Big Bore Association of South Africa shoot 12 Feb 2022

[Frederik]

We had a fabulous day at the range again on the 12th of Feb testing out gear and mettle against a challenging range.

We had 100 participants for the day.

Our score areas are smaller than real life on the targets and the only reason is for us to improve as hunters.

Avg score for the day was 8 out of possible 17 hits, score runs on formula of energy hits and time. So that a 9.3x62 can compete with a large calibre 500NE and sorts.

[youtube]

Buffalo Range 1

Start at point A at whistle load two rounds and shoot at broadside buffalo two heart shots.
Move to point B load 3 rounds fire at frontal buffalo 2 x heart shots and one brain.
Move to point C load one and make sure to shoot the bull brain shot.

Shooter used his 450 NE

[youtube]

Range 1 again with left hand shooter using right handed 458 win mag.

[youtube]

Hippo Range 2

Start at whistle load two rounds and shoot one shot brain and one shot heart on left facing hippo.
Move to point B load one roound and shoot brain at left facing hippo again.
Move to point C load two shoot brain shot at charging hippo in water at the shot the hippo will charge for the second brain shot.
Then one go down on one knee and shoot static hippo closest to you another brain shot.

My son of 17 years handling my 375 H&H very well with full loads of 300gr bullets.

[youtube]

Range 3 fun range

Load 5 rounds if you can and move back to sprint at whistle to your rifle and start shooting two rounds at black twister.
Then one round at clay over Hyena.
Then one shot at clay over steenbuck
Last shot at the cape cobra head.

Good fun for all it was tough but rewarding.

 

[BourbonTrail]

Sounds/looks like a great time @Frederik !

 

[Frederik]

Sounds/looks like a great time @Frederik !

It was good fun with like minded people think about it minimum 17 shots per shooter and 100 shooters who participated is almost 2000 rounds of big bores fired in the day. Shots were fired over chrony as well to check bullet speed and some checking zero so we can call it close to 2000 shots.

We had a 21 gun salute early the morning for a fallen friend as well who passed in December with cancer. We are just not a shooting club but close knit with the same goal to shoot and hunt with big bores.

 

[VertigoBE]

Looks like a lot of fun @Frederik! It is unfortunate that such kind of training/practice is unavailable back here. Is your club open to "tourists" as well, Frederik?

Some observations: I see everyone taking the rifle off the shoulder to cycle the bolt, instead of cycling while keeping the rifle on the shoulder. This does make things a little less akward.

That hippo charging on the first shot, is there mighty quick! Lot's of practice needed for this for sure!

 

[CoElkHunter]

Very nice! Thanks for sharing!

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

Looks like a lot of fun @Frederik! It is unfortunate that such kind of training/practice is unavailable back here. Is your club open to "tourists" as well, Frederik?

Some observations: I see everyone taking the rifle off the shoulder to cycle the bolt, instead of cycling while keeping the rifle on the shoulder. This does make things a little less akward.

That hippo charging on the first shot, is there mighty quick! Lot's of practice needed for this for sure!

Have you seen this?

 

[CoElkHunter]

Very interesting!

 

[Tally-Ho HUNTING SAFARIS]

GREAT VIDS, LOOKS LIKE GOOD FUN
very true on the extracting etc, seen it myself many times with clients, short stroking!!!!!

 

[VertigoBE]

Have you seen this?

Thanks @Wishfulthinker580 !

I'll change my dry fire practice from as fast as possible from the sticks, keeping the rifle in the shoulder, to as fast as possible off-hand, taking the rifle off the shoulder. I suppose when on the sticks, a bit more time between shots is fine.

 

[DWB]

Well done Frederik on your win for the day! You did well!!!!!!

 

[Frederik]

Well done Frederik on your win for the day! You did well!!!!!!

Dankie Deon normally you are either on my heels or ahead of me but it just wasn't your day.
I'm sure next time I will have to watch out.

 

[Frederik]

Looks like a lot of fun @Frederik! It is unfortunate that such kind of training/practice is unavailable back here. Is your club open to "tourists" as well, Frederik?

Some observations: I see everyone taking the rifle off the shoulder to cycle the bolt, instead of cycling while keeping the rifle on the shoulder. This does make things a little less akward.

That hippo charging on the first shot, is there mighty quick! Lot's of practice needed for this for sure!

The video posted by Wishfullthinker sums it up two thing they didnt mention is if it hot and you are shooting hot loads there is a chance the case will be more sticky to extract in that case you don't have a lot of power pulling back the bolt all the way back.
You have much more power doing it off the shoulder.

Second point is shooting a heavy caliber in a dangerous situation you don't always have time to stand correctly which will move you off balance try then to reload from the shoulder while off balance???

I use to shoot off my shoulder with my 375 H&H which is built on a opened standard action but then changed over and with practise you will see there isnt much time difference on the scores.

Jurgen, if ever you find yourself here on the same day we do a shoot your are more than welcome to participate.

 

[calling4life]

Boy, I can't believe that people go for that...

So, because someone somewhere didn't know how to properly run their gun and they short stroked it, we now handicap everyone and train them to operate the firearm as though they will short stroke it.

Seriously, that's a losing mindset from the get go.

Practice properly running your firearm so you know what you're doing, then, well then do that in the field. If you have a fail to feed, a fail to eject etc... Just like in a IDPA match or whatever, with a handgun, you practice how to rectify the situation.

You don't now completely change how you run your gun just assuming that the failure will always occur thus handicapping yourself always.

Practice, and further, practice clearing a malfunction with the gun mounted, if it's a simple malfunction then it shouldn't be an issue, if it isn't a simple malfunction, well, then it doesn't matter, you either have the time now to pull the gun down and rectify it or you were always going to be dead, as it's not a simple malfunction and will take time to deal with.

You can watch around you with the gun mounted just fine, simply lower the barrel a little, if that is even needed.
Next, if you have more time and aren't in immediate need to fire, put the butt under your armpit and have it at the alert low ready.

Next, you can of course still completely lower the gun, or do whatever else you want, throw it in the river, pour whisky down the barrel then drink the whisky from the barrel... whatever

But planning to fail, well, watch the hippo charge scenario above...

Learn and train how to properly cycle your bolt gun from your shoulder, practice to clear failures if they happen, then, prepare your equipment and check it to make sure they don't.

Train everybody to the level of the lowest common denominator.... get outta here with that

We're better than that, but of course, it is also your life, and I believe in individual freedom, so do as you wish, and I wish you the best.

 

[Frederik]

Boy, I can't believe that people go for that...

So, because someone somewhere didn't know how to properly run their gun and they short stroked it, we now handicap everyone and train them to operate the firearm as though they will short stroke it.

Seriously, that's a losing mindset from the get go.

Practice properly running your firearm so you know what you're doing, then, well then do that in the field. If you have a fail to feed, a fail to eject etc... Just like in a IDPA match or whatever, with a handgun, you practice how to rectify the situation.

You don't now completely change how you run your gun just assuming that the failure will always occur thus handicapping yourself always.

Practice, and further, practice clearing a malfunction with the gun mounted, if it's a simple malfunction then it shouldn't be an issue, if it isn't a simple malfunction, well, then it doesn't matter, you either have the time now to pull the gun down and rectify it or you were always going to be dead, as it's not a simple malfunction and will take time to deal with.

You can watch around you with the gun mounted just fine, simply lower the barrel a little, if that is even needed.
Next, if you have more time and aren't in immediate need to fire, put the butt under your armpit and have it at the alert low ready.

Next, you can of course still completely lower the gun, or do whatever else you want, throw it in the river, pour whisky down the barrel then drink the whisky from the barrel... whatever

But planning to fail, well, watch the hippo charge scenario above...

Learn and train how to properly cycle your bolt gun from your shoulder, practice to clear failures if they happen, then, prepare your equipment and check it to make sure they don't.

Train everybody to the level of the lowest common denominator.... get outta here with that

We're better than that, but of course, it is also your life, and I believe in individual freedom, so do as you wish, and I wish you the best.

I would love to see a video of you shooting a 458 Lott CZ 5 shots after each other shooting 5 clays at 30 yards as fast as possible. Then I will also do one and do it the way I do it and we can see the time difference.

 

[calling4life]

I would love to see a video of you shooting a 458 Lott CZ 5 shots after each other shooting 5 clays at 30 yards as fast as possible. Then I will also do one and do it the way I do it and we can see the time difference.

Hey-oh, for one, accuracy at x yardage isn't a variable that needs to be introduced for this, it doesn't come into play regarding the discussion at hand. Not dismissing needing to hit your target, just isn't wise to start adding irrelevant variables to a specific test and a person being x accurate at x distance doesn't play into whether they can cycle their action properly.

And, dropping $50 to play "I can shoot better than you," proves nothing regarding this issue. Seriously, I am another variable that need not come into play. Do it with yourself

What you're arguing is that you, can, and let's say while being practiced with both equally or close to it, to put them on level playing fields.

You're saying you can fire, dismount the gun, down by your hips it goes, cycle the bolt, raise it back up, get it mounted and into firing position, then fire.

You're saying you can do that as quickly as fire, cycle bolt, fire? Because that is what you're saying.

Does that follow to you? Is that rational? Malfunctioning rounds, firearms, sun was in my eyes, earthquake, aliens landing, or dysfunctional people aside?

Anyways:
I do actually have a video of me firing my 458 lott, now it's 2 shots, but, I did it this fall, as I work on my action myself and I was testing it out.
It was not a speed specific run, further, you'll see me not exactly set into the greatest of shooting positions as well. So this won't be a "he really ran some dry fire practice to get good" type scenario.

But, I do run two rounds through the gun, fire, cycle bolt, fire, all while staying in the shooting position, though again, introducing me as a variable doesn't make the point.

So, I can get on my other computer here sometime soon, should be able to load that video onto YouTube and post it.

But there should be no question which is quicker by virtue of one being far less steps, in this situation, especially, since the steps from one have to be in the other, so one includes all the steps of the other plus some.

Further argument of failure rate, and whether or not it is so high that it would then necessitate building a "fail safe" into how you'd teach every single person to fire their gun can be handled later as well.
One point that may need some answering, later on, is whether or not you're now putting your firearm on safe with the dismounting method, as the firearm is no longer in a position to be fired and thus, to some, should be rendered safe. I mean, you wouldn't carry it like that with the safety off.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Looks like a lot of fun @Frederik! It is unfortunate that such kind of training/practice is unavailable back here. Is your club open to "tourists" as well, Frederik?

Some observations: I see everyone taking the rifle off the shoulder to cycle the bolt, instead of cycling while keeping the rifle on the shoulder. This does make things a little less akward.

That hippo charging on the first shot, is there mighty quick! Lot's of practice needed for this for sure!

If members are interested I will arrange/organize a Elephant/Buffalo hunting course for you at the Southern African Wild Life College for six participants here in SA. Let me know how many members want to participate in such a course over three to four days ..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Thanks @Wishfulthinker580 !

I'll change my dry fire practice from as fast as possible from the sticks, keeping the rifle in the shoulder, to as fast as possible off-hand, taking the rifle off the shoulder. I suppose when on the sticks, a bit more time between shots is fine.

Piet Nel in this video is conducting the Buffalo/Elephant hunting shooting courses ..

 

[calling4life]

 

[IvW]

Have you seen this?

Not my idea or the way I was trained to do it.....

 

[IvW]

Main problems I have with these shoots(bearing in mind that I was one of the first members) is that they bring speed into the calculation....
Next problem is on some they limit how many rounds you can load....
Next is you can only use one firearm for the entire course....

Why is the above a issue for me?

You can never substitute accuracy for speed....so If the elephant target charges me I will wait until I am sure of my shot and drop it with one shot....not drill into the shooter that the more shots you get off the higher you score....

You want to use a double your choice the reloading issues that come with that is your choice.....if my 500 Jeff takes 4 so be it.....you have 2 dont penalise me....

When I hunt DG I choose my weapons for the animal hunted why not allow same here? Elephant and buff 500 Jeff, hippo 500 Jeff, 404 Jeff or even 375 H&H. Lion whatever I choose leopard my poor mans double or my 9.3x74R12ga Combo....

One in the brain of the ele is dead with the 500 Jeff point full stop....irrespective of time....as long as it is before it reaches you....

This will put you in the wrong mindset and muscle memory if you have to do it in the field...

Change the scoring system and I will be back....or even allow me to do it my way and ignore my "points" and I will also be back....I dont need a score.....

My 2c