Birthday Gift From Mrs. Delgado

[CoElkHunter]

Update , the gun does pattern well with A CERTAIN Type of 00 Buckshot
Winchester 12 pellet ( copper plated ) 2 3/4 inch 00 Buck Cartridges .
So l decided to stock up
PS : Also got a nice box of #2s which will be my roe deer load next month
View attachment 306343 View attachment 306344

Hoss,
I see from your photos, you have boxes of lead #2, #4, #6, and steel BB , other than #4 and 00 buckshot. I use the 4s for turkey and pheasant, and the 6s for grouse. #2 lead can’t be used any longer for geese, which is what I used to use decades ago. I’ve never used #4 or 00 buckshot for hunting. I know you’ve stated they use shot on roe deer in Sweden, but I would use the #4 buckshot, if someone forced me to use ANY loose shot on deer. AND, I’m surprised Sweden doesn’t require steel shot to hunt deer, given their stringent environmental regulations?
CEH

 

[thriller]

I have killed many deer and hogs with 00 buck as long as you are conscious of your range it works wonderfully with some hogs ranging up to the 300-325lb range @Hoss Delgado

 

[CoElkHunter]

I have killed many deer and hogs with 00 buck as long as you are conscious of your range it works wonderfully with some hogs ranging up to the 300-325lb range @Hoss Delgado

Have you ever shot 00 buck from a turkey choke? I was going to try it, but Hoss said I shouldn’t? That would be a tight wad of lead, almost like a slug?

 

[Hoss Delgado]

I have killed many deer and hogs with 00 buck as long as you are conscious of your range it works wonderfully with some hogs ranging up to the 300-325lb range @Hoss Delgado

Oh yes. 00 Buck is a beauty
My horrible tracking job resulted from shooting the hog with Number 4 Buck

 

[Hoss Delgado]

Hoss,
I see from your photos, you have boxes of lead #2, #4, #6, and steel BB , other than #4 and 00 buckshot. I use the 4s for turkey and pheasant, and the 6s for grouse. #2 lead can’t be used any longer for geese, which is what I used to use decades ago. I’ve never used #4 or 00 buckshot for hunting. I know you’ve stated they use shot on roe deer in Sweden, but I would use the #4 buckshot, if someone forced me to use ANY loose shot on deer. AND, I’m surprised Sweden doesn’t require steel shot to hunt deer, given their stringent environmental regulations?
CEH

CEH , l believe their law won't allow any shot size larger than #1 for Roe Deer
The 00 Buckshot is for use in the US for White tail , hogs and stuff Should pack a better punch than Number 4 Buck

 

[thriller]

Have you ever shot 00 buck from a turkey choke? I was going to try it, but Hoss said I shouldn’t? That would be a tight wad of lead, almost like a slug?

it will ruin your choke i have done it but it can break things, you can also buy chokes designed for buckshot.

 

[thriller]

Oh yes. 00 Buck is a beauty
My horrible tracking job resulted from shooting the hog with Number 4 Buck

I was just suggesting 00 over #4 buck i have seen the same issues on larger animals. Be careful with slugs out f a fixed choke just make sure it wont screw up your chokes.

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

To Co Elk Hunter
It would be ill advised to fire large size shot through a tight permanent choke . When l started my shikar career in 1962 , the man who sold me my shot-gun advised me not to fire shot sizes bigger than number 1 as the barrels were full choke. It was not until l had the barrels clipped down to 28 inch ( thus eliminating choke ) that l was able to fire SG through it.
The picture below is the barrels from a William Wellington Greener twelve bore double barrel shot-gun with horizontally stacked barrels . It took the 76 millimeter paper cartridge and had full choke. In 2008 a Bangladeshi hunter whose father was the gun’s first owner , decided to put an SG cartridge in it . The hull of the cartridge was plastic and it was a magnum cartridge . One can clearly see the results of this foolishness and he is lucky that , in spite of his injuries , he retained his life. Perhaps a modern gun with detachable choke might not get damaged but it is not worth risking one’s fire arm or their safety.
To Hoss Delgado ,
What you Americans call Number 4 buck , is only slightly larger than AAA . I would be very uncomfortable using this shot size for anything larger than crane or wild dog . The best shot size from my humble experience for deer and boar is SG . I am fond of the 12 pellet cartridge and not the 9 pellet cartridge. LG may seem attractive on account of it’s pellet size but it has too few pellets . SG is a good compromise . Your shot on that swine pictured , is commendable. However , performance is inconsistent depending upon the weight of the beast you are shooting , as your second experience notes.

 

[CoElkHunter]

it will ruin your choke i have done it but it can break things, you can also buy chokes designed for buckshot.

Thanks! I won’t try it then.

 

[CoElkHunter]

View attachment 306634 To Co Elk Hunter
It would be ill advised to fire large size shot through a tight permanent choke . When l started my shikar career in 1962 , the man who sold me my shot-gun advised me not to fire shot sizes bigger than number 1 as the barrels were full choke. It was not until l had the barrels clipped down to 28 inch ( thus eliminating choke ) that l was able to fire SG through it.
The picture below is the barrels from a William Wellington Greener twelve bore double barrel shot-gun with horizontally stacked barrels . It took the 76 millimeter paper cartridge and had full choke. In 2008 a Bangladeshi hunter whose father was the gun’s first owner , decided to put an SG cartridge in it . The hull of the cartridge was plastic and it was a magnum cartridge . One can clearly see the results of this foolishness and he is lucky that , in spite of his injuries , he retained his life. Perhaps a modern gun with detachable choke might not get damaged but it is not worth risking one’s fire arm or their safety.
To Hoss Delgado ,
What you Americans call Number 4 buck , is only slightly larger than AAA . I would be very uncomfortable using this shot size for anything larger than crane or wild dog . The best shot size from my humble experience for deer and boar is SG . I am fond of the 12 pellet cartridge and not the 9 pellet cartridge. LG may seem attractive on account of it’s pellet size but it has too few pellets . SG is a good compromise . Your shot on that swine pictured , is commendable. However , performance is inconsistent depending upon the weight of the beast you are shooting , as your second experience notes.

Kawshik Rahman,
Thanks so much for sharing this story and information! I just remembered I did something really stupid a couple of years ago. I screwed an improved cylinder choke into my 12 gauge Remington 11-87 for “sporting clays”. Unbeknownst to me, one of my modified 20 gauge chokes for my Remington 1100, was stuck inside the 12 gauge choke. I fired the 11-87 twice with light trap loads and realized something was wrong. I unscrewed the 12 gauge choke from the barrel and found the 20 gauge choke “welded “ to the inside of the 12 gauge choke. But, fortunately for me I was shooting the light loads and there was no damage to the barrel. I kept the welded choke as a reminder to me of a potential disaster averted, and to keep different gauge chokes separated. Anyway, when we all share these stories here on AH, I think we help everyone learn from our mistakes.
Thanks!
CEH

 

[Hoss Delgado]

View attachment 306634 To Co Elk Hunter
It would be ill advised to fire large size shot through a tight permanent choke . When l started my shikar career in 1962 , the man who sold me my shot-gun advised me not to fire shot sizes bigger than number 1 as the barrels were full choke. It was not until l had the barrels clipped down to 28 inch ( thus eliminating choke ) that l was able to fire SG through it.
The picture below is the barrels from a William Wellington Greener twelve bore double barrel shot-gun with horizontally stacked barrels . It took the 76 millimeter paper cartridge and had full choke. In 2008 a Bangladeshi hunter whose father was the gun’s first owner , decided to put an SG cartridge in it . The hull of the cartridge was plastic and it was a magnum cartridge . One can clearly see the results of this foolishness and he is lucky that , in spite of his injuries , he retained his life. Perhaps a modern gun with detachable choke might not get damaged but it is not worth risking one’s fire arm or their safety.
To Hoss Delgado ,
What you Americans call Number 4 buck , is only slightly larger than AAA . I would be very uncomfortable using this shot size for anything larger than crane or wild dog . The best shot size from my humble experience for deer and boar is SG . I am fond of the 12 pellet cartridge and not the 9 pellet cartridge. LG may seem attractive on account of it’s pellet size but it has too few pellets . SG is a good compromise . Your shot on that swine pictured , is commendable. However , performance is inconsistent depending upon the weight of the beast you are shooting , as your second experience notes.

Mr. Rahman , thanks for the tip ! I will use 00 Buckshot then 00 Buck and SG are the same as far as l heard

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

To Co Elk Hunter , you are welcome . The Remington 1187 is a good shot-gun. They were first imported into Bangladesh in 2012 and were the first guns which took the 89 millimeter cartridge in our country . However l prefer the 70 millimeter cartridge as it has been adequate for my needs for the last sixty years

 

[CoElkHunter]

To Co Elk Hunter , you are welcome . The Remington 1187 is a good shot-gun. They were first imported into Bangladesh in 2012 and were the first guns which took the 89 millimeter cartridge in our country . However l prefer the 70 millimeter cartridge as it has been adequate for my needs for the last sixty years

70 mm=20 gauge? Thanks!

 

[Wyatt Smith]

I think 70mm means 2 3/4 inches

 

[CoElkHunter]

I think 70mm means 2 3/4 inches

Oh ok. I didn’t know if Mr. Rahman was talking about 12 vs. 20 gauge? They both come in 2 3/4 or 3 inch or 3 1/2 inch in 12 gauge? Thanks!

 

[Hoss Delgado]

Oh ok. I didn’t know if Mr. Rahman was talking about 12 vs. 20 gauge? They both come in 2 3/4 or 3 inch or 3 1/2 inch in 12 gauge? Thanks!

I can answer that , bro. Wyatt nailed it as always He is talking about the 2 3/4 inch shell when he says 70mm and the 89 mm shell shell means 3.5 inch. He is talking about 12 gauges , since ( based on the last time l was there ) only 12 gauge shotguns are imported there and not 16 or 20 . The gun owners there refer to shell length in mm and not inches

 

[CoElkHunter]

I can answer that , bro. Wyatt nailed it as always He is talking about the 2 3/4 inch shell when he says 70mm and the 89 mm shell shell means 3.5 inch. He is talking about 12 gauges , since ( based on the last time l was there ) only 12 gauge shotguns are imported there and not 16 or 20 . The gun owners there refer to shell length in mm and not inches

Thanks Hoss!
CEH

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

To the poster , Co Elk Hunter
Hoss and Wyatt Smith are correct. I was referring to twelve bore
To Hoss Delgado
Twenty bore will start getting imported into the country from 2023 according to Bangladesh Shooting Federation. And it is good too . I can think of many talented female shooters and bird hunters who would benefit from the light jar of a twenty bore , yet were forced to adapt to twelve bore due to availability.
To the poster , Wyatt Smith :
Thank you for understanding. I see that some posters are having difficulty understanding my terminology for calibers. I will try to use the international designation henceforth for calibers as it will be convenient for everyone

 

[Red Leg]

With greatest respect, this gun looks like it was destroyed by a blockage - not by firing through a tightly choked gun. I have no idea the details behind these particular circumstances, but when a choke fails it is apparent in the last six inches or so of the barrel. In fact, this incident looks exactly like a 20 bore load was accidentally loaded ahead of a 12 bore shell in a 12 bore gun. Another similar failure was caused by a partial ignition where the wad failed to clear the bore on the previous shot. I assume from your comment that 20 bore guns were not available eliminating the possibility of the wrong shell. An out of proof load will typically blow either the chamber or shoot loose the solder and thus the rib.

The big Greeners were built like tanks for the export market. Is there any chance another factor was at work?

 

[Kawshik Rahman]

To the poster Red Leg :
Your observations are accurate.
The remains of this gun are in the basement of Bangladesh Shooting Federation , The fire arm itself was made in 1922 and was full choked in each barrel . The only shot-guns in Bangladesh with horizontal barrels are those from the colonial period , Therefore , they are all English bird guns made before India became independent. None of the manufacturers from whom Bangladeshi arms shops import arms manufacture a shot-gun with horizontally stacked barrels yet , although in 2023 the new horizontally stacked barrel shot-guns from Beretta are expected to come . The only new shot-gums imported are over-under , pump operation and auto - loader . The example in the picture has 76 millimeter chamber but was meant to take paper cartridges . The shot-gun was a family heirloom and the young man who did this tried to use a plastic SG cartridge made by Federal to shoot a deer . I can only comment on the aftermath which l saw .The young man brought this destroyed gem to Bangladesh Shooting Federation to show us. I am a founder member there since 1982 and l examine many arms there . Given your scientific explanation , you are likely right .Perhaps the plastic cartridge is the cause of this disaster. Perhaps the original paper cartridge which this gun was proofed for , had a lower charge of powder as opposed to the plastic SG shot cartridge . At the time , we agreed that the issue was the full choke.
I wish young men learnt to appreciate an arm for what it’s intended purpose is . A bird gun for small birds is not a waterfowl gun . A waterfowl fun is not a deer gun . If he wished to shoot deer , ducks and small birds with one gun , he should have bought a modern Beretta over -under or a Miroku.
Instead , such a beautiful arm is destroyed.