Brass bullets pros and cons

[Bas]

The best .308 bullet for buffalo from my .300H&H is the 180 grain Woodleigh Hydro. It is pretty devastating.

I've thought about 30 cal. ......7x57 has been known to do the trick, so why not? Is the brass showing much bore wear or hard to clean out ?

 

[Bas]

The 260gr SOCOM is clicking along at 2900fps out of my .458B&M. Absolutely devastating on PG and one lioness.

High SD in regards to DG is just another way of saying heavy. While I don't dismiss SD altogether, it is a parameter that I think many rely a little to heavy on. SD is not static, it changes as soon as the bullet impacts the animal. At that point, the material and design of the bullet comes into play.

My belief is that when SD was first used, it was in regards to bullets who in comparison to what is available today pale. It was a good parameter to ensure you had enough mass in what was really a fairly low tech bullet.

But with the bonded lead bullets available and the mono-metal bullets available now, I don't think that a slightly lower, prior to shooting, lower SD or lower weight bullet is necessarily such a bad thing.

When @PaulT was still guiding for those big buff down in Australia, he had pretty much completely switched to the CEB "softs" and killed in the hundreds of buffalo with them.

Results of the 260gr on a quartering away shot on a cow BWB. Bullet entered just behind ribs and passed through heart eventually. The blades likely had very little effect on this shot, but the 'solid' shank did it's job.

View attachment 230802 View attachment 230803 View attachment 230804 View attachment 230805

Fantastic

So far, the 150 grain Woodleigh Hydro has turned the struggling little 1894 .30-30 into a quick and effective buffalo killer. Only two big bulls so far, but neither went more than five to ten steps.

Sweet!!!

 

[PaulT]

Bas.
P.M replied to.

Cheers.
P.T.

 

[IdaRam]

I have noticed something that I have never seen before in my limited load testing, with an increase in powder charge weight the velocity actually decreased. I am planning to verify this velocity decrease with a second chronograph in the next few days.

I’m developing loads with CEB’s right now for my .416 Rigby and .458 Win Mag. and have experienced the same velocity drop in the .416.
In the Rigby, 97.0 gr of RL-22 gives me an average velocity of 2437 fps with the 370 gr Raptor. Velocity drops off at 98.0 gr and above. I’ve gone up to 100.0 gr and still slower than the 97.0 gr load.
Accuracy with both the 370 gr Raptor and the 400 gr solid is excellent, sub MOA. And same point of impact at 100 yards.

 

[Bas]

Bas.
P.M replied to.

Cheers.
P.T.

Thanks very much !
Bob

 

[BenKK]

I've thought about 30 cal. ......7x57 has been known to do the trick, so why not? Is the brass showing much bore wear or hard to clean out ?

No, no different to using regular bullets.

 

[Bas]

No, no different to using regular bullets.

Thanks Ben,
Response I've received so far about brass bullets is by far positive. I appreciate your time and information.
Do you reload ? One gentleman said he uses a little less powder than what is used for conventional bullets.

Best regards, Bob

 

[Bas]

I have no practical experience with brass bullets other than limited range testing with the CEB solids that I have chosen for an upcoming buffalo hunt. I'm shooting the 300 grain .375 H&H. The bullet has a bore riding design with driving bands, I suspect this is to keep pressures lower. I have noticed something that I have never seen before in my limited load testing, with an increase in powder charge weight the velocity actually decreased. I am planning to verify this velocity decrease with a second chronograph in the next few days. Accuracy has been acceptable from the start as has velocity, my first loads with Winchester 760 slightly bettered my velocity goal of 2500 fps and the accuracy was just over MOA, but more importantly grouped very well with the 300 grain Swift A-frames. As far as barrel wear goes I doubt I'll ever shoot enough of any bullet in my .375 to matter. The same solvents that work for gilding metal or copper should work for brass I would think. I'm kinda with Phil on the cleaning, I don't do it until the accuracy falls off.

Very interesting comment about more powder/ velocity decrease . Please post more information when you come to a conclusion. I look forward to the results.
Thanks, Bob

 

[Bas]

I've only used the brass bullets from CEB in my .458 B&M. And for hunting only the 260gr version. I have put their 420gr "soft" and 450gr solid thru that rifle. From what I can see, due to their bore rider design, there's less strain on the barrel in comparison to a more conventional lead core bullet.

I would have to also believe it's in part due to the nature of the B&M cartridge, but for those of use that own one, we put as much powder in the case as possible and have very compressed loads. Brass "growth" after resizing is very small. I think I've only trimmed a few cases.

As far as cleaning goes, I don't know. I hate cleaning barrels and I haven't found a need to clean my .458 yet. Honestly the barrel looks the same and accuracy has not dropped off.

But I second the motion to have @PaulT join the conversation.

Thanks for the reply. Didn’t know about B&M and spent nearly an hour on their website last night. Very nice stuff, very interesting.
Thanks again, Bob

 

[WAB]

Does anyone know where one might get some of the old school 7mm solids for the 7x57? I think the originals were 163 or 168 gr?

 

[Bas]

Does anyone know where one might get some of the old school 7mm solids for the 7x57? I think the originals were 163 or 168 gr?

I would imagine they're not in current product. Try looking at Cutting Edge Bullets and Lehigh Defense, they might have something you like. Don't forget to check with Woodleigh as well.
Have a good one, Bob

 

[BenKK]

Thanks Ben,
Response I've received so far about brass bullets is by far positive. I appreciate your time and information.
Do you reload ? One gentleman said he uses a little less powder than what is used for conventional bullets.

Best regards, Bob

Yep, I load my own. I guess it depends on the cartridge. For my .300H&H the load with Hydros is identical to conventional softs of the same weight. Longer neck, maybe. Same with .375H&H and .416 Rigby. For .500 Jeffery I was forced to change recipes to a smaller weight of a different powder - but that was actually because of magazine length and feeding. So, in reality, using these Hydros has the potential to be exactly the same as loading for softs.

 

[BenKK]

Does anyone know where one might get some of the old school 7mm solids for the 7x57? I think the originals were 163 or 168 gr?

Unfortunately I don’t know of any conventional solids for 7mm. I think there is a 140 grain Hydro but I never tried it in the Rigby .275 I used-to own. I just used 175 grain Woodleigh RNSNs. Killed many buffalo and enormous boars with that rifle.

 

[IdaRam]

Does anyone know where one might get some of the old school 7mm solids for the 7x57? I think the originals were 163 or 168 gr?

@WAB , Graf & Sons carries 7mm 174 gr FMJ-BT (Privi Partizan) if you are looking for something to poke little holes in little animals.
Here’s a link
https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/156

 

[BobT]

Very interesting comment about more powder/ velocity decrease . Please post more information when you come to a conclusion. I look forward to the results.
Thanks, Bob

I dug out my data for the .375 caliber 300 grain CEB solid, in Federal cases with Federal 215 primers and Winchester 760 powder -

74.0 grains = average velocity 2532
76.0 grains = average velocity 2529
78.0 grains = average velocity 2520

Not a huge difference but there it is! Accuracy was just over MOA from all three loads.

 

[Bas]

I dug out my data for the .375 caliber 300 grain CEB solid, in Federal cases with Federal 215 primers and Winchester 760 powder -

74.0 grains = average velocity 2532
76.0 grains = average velocity 2529
78.0 grains = average velocity 2520

Not a huge difference but there it is! Accuracy was just over MOA from all three loads.

Thanks BobT,
Most replies about brass bullets have been positive. I'm convinced to give them a try.
The best to you, Bob

 

[Dr Ray]

I have been looking closely at the cutting edge bullets. I have a few boxes of them for a rifle I dont yet have They make both brass and copper in their fragmenting design. From my conversations with them I think brass is less malleable as it fragments into larger pieces than their copper which seems to peel more.

To break in a barrel I was told to use the softest bullet I had. So to me that indicates some detrimental effect with brass. Also, the brass bullet will leave less residue in your barrel, so I guess it could contribute to more wear.

As a guess I would assume the same.

 

[Bas]

As a guess I would assume the same.

I have contacted Weatherby, and waiting for the response.
Bob

 

[Bas]

Weatherby said go for it but remember really fast loads = accelerated bore wear.

 

[Bas]

PaulT said the faster they go the better the results. "Speed is your friend " with CEB.