Buying a game farm Again

[mark-hunter]

Consider also, that many of (european or international) banks will not give loans to a game farm, and hunting tuorism.
(Been told about this, by my PH, when hunted in Namibia)

What I have heard is that most of the farms today, if bought by foreigners are bought by rich men, for their own pleasure, not for long term profitable business (like russian taycoons, or arab oil sheikhs)

 

[Rare Breed]

All that for only 600 acres....fk got nearly 8000 with game..dams you can have for that money.....

Completely agree. Lived in TX 9 years. Land is super expensive and no bargain anymore

 

[Serbian Hunter]

Consider also, that many of (european or international) banks will not give loans to a game farm, and hunting tuorism.
(Been told about this, by my PH, when hunted in Namibia)

What I have heard is that most of the farms today, if bought by foreigners are bought by rich men, for their own pleasure, not for long term profitable business (like russian taycoons, or arab oil sheikhs)

You are right Mark about the loans but having in mind risk level related to this kind of investment I would go w/o loan. We have saying "stretch as much as your blanket is long" because I can not afford to have drought plus bank knocking on the door every month. One disaster at the time I can survive
Wasn't aware about tycoons and sheikhs but make sense that they was after expensive toys w/o caring about profitability.

 

[mark-hunter]

@Serbian Hunter
Kaze: "Rasiri se koliko ti je dug jorgan"... ili "kratak jorgan - duga noc"...

In any case, big investment in game farm in some African country, is very risky enterprise.
And, of all the countries, Namibia would be most promising, as it looks from my perspective.

Having shared same thought, my personal view is, that following such a dream, a smaller investment would be more prudent - buying a small property in rural area, and enjoy hunting and sightseeng as local, and not getting involved in safari business, at first.
Developping a profitable (large) ranch business will take a lifetime of one generation at least, and buying a well run ranch will be extremely high investement, with high risks involved.

 

[Frederik]

Instead of buying a farm why not help a big well known outfit with upliffting their concessions buy quota help with cashflow and you could actually earn some money have the pleasure to help run a concession and enjoy with some good hunting.

Then in a few years you could do it with another concession even other outfit in a different country?

 

[spike.t]

Instead of buying a farm why not help a big well known outfit with upliffting their concessions buy quota help with cashflow and you could actually earn some money have the pleasure to help run a concession and enjoy with some good hunting.

Then in a few years you could do it with another concession even other outfit in a different country?

Deoending on country Most concessions dont exactly have long leases, so jumping around sounds costly....but in a similar idea could always look at buying a shareholding in an existing game ranch , as long as you were confident and knew and trusted whoever you would be in partnership with.....a cheaper way of doing it....

 

[Newboomer]

Unless you are going to live there fulltime and make it your livelihood I'd vote against it. Too much risk and not enough gain. Farming is a 24-7 operation, not something you can do now and then. Better to work a deal with an existing property owner, spend some time boots on the ground and see how you feel after several months or a year. It will take that long to get the feel of the operation.

 

[Wheels]

"I had a farm in Africa" Karen Blixen



Africa is a special place for most of us. As hunters and tourists, we have had wonderful experiences in her realms, without any of the true difficulties.

There is something special about Africa, setting on your own land, in your own chair, drinking coffee your land produced, eating food your land produced, watching your estate grow.

But.......

It is hard enough being a farmer when you live on the land. It is much harder being a farmer while living half a world away. When you are not present, it is amazing how many of your calf's are stillborn while your partners cows produce twins. It is humbling to be woken to a fire racing through and completely destroying your timber only to find it was set by disgruntled employees who hadn't been paid for months by the manager who had used payroll for his own purposes. It is frustrating to have tens of thousands of saplings in a nursery, hear they died of drought after being transplanted, go back a few months later to see where they were supposedly planted and realize that most were never planted but evidently sold behind your back for others to plant in their fields. (Note, these examples are not the same manager) The stories go on.........

The ways a foreign partner can be separated from his money are way to numerous to mention. Africa specializes in this industry.

If you buy land in Africa to live on, then you have a very real chance as long as you choose the right country, the right property at the right price and surround yourself with the right team. If you can't do all five then you should give a tremendous amount of thought to not perusing ventures in her bowels.

International hunting is a dying industry. Buying a game farm and going against the macro trend could prove exceptionally difficult.

I have failed at many things in my life. Fortunately I have been successful in a few. There is a reason for the quote that appears at the bottom of my posts.

 

[VertigoBE]

Instead of buying a farm why not help a big well known outfit with upliffting their concessions buy quota help with cashflow and you could actually earn some money have the pleasure to help run a concession and enjoy with some good hunting.

Then in a few years you could do it with another concession even other outfit in a different country?

Hello Frederik, would you be able to expand a bit on this idea? Are you talking about a time share system or similar?

Thanks,

V.

 

[flatwater bill]

SH.................I'm all for it. I think it's a great idea. What could possibly go wrong? Drive around the farm, shoot a few antelope, and watch the money roll in. A fun adventure......good luck.......FWB............(PS, I could be wrong.)

 

[mark-hunter]

@Frederik
I am also interested to hear, how this model that you are suggestiing can work? Could you give more details?

 

[Frederik]

First let me explain I have not done it before or have had dealings like this ever, it was just an idea basically you carry help carry cashflow. For example if I'm not mistaken concession in Tanzania has to pay 40% of the animal quota even if they are not hunted?

Or in South Africa you could help pay allocated quota or offtake for the year even day fees upfront that will help the Outfitter with cashflow and you could earn some money on top of that and have good hunting in return if you don't want to take your share.

So basically rolling capital/cashflow and when you come you don't pay the full price on your day fees and animals but cost and you might make some money on top of it.

This way you are not stuck with a permanent base unless you would like to go on and can move to another area consession farm with the same outfitter or others?

 

[bowjijohn]

I had a farm in Africa

not Karen Blixen - my grandma

“You own nothing in Africa that you can’t hold by force of arms”

my (adopted) grandpa

 

[YancyW]

I view African game farms like I view planes, I want to have many friends who own one.

 

[Red Leg]

First let me explain I have not done it before or have had dealings like this ever, it was just an idea basically you carry help carry cashflow. For example if I'm not mistaken concession in Tanzania has to pay 40% of the animal quota even if they are not hunted?

Or in South Africa you could help pay allocated quota or offtake for the year even day fees upfront that will help the Outfitter with cashflow and you could earn some money on top of that and have good hunting in return if you don't want to take your share.

So basically rolling capital/cashflow and when you come you don't pay the full price on your day fees and animals but cost and you might make some money on top of it.

This way you are not stuck with a permanent base unless you would like to go on and can move to another area consession farm with the same outfitter or others?

So essentially, you act as a bank, providing the equivalent of a loan with some sort of expected return in the form of either shared profit or hunting opportunities? I'll pass.

 

[mark-hunter]

Me too. I'll pass.

 

[Frederik]

No easy way sorry. But Like I mentioned if you go with a large reputeable outfit you could help them expand.

 

[VonJager]

I don't know how anyone is recommending Texas, because there is NO WAY to buy land in Texas and be profitable from that land alone. You need large outside income to have your ranch in Texas. OP said, "positive experience from somebody who was brave and determined enough to replace office, concrete, boss and safety with farming at “last best place”?

He is trying to make a living with this plan, and you are not doing that with 600 acres in Texas for 4+ mill.

One of the reasons I left Texas was because it was obvious with land prices, that even though Obama and Biden say, "You are rich!" there is still no way I can afford a Ranch in Texas. And growing up there, hunting there, I would love almost nothing more, but short of a lottery win(and I do not but tickets, lol) it won't be in the cards.

I am not saying Africa has the answer either, but do not move to Texas to be a farmer/rancher(unless you have passive income or inheritance.)

 

[mdwest]

I don't know how anyone is recommending Texas, because there is NO WAY to buy land in Texas and be profitable from that land alone. You need large outside income to have your ranch in Texas. OP said, "positive experience from somebody who was brave and determined enough to replace office, concrete, boss and safety with farming at “last best place”?

He is trying to make a living with this plan, and you are not doing that with 600 acres in Texas for 4+ mill.

One of the reasons I left Texas was because it was obvious with land prices, that even though Obama and Biden say, "You are rich!" there is still no way I can afford a Ranch in Texas. And growing up there, hunting there, I would love almost nothing more, but short of a lottery win(and I do not but tickets, lol) it won't be in the cards.

I am not saying Africa has the answer either, but do not move to Texas to be a farmer/rancher(unless you have passive income or inheritance.)

The conversation has morphed a bit.. Initially, it was thought by some posting in here (myself included) that the OP was looking to invest in a property that would allow him the ability to hunt, etc.. and to own a "ranch".. it wasnt understood that he intended to actually become a farmer/rancher as a full time profession and to rely on that as a source of income..

I would agree with you... 600 acres in the hill country isnt affordable at todays rates and isnt going to produce enough revenue or margins to pay for itself, much less be able to operate at a profit..

But 40 acres in parts of West, South, East, or North TX (more than enough to qualify as a "ranch" in TX if properly zoned and stocked) would be affordable for most, could be huntable (throw out a feeder and an elevated blind and you now are hog and deer hunting), and would be a lot more secure/safe investment than most options in South Africa.. If you stay away from the big cities and the hill country, land can still be reasonable here (I actually just saw a 130 acre "ranch" in the SW part of the state going for about $1200 an acre that is reported to have deer, javalina, turkey, and a few other things on it.. as well as a small stream running through the middle of the property)..

I think that was the point that was being made in the early part of this thread..

 

[Hank2211]

So essentially, you act as a bank, providing the equivalent of a loan with some sort of expected return in the form of either shared profit or hunting opportunities? I'll pass.

Agree with Red Leg. I think this is actually worse than buying land. Buying into a business you don't control, especially one in a foreign country, is a recipe for disaster and ruined friendships. if you add in financial difficulties whether due to COVID, drought or whatever, the situation quickly becomes a nightmare. At least when you buy land you own something . . .

Don't misunderstand. I'm not immune to the feeling. I've often dreamed about owning a game ranch in Africa, but I've seen and heard too many horror stories to actually want to dip a toe in that water. I've hunted land owned by Europeans who visit once a year if that . . . and I assume they know they're being taken by managers, partners, etc., but are wealthy enough that the scale of the damage which can be/is done is essentially irrelevant to them. I'm not in that position . . .

Those who can make it work, live there.

The answer - only my opinion - if you find a place you love, is to develop a relationship with a landowner/outiftter you get along well with, and re-visit and hunt that place regularly. It will become, over time, much like "your" place, and you like one of the family . . . plus you will still have the money to hunt other places.

If I've learned a lesson in hunting around Africa it's that there's always another beautiful place to hunt, another interesting country to visit, more interesting people to meet.