhaging. Bullets kill with hydrostatic shock. An animal may not realize it has been shot with an arrow. There is no doubt you are getting their attention with a bullet.

 

[K E Johnson]

Broadheads kill by hemorrhaging. Bullets kill with hydrostatic shock. An animal may not realize it has been shot with an arrow. There is no doubt you are getting their attention with a bullet.

Not necessarily, my best whitetail was double lunged with a .375 H&H.
He just stood still at the shot. I reloaded and was going to shoot again, but I knew there was no way I missed broadside at 40 yards. I refrained from a second shot. Animals can be unpredictable. My best archery buck did almost the same thing.
Bullets can kill from hemorrhage and not shock dependent on velocity. I do tend to hunt with calibers that do not kill from hydrostatic shock.
Blood loss kills.

 

[mark-hunter]

Broadheads kill by hemorrhaging. Bullets kill with hydrostatic shock. An animal may not realize it has been shot with an arrow. There is no doubt you are getting their attention with a bullet.

If not hit in CNS, in most of cases bleeding is cause of death in shot animals.

 

[freefall]

The saying goes that when a person loses an argument, their last resort is an insult…such as calling me a liberal LOL! If you only knew

Ding let the door hit you in the ass on the way out

I lied. I looked back in. I did not call you a liberal, I said you argue like one. I find your thought processes to be lacking.
Have a good life, Zulu king.

 

[archer36]

Not necessarily, my best whitetail was double lunged with a .375 H&H.
He just stood still at the shot. I reloaded and was going to shoot again, but I knew there was no way I missed broadside at 40 yards. I refrained from a second shot. Animals can be unpredictable. My best archery buck did almost the same thing.
Bullets can kill from hemorrhage and not shock dependent on velocity. I do tend to hunt with calibers that do not kill from hydrostatic shock.
Blood loss kills.

There are always exceptions to anything. We generally speak in the most common outcomes. Repeat what you did 20 times and see how many times you get that result. In addition, every shot and animal is different. They have "personalities" like humans. If you can duplicate an exact shot on 20 different animals, you will get some different results. A one-time event doesn't become the rule.

 

[Shakka]

I lied. I looked back in. I did not call you a liberal, I said you argue like one. I find your thought processes to be lacking.
Have a good life, Zulu king.

I thought that you were out of this thread??

 

[HENRY GRIFFITHS SAFARIS]

watched the video twice and some fellow ph's send me the short un edited version 2 on WhatsApp

I agree it was dramatized to much and listening to the shooters comment's "we got the video we wanted" make it sound like the were very much trying to get a good charge on video it was all about the footage and not the animal and experience, I am also not a fan of CBL lions(note , I have been on a few) but the reality is that its the only way that an average bloke will ever get a poke at a lion

 

[Excessexpress]

And right on cue, this video has been distributed by antis in the last day as an example of lion hunting. Good work dickhead.

 

[Vinootz]

Maybe someone can explain to me why anyone would would attempt to take a dangerous big game animal with any type of archery tackle. Unless they can hit the game in the brain or spine, the animal dies from blood loss, which can take anywhere from a few minutes to several hours depending on the hit. Now combine that with a weapon that simply cannot be reloaded quickly and you know that someone else will have to finish what you started. What could the guy have been thinking? The whole thing seems to be disrespectful of the lion, the staff, and anyone else that might be in the area.
I know that hunting dangerous game can be, well, dangerous, but some things are just foolhardy. Emphasis on the fool.

It depends who you ask. I disagree with you. I’ll spare you the details of my opinion.

 

[Shakka]

In my opinion, this entire hunt was set up so that they could get a lion charge on video and gain the attention that they did. The Lion was FULLY aware of their presence...what do you think is going to happen when you stick him with an arrow at close range??

I have no problem with killing a Lion with archery gear. When a Lion is shot over bait like it is usually done in the WILD, then the Lion will be unaware of the hunter's presence. When struck with a vital hit from an arrow, he will run off and die peacefully.

The Lions in these CBL hunts are usually always aware of the hunters, so a charge is much more likely....and then the hunters can brag about shooting a charging lion....one that is noting like a wild lion.

 

[fourfive8]

Lovely, another Mark Sullivan wannabe with a sharp stick. Hunting by no definition. Might as well grow them in captivity, pick the one you want out of a catalogue, have it euthanized and the skin shipped to taxidermist of choice. Oh, something like that has already been done. I remember such catalogues with various males on order all with washed and blow-dried manes with different looks and colors.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

In my opinion, this entire hunt was set up so that they could get a lion charge on video and gain the attention that they did. The Lion was FULLY aware of their presence...what do you think is going to happen when you stick him with an arrow at close range??

I have no problem with killing a Lion with archery gear. When a Lion is shot over bait like it is usually done in the WILD, then the Lion will be unaware of the hunter's presence. When struck with a vital hit from an arrow, he will run off and die peacefully.

The Lions in these CBL hunts are usually always aware of the hunters, so a charge is much more likely....and then the hunters can brag about shooting a charging lion....one that is noting like a wild lion.

Or, the hunter pokes the CBL with a sharp stick and watches the PH shoot the charging lion.

 

[Shakka]

Doug, initially, I was totally against the notion of a CBL Lion, but then about a year ago I began to consider doing one because I know that I will never be able to afford a wild lion.
I then began to research it. What finished the idea for me was when I watched a few dozen CBL hunts on YouTube…every single one of them is a joke. The lion is found under a tree, he sees the crew and realizes that they are there. Maybe he will growl. The hunter shoots after some discussion and the lion usually drops biting at himself or runs off. If he does decides to charge, it is a half hearted one, and then 2 PH’s shoots and the lion is dead.
Congratulations all around about how great the hunt was …what a joke.

I won’t do it for free

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Doug, initially, I was totally against the notion of a CBL Lion, but then about a year ago I began to consider doing one because I know that I will never be able to afford a wild lion.
I then began to research it. What finished the idea for me was when I watched a few dozen CBL hunts on YouTube…every single one of them is a joke. The lion is found under a tree, he sees the crew and realizes that they are there. Maybe he will growl. The hunter shoots after some discussion and the lion usually drops biting at himself or runs off. If he does decides to charge, it is a half hearted one, and then 2 PH’s shoots and the lion is dead.
Congratulations all around about how great the hunt was …what a joke.

I won’t do it for free

Sounds right to me.

 

[BSO Dave]

Are you like this all of the time?

LMFAO!!!!

If you are asking if I always call out individuals who make nonsensical assertions without facts or the actual personal experience to support them, then yes, I am like that all the time..

BTW, I took so long to reply to you because I have actually been hunting and away from cell phones and the internet. Some of you should try it..

 

[BSO Dave]

The search feature with his name will give the real answer to that question.

LMFAO!

I could say the exact same thing about you...!

 

[Doug3006]

LMFAO!!!!

If you are asking if I always call out individuals who make nonsensical assertions without facts or the actual personal experience to support them, then yes, I am like that all the time..

BTW, I took so long to reply to you because I have actually been hunting and away from cell phones and the internet. Some of you should try it..

I leave for SA on Thursday

 

[BSO Dave]

I leave for SA on Thursday

In all sincerity, safe travels and have a great time..!

 

[Tanks]

Once again, this is an argument against the weapon when the real argument is the level of experience and proficiency of the individual holding the weapon.
...

I'd submit that the main argument is against CBL hunts period. That being said, they do meet the market demand for an inexpensive lion hunt. No one back home is going to know that the mounted lion was ordered from a catalog and shot after a few days on the property. Win for the farmer and win for the client who can brag about it for the rest of his days.

 

[Shakka]

I'd submit that the main argument is against CBL hunts period. That being said, they do meet the market demand for an inexpensive lion hunt. No one back home is going to know that the mounted lion was ordered from a catalog and shot after a few days on the property. Win for the farmer and win for the client who can brag about it for the rest of his days.

You’re right. It’s not for me but I support it because it’s legal, it supports the hunting industry, and if the hunters are happy that’s what counts. I would only hope that they are honest about it and don’t try to pass it off as a wild lion hunt

I shout pen-raised pheasant all the time, how do I condemn a CBL Hunt?