Decisions, decisions...Looking for some help!

[Monsai52]

Thanks Brian, always good to hear from you on all things Mannlicher schoenauer!

Best regards,

 

[Shootist43]

Brian Rothammer, I don't own any MS branded rifles. I am familiar with their reputation for being highly engineered and having tight machining tolerances. It is great having guys like yourself that can add "specifics" to questions like this one that has me firmly convinced that AH is the best site on the web for getting good / reasoned answers. Thanks

 

[riflepermits.com]

Welcome to AH and the posting side! Great to have you here.

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

Brian Rothammer, I don't own any MS branded rifles. I am familiar with their reputation for being highly engineered and having tight machining tolerances. It is great having guys like yourself that can add "specifics" to questions like this one that has me firmly convinced that AH is the best site on the web for getting good / reasoned answers. Thanks

Thank you, sir, and I am humbled by the compliment.

There are many here, surely yourself included, who have vastly more firearms experience / knowledge than I though I have accumulated information regarding the Mannlicher Schoenauer since having acquired my Grand Dad's cased M1910 Take Down Model about 1990.

In those pre internet days it soon became evident that much of what little information was to be found in the U.S. regarding the MS was flawed, inaccurate, or just plain wrong.

Twentieth Century female human; subspecies librarian.


One stroke of fortune was that one of the Stoeger Shooter's Bible of the late 1980s had an article called Mysterious Metrics (IIRC) by Don Henry. That not only helped to confirm / verify handloading information for the 9.5X57 - .375 Nitro Express Rimless but put me in touch with Mannlicher Collector's Association archivist Kevin Tikker who supplied valuable information and past club newsletters.

Not Kevin Tikker



In more recent years I discovered that the magic of the internet had allowed even more misinformation to proliferate regarding the MS, much of it potentially damaging, and have sought to provide accurate information to those who may appreciate such.

AH is one of (very) few 'sites that I recommend to others for accurate information regarding the MS, a thread of which may be found here: https://www.africahunting.com/threa...908-m1910-m1924-m1925-or-high-velocity.47277/

 

[Velo Dog]

Hello gjwardman,

Since your rifle thoughts are posted here in your opening thread, within the “Introductions & Greets” portion of the forum, I am presuming that you are a new member.
So…..

Khomas Highland Safaris of Namibia, welcomes you to the greatest forum on earth.

As for Mannlicher-Schoenauer rifles, I love them, especially the older models.
A few short years back, I called a seller of the Sequoia Model (caliber .30-06), in what appeared to be remaining in nearly new condition.
Alas, it had sold just before I called.
Oye vey.

Anyway, Best Regards,
Velo Dog.

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

A few short years back, I called a seller of the Sequoia Model (caliber .30-06), in what appeared to be remaining in nearly new condition.
Alas, it had sold just before I called.
Oye vey.

Ouch.

I've long considered a Sequoia.

Not only are they 'the best of both worlds' having pre WW2 MS craftsmanship with the readily available and powerful 'U.S. Cartridge of 1906', but I live near the South entrance to Sequoia National Park.

I saw a rather nice one 'go by' online a few years back for $1200 or so, seller was in same state, been kicking self since.

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

I recently found a hen's tooth - a complete 1903 Steyr receiver with functioning rotary magazine.

I noticed on another thread that you had acquired a 'Steyr 1907' MS action. Is that the one referenced in this thread?

An MS receiver stamped (originally) 'STEYR 1907' is a 'Greek Contract' Y1903 and was originally configured for the 6.5X54MS cartridge.

Here is animation of your 'action' in action:

Y1903 variants in original form:

The cartridge (DWM 477):

Eley / Kynoch:

Magazine:

Ballistics:

 

[Global Rescue]

Welcome to the posting side. Enjoy.

 

[gjwardman]

Thanks for all the commentary and knowledge.
I cheated and joined the Mannlicher Schoenauer Collectors Association after many years away from it. Plan is to put a hexagonal barrel on it in 9x56 MS or 9.5x56MS/9.5x57. I found a stock 95% stock for it California Claro Walnut... I'll do all the hand-fitting myself...

As this thread was going, I found a 6.5 MS rifle for $450 on an obscure website. Stock will need to be 'touched up' to undo some "customizing", but the pictures of the bore and rifling were top notch.

 

[AfricaHunting.com]

Welcome to AH gjwardman!

 

[steve white]

The Mannlicher Collectors Assoc. still exists. I miss Don Henry (whom Brian mentioned above) since his passing. They are a great bunch of people who live and breath all things Mannlicher. I say this because Don Henry would be the first to advise you NOT to try to change cartridges since the spindles are SO caliber specific and have proven insurmountable headaches in many cases to even try to change out. And it doesn't work to just change out rotary magazines which are impossible to find since most folks want matching numbers everywhere. Are you SURE it is a 1903--the 8x56 made its debut in the model 1908 which looks about identical. Now some people have successfully rechambered by 1 mm to 8x57 (I bought one), decreasing resale dollars and risking running too high pressures for the older steels by shooting the more powerful European variants of the 8x57. But it is a much better prospect for any conversion of that rotary magazine, not requiring debarrelling which is the case with the 7x57. The pre-model 1950 have a lot more metal in the spindle (requiring much more skilled labor to enlarge the diameter of each and every cartridge cradle in the spindle and involving other things to make it feed. I changed one to 7x57 because it is possible to go to a smaller bore diameter (and can be impossible to go larger.) I know hope springs eternal, and you would rather dream of conversion, but these are the FACTS. BESIDES, you can always buy other Mannlichers just as you would other calibers in other rifles
Good find ! You won't regret it--Mannlichers are addictive. The 8mm cartridges are not to be despised in their own right. One thing I love is they are COMPLETELY field strippable without tools--only a cartridge tip for a tool or at most pencil point to help with the spindle strip down. Love them. Enjoy!

 

[steve white]

257 Roberts might work. 318, 333, any other larger, fatter, non x57 CASE will emphatically not work. 9.5x57 will probably require enlarging the spindle where the neck/bullet lies, and might have other problems, Swede might, don't know. Everyone will want to hear how the project turns out--not trying to throw cold water, just prevent heartache, lol

 

[gjwardman]

The receiver is a 1907 Greek...comparing against the 1908 8x56 MS that I have, there is a lot more metal to the 1907...I will stick with a MS cartridge when I re-caliber because I really don't want to screw up the spindle...

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

The receiver is a 1907 Greek...comparing against the 1908 8x56 MS that I have, there is a lot more metal to the 1907...I will stick with a MS cartridge when I re-caliber because I really don't want to screw up the spindle...

The logical choice, then, is 6.5X54. That is the cartridge for which the receiver was configured, 'Greek' surplus magazines are often available (Ebay has a few now), It was the original MS cartridge and has been highly regarded for well over a century for several good reasons.

Your receiver is a Y1903. The 'Greek contracts' were Y1903, Y1903/14, Y1903/14/27 (Breda), and 'System 1930'. The 1907 date is the year that particular batch was manufactured which would be a Y1903. If it has a large anchor on its bridge it is a rare Navy model.

Also, 'off the shelf' ammunition is usually available for the 6.5X64 MS.

 

[steve white]

Thanks for all the commentary and knowledge.
I cheated and joined the Mannlicher Schoenauer Collectors Association after many years away from it. Plan is to put a hexagonal barrel on it in 9x56 MS or 9.5x56MS/9.5x57. I found a stock 95% stock for it California Claro Walnut... I'll do all the hand-fitting myself...

As this thread was going, I found a 6.5 MS rifle for $450 on an obscure website. Stock will need to be 'touched up' to undo some "customizing", but the pictures of the bore and rifling were top notch.

Mind sharing that "obscure website"....?
I would LOVE to find a 6.5 MS project!

 

[African Sporting Creations]

Welcome to the family!

 

[Brian Rothhammer]

Minute of Mae, MS Y1903/14:

 

[gjwardman]

Welcome to the family!

for some reason, they have been popping up on Gunbroker.com recently...its kinda nuts and very cyclical...a 6.5x54 MS complete receiver went for $150 last week.. I have 2 so I didn't bid...

 

[gjwardman]

Mind sharing that "obscure website"....?
I would LOVE to find a 6.5 MS project!

for some reason, they have been popping up on Gunbroker.com recently...its kinda nuts and very cyclical...a 6.5x54 MS complete receiver went for $150 last week.. I have 2 so I didn't bid...