Feral cats in Australia

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Thats one ahead of you.
He went well in Namibia didnt he?
Be happy for him and dont poison him against the .243.
The .308 he has will hit harder than any .243 and its a good choice for Australia. Any gunshop in Australia will normally carry a couple of varietys even out beyond the Black Stump. If someone ran out some shooter will have a mate that can hook you up with .308 ammo in a pinch.
I just like the unique way you describe the usefulness of a .243 its always worth trying to drag out a comment or leave an opening in a post to get your response.
Look after the boy teach him well and look after his .35 Whelen. After all its on loan to you and hopefully he will discipline many cats with it when he eventually takes posssession.
I cant knock the Whelen ive never fired one but if i did you might ring me up and set me straight so i just gotta harp on about the other little cartridge.

CBH
Chris I didn't poison him about the 243. He just love the way his 25 hits and his opinion is the 308 has killed everything I've shot so why do I want anything else. Now days he reluctantly uses the 25, everything is 08ed. I know the Whelen is only on loan so is the custom hornet. He wants both so one day he will have them all.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Panther Shooter]

Panther shooter
Any thing but a horrible 243. You would be better hitting it on the head with the barrel than shooting it with it. I have a strong dislike for the 243, have seen to much game wounded with it.
May be ok with a 100grain round nose.
Cheers mate Bob

Bob Nelson 35 Whelen
What game did you see the .243 Winchester being used on , in Australia ?
My ten year old grandson uses a .243 Winchester ( It is a Model 70 control round feed bolt action rifle ) for hunting Kakar ( Barking) Deer . My daughter ( his mother ) is the license holder for the .243 Winchester . We use Winchester 100 grain factory loaded soft nose ammunition for it . The boy has successfully dispatched seven Kakar Deer with it , in the last two years. . I would really hesitate to use it on a Chital Deer , however . When I first purchased the rifle for my daughter ten years ago , she did manage to secure one Chital Deer with it , though . She had selected the region behind the ear , as a target . I would not recommend the .243 Winchester to be employed against any game larger than a Kakar Deer , however.
I am certain that you speak from some genuinely negative personal experiences when you condemn the .243 Winchester.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Bob Nelson 35 Whelen
What game did you see the .243 Winchester being used on , in Australia ?
My ten year old grandson uses a .243 Winchester ( It is a Model 70 control round feed bolt action rifle ) for hunting Kakar ( Barking) Deer . My daughter ( his mother ) is the license holder for the .243 Winchester . We use Winchester 100 grain factory loaded soft nose ammunition for it . The boy has successfully dispatched seven Kakar Deer with it , in the last two years. . I would really hesitate to use it on a Chital Deer , however . When I first purchased the rifle for my daughter ten years ago , she did manage to secure one Chital Deer with it , though . She had selected the region behind the ear , as a target . I would not recommend the .243 Winchester to be employed against any game larger than a Kakar Deer , however.
I am certain that you speak from some genuinely negative personal experiences when you condemn the .243 Winchester.

Friend Panther Shooter
I have seen the 243 fail dismally on Kangaroos, goats, pigs and fallow deer with chest shots. This was possibly due to the wrong choice of projectiles in some cases. In a lot of cases it was right bullet but the bullet failed miserably. About the only projectile I have seen work properly on game was the 100 grain round nose. It actually did what it was supposed to do, but the range is limited to 150 to 200 yards. Failure to meet the advertised velocities by up to 500 fps is not acceptable to me and this is using maximum loads recommend.
I have used the 25 caliber for most of my shooting for over 40 years and have never found it lacking. Maybe less selection of projectiles means better quality, I don't know. I have never experienced a bullet failure in the 25 caliber, yes the shooter has failed at times but the 25s all ways performed well.
This is just my opinion based on seeing results in the field and not on hearsay. This is why i loath that horrible little caliber it is neither fish or foul. I personally wouldn't use the 243 on game that weighs more than 40 kilograms and then only with the 100 grain round nose.
Cheers friend Panther Shooter
Bob Nelson.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Thats one ahead of you.
He went well in Namibia didnt he?
Be happy for him and dont poison him against the .243.
The .308 he has will hit harder than any .243 and its a good choice for Australia. Any gunshop in Australia will normally carry a couple of varietys even out beyond the Black Stump. If someone ran out some shooter will have a mate that can hook you up with .308 ammo in a pinch.
I just like the unique way you describe the usefulness of a .243 its always worth trying to drag out a comment or leave an opening in a post to get your response.
Look after the boy teach him well and look after his .35 Whelen. After all its on loan to you and hopefully he will discipline many cats with it when he eventually takes posssession.
I cant knock the Whelen ive never fired one but if i did you might ring me up and set me straight so i just gotta harp on about the other little cartridge.

Chris maybe we can get together soon an you can have a shot of the Whelen.

 

[CBH Australia]

Paging @Bob Nelson 35Whelen
That’s possible down the track This shit virus stuffed things up and I spend half my time away at work and half at home working, (when I’m not online here) Good idea when it’s possible.
I have an old house we are sinking all we can spare into it, its dragged out 2 years and still going but there should give something back when it’s done. My wife has relatives on the coast she might want to go back sometime.
Anyway you gave Panther Shooter your views on the poor little .243,
You know If you turn all the .243 barrels to garden stakes, The ones medium actions still can’t be .35 Whelen’s maybe you would settle on .358 Winchester’s if it’s gotta be a .35,
A quick google shows a .25 Souper as the Wildcat that would fill the need for a .25 unless you like the .260Rem or the now popular 6.5CM

How does the ,25 Souper compare to your .25, all things being equal based on some early cartridge designs. Do the other 2 modern cartridges do any better in terms of performance?
I gotta go get busy.
Cheers,

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Paging @Bob Nelson 35Whelen
That’s possible down the track This shit virus stuffed things up and I spend half my time away at work and half at home working, (when I’m not online here) Good idea when it’s possible.
I have an old house we are sinking all we can spare into it, its dragged out 2 years and still going but there should give something back when it’s done. My wife has relatives on the coast she might want to go back sometime.
Anyway you gave Panther Shooter your views on the poor little .243,
You know If you turn all the .243 barrels to garden stakes, The ones medium actions still can’t be .35 Whelen’s maybe you would settle on .358 Winchester’s if it’s gotta be a .35,
A quick google shows a .25 Souper as the Wildcat that would fill the need for a .25 unless you like the .260Rem or the now popular 6.5CM

How does the ,25 Souper compare to your .25, all things being equal based on some early cartridge designs. Do the other 2 modern cartridges do any better in terms of performance?
I gotta go get busy.
Cheers,

The 25 Souper is a good cartridge comparable to the 257 Roberts, it's about 300 fps slower than my 25 on the M17 action. The 358 is a very underrated cartridge that punches well above it's weight with standard cup and core projectiles. Even the 338 federal loaded with woodleigh projectiles in its velocity parameters is fine.
The 6.5 crudmore is just a reinvention of the wheel. All it is is the 25 savage AI necked up and given a slightly different shoulder angle. Doesn't do anything the old 6.5x55 won't do. If it wasn't for all the bullshit hype the crudmore wouldn't have gotten off the ground, come to think of it Winchester advertised the he'll out of the 243 to convince people it was the ducks guts. Now enlightened shooters are finding they were duped by this false advertising and that the old cartridges that have been doing the job so well for so long are actually better.
To start with everyone bagged out the 300 win mag with its short neck, companies developed bigger and better like the 300/378. The smart people stuck with the 300 win mag because it just plain works.
Advertising sells guns, brains buy what is proven and useful.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Ragman]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen I’ll start off by saying that I love your posts. I feel we’re on the same page and your writing style cracks me up! That’s why I nearly cried when a read of you hatred of the beautiful.243 Win! I’m very curious as to the bullet failure one kangaroos and goats that you mentioned. What weight of bullet? Here in Saskatchewan, my family and many hunting acquaintances use the .243 with 100 grain bullets with great success on whitetails, mule deer and pronghorns. While not ideal for moose, elk and black bear, my goddaughter has killed all three with hers without a problem.
Not looking to start a debate, just thought you’d be interested. By the way, I’m going to steal your phrase “the duck’s guts”!
Cheers

 

[CBH Australia]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen I’ll start off by saying that I love your posts. I feel we’re on the same page and your writing style cracks me up! That’s why I nearly cried when a read of you hatred of the beautiful.243 Win! I’m very curious as to the bullet failure one kangaroos and goats that you mentioned. What weight of bullet? Here in Saskatchewan, my family and many hunting acquaintances use the .243 with 100 grain bullets with great success on whitetails, mule deer and pronghorns. While not ideal for moose, elk and black bear, my goddaughter has killed all three with hers without a problem.
Not looking to start a debate, just thought you’d be interested. By the way, I’m going to steal your phrase “the duck’s guts”!
Cheers

See Bob,
The Whitetail Hunters are big fans of the handy little “Allrounder” the .243,
I do hope he backs up his Goddaughter when bear hunting though, He might need a Whelen for that task.

 

[sambarhunter]

By the way, I’m going to steal your phrase “the duck’s guts”!

The true colloquialism is "the ducks nuts"

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen I’ll start off by saying that I love your posts. I feel we’re on the same page and your writing style cracks me up! That’s why I nearly cried when a read of you hatred of the beautiful.243 Win! I’m very curious as to the bullet failure one kangaroos and goats that you mentioned. What weight of bullet? Here in Saskatchewan, my family and many hunting acquaintances use the .243 with 100 grain bullets with great success on whitetails, mule deer and pronghorns. While not ideal for moose, elk and black bear, my goddaughter has killed all three with hers without a problem.
Not looking to start a debate, just thought you’d be interested. By the way, I’m going to steal your phrase “the duck’s guts”!
Cheers

Ragman
Projectiles I have seen fail in the 243:-
80 grain federal blue box failure on Kangaroos bullet just drilled a 243 cal hole thru the chest of them.
87grain VMax blow up on goats and pigs
95grain Nosler balistic tip blow up on pigs and goats. Failure to expand on same, sometimes work. Unreliable performance. Use on 2 fallow deer required follow up shots due to bullet failure.
One red deer wounded and escaped using 87 grain hornaday soft point.
The list is bigger but that gives you an idea why I don't like it.
When I bought a chronograph to work up loads for my 25 Epps Newton improved. This was both a good and bad thing as I was able to develop some safe outstanding loads for my rifles while helping friends with their loads.
2 friends had Tikka t3 lite and loaded them with max loads of Varget and H4350. Loads with any 87 grain projectile while very accurate only just managed 2,900 fps. The book velocity for thier loads was3,200 fps. The 95 grain managed 2,900 fps in both TIKKA rifles and a madel 70 Winchester. Even trying H4831sc velocity was only slightly better. The 80 grain Federals did crack the 3,000 fps mark.
Figures like this are disheartening when you expect better. The old 250 savage was doing these speeds 30 years before the 243 arrived with much fanfare and hype.
My son's SMLE NO4 action in 25/303 Epps Newton improved is getting 3,400fps with a 90 grain Speer HPBT, 3,300 fps with any 100 grain and 2,900 fps with a 117 grain Hornaday SST. This is without exceeding 49,000 cup according to load from a disc.
Maybe loaded with the correct bullets like the 95 grain SST or a good 100grain it might work ok but for this little black duck until proven otherwise I will never have a 243 and will continue to think the barrel should be a tomato stake and rwpaced with something useful in the 08 family
I hope this explains my stance and doesn't piss you off to much. I am glad you find it a good cartridge but I don't.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

The true colloquialism is "the ducks nuts"

Sambarhunter
Where I come from in NSW it been the ducks guts for as long as I can remember. Even my dad used the term and he was older than me.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

See Bob,
The Whitetail Hunters are big fans of the handy little “Allrounder” the .243,
I do hope he backs up his Goddaughter when bear hunting though, He might need a Whelen for that task.

CBH
Chris I have no problems with people who use the 243 as long as they match the bullet to the game, which unfortunately a lot of people don't. They get a couple of dry kills with an 87 grain bullet and assume it's the ducks guts for everything. You wouldn't use a 105 grain 243 on rabbits so why use an 87 grain bullet on pigs. Horses for courses. I have no doubts that used correctly and within its limits it's a good cartridge but to me it's to big for small game and not big enough for medium game. To me a cartridge should be chosen to work well when things go to he'll in a hand basket not just when everything is ideal. That's why I choose what I do. They just plain work all the time or I go bigger or go home.
Cheers mate Bob.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

See Bob,
The Whitetail Hunters are big fans of the handy little “Allrounder” the .243,
I do hope he backs up his Goddaughter when bear hunting though, He might need a Whelen for that task.

Chris
Notice Ragman is using 100 grain bullets in his 243 so he is wisely marching the bullet to the game.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[CBH Australia]

Yeah , I’m just having a dig,
Its the Bears that get my Attention.
I saw a stuffed black bear in Bullets and Bits at Orange. Thats where I got some Outer Edge projectiles I .308,
Gonna get some Outer Edge for the .243, they might be the Silver Bullet we need to get the .243 sorted.
Anyway about the bear’s. I’m fascinated by Grizzly etc they would make the most amazing rug other than a Lion. I can’t afford to hunt either but they have always fascinated me. When I grow up I want to be a DG Hunter.

Apparently the Black bear are more common and reasonably priced to hunt and they use the term colour phase to describe the various colours that an be found. They can be in brownish and cinnamon shades like a Grizzly.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Yeah , I’m just having a dig,
Its the Bears that get my Attention.
I saw a stuffed black bear in Bullets and Bits at Orange. Thats where I got some Outer Edge projectiles I .308,
Gonna get some Outer Edge for the .243, they might be the Silver Bullet we need to get the .243 sorted.
Anyway about the bear’s. I’m fascinated by Grizzly etc they would make the most amazing rug other than a Lion. I can’t afford to hunt either but they have always fascinated me. When I grow up I want to be a DG Hunter.

Apparently the Black bear are more common and reasonably priced to hunt and they use the term colour phase to describe the various colours that an be found. They can be in brownish and cinnamon shades like a Grizzly.

Chris
I would love a cinnamon.

 

[Ragman]

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen I’m not pissed at all. Agree 100% that you need to use a proper weight bullet. For our larger game I myself wouldn’t use it, but many do. I think a hog would be a poorer choice for the .243 than a moose. Especially with the bullets you stated. Pigs are solid!

 

[Major Khan]

I would highly recommend the following 2 calibres of rifles for dealing with feral cats :
> .243 Winchester
Or
> .22 Hornet

If the operator is utilizing a shot gun , then a 12 Bore shot gun loaded with British AAA cartridges or American AAA cartridges ( centre and right of my photograph ) would do pleasantly against any feral cats .

 

[Dr Ray]

Bob Nelson 35 Whelen
What game did you see the .243 Winchester being used on , in Australia ?
My ten year old grandson uses a .243 Winchester ( It is a Model 70 control round feed bolt action rifle ) for hunting Kakar ( Barking) Deer . My daughter ( his mother ) is the license holder for the .243 Winchester . We use Winchester 100 grain factory loaded soft nose ammunition for it . The boy has successfully dispatched seven Kakar Deer with it , in the last two years. . I would really hesitate to use it on a Chital Deer , however . When I first purchased the rifle for my daughter ten years ago , she did manage to secure one Chital Deer with it , though . She had selected the region behind the ear , as a target . I would not recommend the .243 Winchester to be employed against any game larger than a Kakar Deer , however.
I am certain that you speak from some genuinely negative personal experiences when you condemn the .243 Winchester.

243 is just ok on small deer.
My view of the 243 (had 2) is that’s it too heavy for light use and too light for
heavy use.
Bit of a problem Child!

 

[nztimb]

243 is just ok on small deer.
My view of the 243 (had 2) is that’s it too heavy for light use and too light for
heavy use.
Bit of a problem Child!

Exactly. Always been my opinion of it as well.

 

[Tubby’s Canteen]

Yeah , I’m just having a dig,
Its the Bears that get my Attention.
I saw a stuffed black bear in Bullets and Bits at Orange. Thats where I got some Outer Edge projectiles I .308,
Gonna get some Outer Edge for the .243, they might be the Silver Bullet we need to get the .243 sorted.
Anyway about the bear’s. I’m fascinated by Grizzly etc they would make the most amazing rug other than a Lion. I can’t afford to hunt either but they have always fascinated me. When I grow up I want to be a DG Hunter.

Apparently the Black bear are more common and reasonably priced to hunt and they use the term colour phase to describe the various colours that an be found. They can be in brownish and cinnamon shades like a Grizzly.

I just priced a black bear hunt in Newfoundland 3000usd for a week and two bear tags