I Thought My Gun Was Clean

[baxterb]

There’s an old Swahili proverb that goes: “If you follow the lion into the bush, are you certain you want to find it?”

this also applies to bore scoping a barrel.

 

[Inline6]

@Inline6
And your enemy. It can have you worry needlessly that your bore ain't clean enough and you could end up with a stuffed barrel from over cleaning.
Great for diagnosing possible problems. My 25 hasn't had a proper clean in 200 rounds and I NEVER ran the barrel in either. Still shoots 0.8 inch groups at 200 yards. I don't think using a bore scope and having a spotless barrel will help me too much but to each his own.
To me a bore scope is only good to determine the condition of the barrel for heat cracks, erosion of the throat or tool marks. Apart from that unless you are ocd forget it for checking if the barrel is clean enough to maintain hunting accuracy.
Bob

It is really up to an individual to know what to look for and what is required to fix it. If you don't have a bore scope how will you truly know if you are doing any good? I have had people tell me their rifle went from 1/2 MOA to 2 MOA and they did not know why. I would scope it to find heavy copper deposits. Get it cleaned up return the rifle and they had their accuracy back.

Side note, I don't break in my barrels either. It is an exercise that bears no fruit...as far a cracked up barrel. Have had some that looked like dry creek beds and still shot sub 1/4MOA. Barrels have their own plan of living, some die sooner than expected some live longer. Either way they are expendable and need to be replaced when they are done.

 

[pilar]

@S-3 Ranch
Sell all your rifles then mate. That's why you bought them in the first place because you were interested.
If a rifle doesn't get interesting until 5 or 10 shots something is wrong. Game ain't gonna start around until you fire 5 to 10 shots for it to work properly.
All my rifles put the first shot where it should be every time Wether clean or dirty and will do so for the next few, even a hot barrel still puts them where they need to be.
A 10 shot 1.2 inch group starting with a cold clean barrel using 5 different projectiles and 5 different shooters and no cooling between shooters,now that's an interesting rifle.
Bob

Yeah I think I should sell them lol

 

[C.W. Richter]

You bore snaked your mother-in-law? Dog!

Sadly they don't make bore snakes long enough to clean from one end to the other. Am I the first guy to use a cleaning rod from each end?? Rhetorical. You'll sleep better tomorrow night!

 

[SDPlinker]

What is a black Mamba if not a snake?....another weird name for a rifle or calibre....like those lazzeroni things?...which sounded more like something from the good old TV series thunderbirds .....but honestly...black Mamba.....

LOL! I think it is a Volquartsen .22 LR pistol.

 

[SDPlinker]

....so when cleaning a black mamba with a brass brush ....do you start at its ass end or mouth....and presumably its not too happy,.so what's the end result?.....

I think a washcloth would be a better solution.

 

[uplander01]

I quit using harsh smelly chemicals and brushes in valuable rifles a long time ago and moved to Wipe Out foaming bore cleaner, easy, and it works. I’ll never go back.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I quit using harsh smelly chemicals and brushes in valuable rifles a long time ago and moved to Wipe Out foaming bore cleaner, easy, and it works. I’ll never go back.

@uplander01
That foaming bore cleaner suits this lazy old bastard when I do clean my bores. Spray, leave 30 minutes, brush out with a nylon brush and patch dry. Reapply, leave over nite muzzle down, patch dry and done. To easy
Bob

 

[HookMeUpII]

I've had good luck with an all Bore-Tech setup. It's expensive but man does this stuff work. Buy once, cry once. I usually do 2 soaked patches, 12x back and forth with nylon brush soaked in cleaner, 5-6 wet patches, then push dry ones till dry. If it's getting stored for a while, I'll push a patch with a light coat of Rem Oil then dry patches.

I've used Hoppe's and all sorts of stuff in the past. I've never seen as much blue (copper) on the patches as I have with Bore-Tech. And that would be the their regular Bore Cleaner, not the Copper Cleaner. It's not ammonia based but seems to catalyze to it when it reacts. When the patches come out they smell like ammonia but not before.

My feeling is people greatly underestimate how many passes it takes to effectively clean a rifle. Coincidentally, myself and 2 guys shooting match (6PPC and 6.5PRC) all ended up cleaning the same time at the range today. Not one of us took less than 20-30 minutes it seemed.

 

[Inline6]

I've had good luck with an all Bore-Tech setup. It's expensive but man does this stuff work. Buy once, cry once. I usually do 2 soaked patches, 12x back and forth with nylon brush soaked in cleaner, 5-6 wet patches, then push dry ones till dry. If it's getting stored for a while, I'll push a patch with a light coat of Rem Oil then dry patches.

I've used Hoppe's and all sorts of stuff in the past. I've never seen as much blue (copper) on the patches as I have with Bore-Tech. And that would be the their regular Bore Cleaner, not the Copper Cleaner. It's not ammonia based but seems to catalyze to it when it reacts. When the patches come out they smell like ammonia but not before.

My feeling is people greatly underestimate how many passes it takes to effectively clean a rifle. Coincidentally, myself and 2 guys shooting match (6PPC and 6.5PRC) all ended up cleaning the same time at the range today. Not one of us took less than 20-30 minutes it seemed.

ThorroClean Bore Cleaning System, for that very reason. I don't want to spend loads of time cleaning barrels.

 

[Philip Glass]

Y'all ever use Wipe Out? It seems to get things very clean.

 

[HookMeUpII]

ThorroClean Bore Cleaning System, for that very reason. I don't want to spend loads of time cleaning barrels.

I'm not opposed to trying that. I think for the money, the Bore Tech hardware cannot be beat. Rod, jags, brushes, patch guide, etc. Once you get into a $2000+ guns alone, doesn't make sense to me why someone would go with a $25 cleaning rod.

Wouldn't bother me to switch up solvent. You're right about the bore scope. If you don't scope, you don't know. Ironically, I have one and just remembered that I do. Never used it. Previous indication was the patch. Hoppe's, CLP, etc there was a little blue from copper removal. The Bore-Tech was like smurf blue, immediately. I wouldn't mind spending $20-$30 on some ThorroClean and put it up against the Bore Tech and check with the bore scope.

To your point about barrel break in, I am beginning to agree. I think barrels break in over way longer periods than the manufacturer suggested 20-50 rounds. I still follow the recommended break in but I think it is only a start and they break in over 50-100 rds. Then they reach the other end of the bell curve and start going down hill. I noticed my X-Bolt started to get very consistent once I hit the 75-100 round mark.

 

[Inline6]

It usually takes about 150-200 rds to settle a barrel in, so that I don't not get velocity swings.

Shooting out 2-3 barrels a year. It doesn't take long to figure out what works and what doesn't.

As far as getting 100% of the copper out, I'm not ate up with that. I'm more concerned about making sure I do not get a carbon ring built up in the throat. That will give you all kinds of fits.

 

[Hogpatrol]

Borescope, the barrel maker's friend.

 

[Inline6]

Borescope, the barrel maker's friend. View attachment 530698

Lol, the best barrel I have had to date was a 6.5CM cut on a Bartlein blank work was done by Dave Tooley. At 1900 rds it would not hold one MOA (in the past it would hold 3/8" @ 300 yards). When the scope went into the barrel. It had no rifling for 6", nothing to do but to pull it. I had heard may people pull barrels because they seen something they did not like. I don't care how it looks, as long as it shoots. My .02

 

[HookMeUpII]

It usually takes about 150-200 rds to settle a barrel in, so that I don't not get velocity swings.

Shooting out 2-3 barrels a year. It doesn't take long to figure out what works and what doesn't.

As far as getting 100% of the copper out, I'm not ate up with that. I'm more concerned about making sure I do not get a carbon ring built up in the throat. That will give you all kinds of fits.

In my somewhat rookie opinion: I think getting most of the copper out is important, but not all of it. The deposits sealing microscopic pits and pores in the rifling and barrel should be left. That is why I never use a metal brush. Carbon, residual power, soot, etc yes. 100% with you on that.

Carbon is a real pain to get out. Being a guy who shoots only gas shotguns for watefowl it is the bane of my existence.

This stuff is magic for taking out carbon fouling. I've had gas pistons with chunks of carbon falling off them come out shiny clean after using.

Carbon Killer

Carbon Killer removes carbon, grease, and lead on contact. It also makes plastic fouling easy to remove by breaking down the bonds between the plastic and metal. It is an aggressive cleaner designed to make cleaning easy for even extremely dirty and neglected parts. • Cuts through baked on...

slip2000.com

 

[Inline6]

IMO somewhat rookie opinion: I think getting most of the copper out is important, but not all of it. The deposits sealing microscopic pits and pores in the rifling and barrel should be left. That is why I never use a metal brush. Carbon, residual power, soot, etc yes. 100% with you on that.

Carbon is a real pain to get out. Being a guy who shoots only gas shotguns for watefowl it is the bane of my existence.

This stuff is magic for taking out carbon fouling. I've had gas pistons with chunks of carbon falling off them come out shiny clean after using.

Carbon Killer

Carbon Killer removes carbon, grease, and lead on contact. It also makes plastic fouling easy to remove by breaking down the bonds between the plastic and metal. It is an aggressive cleaner designed to make cleaning easy for even extremely dirty and neglected parts. • Cuts through baked on...

slip2000.com

To cut carbon, I use CLR. It is also aggressive, wet patch and brush, wet patch brush. Once clean, run a few patches of alcohol, then finish with whatever bore preservative you like.

Most of my stuff has SS finishes, if you splash on some coatings it will damage them if you don't get it of right then.

 

[Don458]

LOL! I think it is a Volquartsen .22 LR pistol.

I was waiting for the answer to this What is a black mamba ?

 

[Rare Breed]

Lol, the best barrel I have had to date was a 6.5CM cut on a Bartlein blank work was done by Dave Tooley. At 1900 rds it would not hold one MOA (in the past it would hold 3/8" @ 300 yards). When the scope went into the barrel. It had no rifling for 6", nothing to do but to pull it. I had heard may people pull barrels because they seen something they did not like. I don't care how it looks, as long as it shoots. My .02

I am in one group and have been in another. The other was my being OCD about copper driving me crazy and my rifles actually shot worse until I stopped doing that. Today I am in the group if my gun shoots MOA at distant I am not about to screw that up with a deep cleaning. I simply run a simple powder Solent and dry patch. If my groups start to widen with the same ammo then yes I will deep clean for copper, fowl barrel and get on with it

 

[WAB]

Lol, the best barrel I have had to date was a 6.5CM cut on a Bartlein blank work was done by Dave Tooley. At 1900 rds it would not hold one MOA (in the past it would hold 3/8" @ 300 yards). When the scope went into the barrel. It had no rifling for 6", nothing to do but to pull it. I had heard may people pull barrels because they seen something they did not like. I don't care how it looks, as long as it shoots. My .02

Could not agree more. Cleaning is about accuracy preservation. I could care less what it looks like if my cleaning regimen is producing the right results downrange.