Double Rifle Sights out to 300 yards?

[ftrovato]

Maybe this is a dumb question. Can anyone explain why many double rifles are claimed to have their open sights regulated to 100, 200 & 300 yards? Is it so? Why & how can open sights be realistically zeroed and then used to these distances? Remember we are firing two barrels on one sight plain....

 

[grand veneur]

In the past, some DR were even of request regulated up to 500 yards. Whether hunters in the past shot with DR and open sights that far or some still do it, is another question. Double rifles regulated to several hundred yards was most likely done for advertising purposes for the quality of the delivered rifles. Nowadays it is in my opinion and especially by big bore DR, mainly used for decoration because several graved folding sights on a DR give the rifle a certain flair of tradition. Nevertheless, it must be noted that with good eyesight and some training you can shoot at longer distances with a rifle and also a DR by using open sights. With smaller and medium caliber DR it is certainly possible, with the bigger calibers it will certainly be a little more difficult if you want to use a bench, what is necessary for shooting at several hundred yards.

 

[grand veneur]

My old double rifle caliber 577 Nitro Express from Webley & Scott is, as it should be, regulated up to 300 yards. I shot just for fun at 200m at the target of another shooter with the cold right barrel using the 300 yards sight, the rifle resting on his sandbags. The impact was a little deeper as the aimed point 10, but I did not continue the experiment so I don't know what would have happened with both barrels. I just wanted to drill a big hole in the target of the other shooter and was also surprised by the result.

 

[Red Leg]

Interesting how times change. My Blaser S2 has a single rear sight that puts both bullets dead on at seventy yards. However, with a scope mounted, for which the rifle is designed, it will shoot a four shot LxR/LxR group at 100 yards under 2.5 inches. I have easily killed game with it out to nearly 250 yards.

 

[Wahoo]

I’d echo that sentiment- when a double is well regulated it’s a wonderful thing. The .375 HH barrels on my Heym have 1 standing and 2 folding leaves (sensibly in my mind engraved 50 and 100 on the folding) for the rear sight however I much appreciate the scope. I don’t think the kudu appreciated it much at 260 yds however….

 

[ftrovato]

I’d echo that sentiment- when a double is well regulated it’s a wonderful thing. The .375 HH barrels on my Heym have 1 standing and 2 folding leaves (sensibly in my mind engraved 50 and 100 on the folding) for the rear sight however I much appreciate the scope. I don’t think the kudu appreciated it much at 260 yds however….
View attachment 654968

How did you come up with mounts for your scope? Was the rifle customized to accommodate the scope mounts? thx

 

[Wahoo]

How did you come up with mounts for your scope? Was the rifle customized to accommodate the scope mounts? thx

Hi. I purchased rifle secondhand and claw mounts with the illuminated SB scope were already on the .375 barrels. Per the build sheet I acquired from Heym the original owner requested it from factory that way when ordered - The gun was built as a .470 NE with an extra set of .375 HH barrels with the scope /claw mounts factory installed.

 

[zephyr]

My 1903 Gibbs 450 NE has a fixed sight and two folding leafs filed for 100 and 200 yards using these sights I have successfully shot non dangerous game out 100 yards and steel out to 200 yards.. In TR's African Game Trails he talks about shooting plains game with the little 30 US out to 500 yards .. I wonder though if some of the earlier doubles with sights out 500 yards and more were possibly used as suppression fire when hunters and explorers found themselves facing un-friendlies

 

[Red Leg]

I’d echo that sentiment- when a double is well regulated it’s a wonderful thing. The .375 HH barrels on my Heym have 1 standing and 2 folding leaves (sensibly in my mind engraved 50 and 100 on the folding) for the rear sight however I much appreciate the scope. I don’t think the kudu appreciated it much at 260 yds however….
View attachment 654968

Or this inyala well beyond 150 (30 06 barrels).

 

[ftrovato]

Or this inyala well beyond 150 (30 06 barrels).

Where did you get those scope mounts? thx

 

[Red Leg]

Where did you get those scope mounts? thx

The Blaser S2 uses the same detachable mounts as the R8.

 

[Franco]

Not sure I'd try it on a trophy, but on a recent cull hunt in Australia I made several shots in the 150 - 200 yds range with my Heym 450-400 double.

Nice looking rifle Red Leg

 

[rookhawk]

Maybe this is a dumb question. Can anyone explain why many double rifles are claimed to have their open sights regulated to 100, 200 & 300 yards? Is it so? Why & how can open sights be realistically zeroed and then used to these distances? Remember we are firing two barrels on one sight plain....

They were all completely nonsensical. In the era when new with the Kynoch ammo of the day, they were less reliable than a current era custom load in the same rifle.

The ethics at the time were not the same as they are today so I suspect a lot of spray-and-pray on predators and less noble game animals occurred.

Lastly, I think it was a bit of marketing that you spent more than I did on your gun in 1905 and your gun has one standing sight at 50 yards and FIVE folding sights out to 500 yards, whereas mine only had two folding leaves for 100 and 200 yards so mine must be lesser in quality. Maker's/Buyer's inference being: You have a better gun obviously since you have more sights for farther distances.

 

[rookhawk]

A relevant metaphor:

 

[Huvius]

I don't think they were nonsensical at all.
My A. Henry 500BPE shoots to the 200yd leaf and I would think that a rifle with longer sights chambered in the same or similar cartridge as the match rifles of the day could shoot accurately to 300yds for sure.
Consider that match rifles could place a bullet in a 13" bullseye with regularity at 1000yds using black powder and paper patched bullets!

Also, consider that for many late 19th/early 20thC professionals, their double rifle would be used for whatever distance they had to be used at. If 200yds is as close as you could get to a nice tusker, then that was the shot you took. No ivory hunter in those days would simply allow his livelihood to walk off into the grass hoping a closer shot presented itself on another day.
With a single fixed 50 or 100yd sight, holdover for a longer shot is impossible (or at least foolish) with a double rifle. Your target is completely obscured by the barrels so folding leaves are really the only solution.

 

[Safari Dave]

Being the contrarian, I do think folding leaf sights out to 300 yards are ridicules for a DR.


My Heym .470 is set at 35, 50, 100 and 150.

Based on a whole lot of shooting, 100 would be pushing my limit.

(Mine stays on 35)

 

[rookhawk]

Being the contrarian, I do think folding leaf sights out to 300 yards are ridicules for a DR.


My Heym .470 is set at 35, 50, 100 and 150.

Based on a whole lot of shooting, 100 would be pushing my limit.

(Mine stays on 35)

My Heym has the same setup on both 375 and 470 barrels. I have no idea if they function when up, but they certainly look the part when down. I've even seen Heyms with three leafs installed, but not even filed in. They just put them on because they look darn cool.

If the standing sight doesn't regulate, you're just too far away!

 

[Safari Dave]

My Heym has the same setup on both 375 and 470 barrels. I have no idea if they function when up, but they certainly look the part when down. I've even seen Heyms with three leafs installed, but not even filed in. They just put them on because they look darn cool.

If the standing sight doesn't regulate, you're just too far away!

I agree with rookhawk.

I think the manufacturers only regulate at the closest range, and anything farther is "speculation."

IMO, DR's are short range rifles. Made to shoot with open sights, but some can be fitted with scopes and red-dots.

Mine doesn't even have a place to mount optics, and I'm OK with that.

 

[Red Leg]

I agree with rookhawk.

I think the manufacturers only regulate at the closest range, and anything farther is "speculation."

IMO, DR's are short range rifles. Made to shoot with open sights, but some can be fitted with scopes and red-dots.

Mine doesn't even have a place to mount optics, and I'm OK with that.

Then be sure and not ever buy an S2 off the used rifle rack.

 

[Safari Dave]

I don't own one, and really don't have a desire to, but I believe Blasers are great rifles.

I've never understood, the "one rifle with multiple barrels" concept, unless multiple barrels could count as one rifle.

If not, just give me multiple rifles,


I'd rather have 2 - $7,000 rifles than one $14,000 rifle, but I know that Americans have a better situation than most of the rest of the world.