AVOID Gunsmith quicksand!...Classic Barrel & Gunworks: Prescott Arizona: Dan Pedersen

[deewayne2003]

Inline6 I feel your pain!

Good news however, I just got off the phone with the right man for the job….. Dennis Olson

As soon as I get some additional pieces in these parts are headed to Plains Montana for inspection and hopefully completion.

 

[Doug3006]

Thanks Deewayne and Inline6 for sharing these stories with us. What happened to you is borderline criminal! We are all forewarned.

Your stories got me thinking. So much of the support we need to pursue our obsession is provided by cottage industry, i.e., small, single proprietor businesses. Gunsmiths, taxidermists, travel and logistics providers, outfitters. Given the social and political environment, I don’t expect this to change, other than to get worse.

For example in shipping and logistics, so many of the large providers are dropping out of the hunting industry, we’ll be even more dependent on smaller outfits.

Some, maybe even most, of these providers do a great job and work very hard to maintain their reputation. Some of them however either start off not giving a damn or something happens in their lives to where they no longer give a damn and their clients are left to swing in the breeze!

That makes forums like this one indispensable to those of us who still choose to travel far and wide to hunt and explore. I will not make a major investment in trips or gear without consulting my friends on ah.com first.

 

[rookhawk]

They say the difference between a musician and an artist is a musician plays, and an artist knows when NOT to play.

It's the same with gunsmithing. 99% of the times I see people go to the gunsmith, they shouldn't have gone. The juice isn't worth the squeeze. In this case, for 1/10th the aggravation and half the price, the OP could have just bought a 404 Jeffery and sold whatever the donor gun was. In the end, there is usually a 90% chance a 404J doesn't feed right after being made so the gun stands high likelihood of being fire-sale priced in the classifieds section in the future.

For small jobs, I just get the tools and do the work myself. For big jobs, I have a handful of smiths around the country I can count upon. They are neither cheap nor fast, which is good because it regulates my impulse to put good money after bad.

I've made it a cottage industry buying fine guns from heirs when the project is finally ready and the original owner is now deceased. It's to be expected considering the timeframe it takes for most projects.

I'm sorry for the OPs misfortune, but it begs the question why he's resetting the clock and restarting the painful process. Put the original barrel back on. Sell the gun. Buy a 404J to be delivered next week. Enjoy. Why spend so much precious time needlessly to be upside down on a non-historically significant firearm?

 

[Inline6]

@rookhawk the OPs original barrel is FUBAR. What he has is what he is stuck with. It has to be finished in order to have a working rifle.

 

[Fatback]

Rookhawk,

You make a good point but it isn’t always that easy, especially if you’re looking for a left handed bolt gun. Admittedly, I am brand new to the world of DG rifles. I bought my first last year, a Model 70 375 in a LH version. Looking back on it, I didn’t realize at the time how lucky I was to have found such a rifle that was NIB and have never been fired. I’ve looked for another like it for almost 4 months and haven’t seen hide nor hair of another one. As I’ve looked into the DG rifle world I’ve decided I want to have a LH 404 Jeffery. Unless I want to spend upwards of five figures on a custom gun, my only option would be to have something re-barreled into the desired caliber. Even doing that it will be a costly endeavor. I’ve spoken with a couple of reputable gun smiths about the feasibility of such a project. I’ve also gotten some good feedback from those much more knowledgeable than me here in AH and I think I’m getting closer to trying to have this done. Will it work out, I don’t know but I’ll never know unless I try. In the end I’ll either have a working and reliable left handed 404 Jeffery or a sad and frustrating story to add to this thread. I’m hoping for the former and not the latter. Of course, all this could be avoided if I were to find what I want in something I can afford.

 

[deewayne2003]

@rookhawk the original barrel was destroyed during the attempted reboring process ….. I’ve also heard you mention Ken Owen repeatedly- I did contact him before I sent the rifle to Dan, but he (Ken) mothballed his reboring machine and had other projects going at the time.

The intent was to have a .404 that looked as factory original as possible leaving me with a work horse BRNO .404 with a 4+1 capacity.

Any assertion that I started this project as an attempt to see how much money I could burn would be based solely on ignorance.

It’s taken 2 years, a still unfinished suit & getting Dan’s wife involved….. just to get this much back.

@Fatback …. My mistake was going with a smith’s PAST reputation and advice from people who used him years ago;make sure you check current references.

 

[Kyhunter73]

I’ve had Dan build several guns for me and friends. All have been quick turn arounds for a Good gunsmith of 6-12 months and all of them shot to where a 3 shot group could be covered with a dime at 200 yds. Feeding and fit was exceptional, barrels, and chambering off the charts. I’ve had nothing but great work from him and had a couple of friends even send him work that they were ecstatic about when they got them back.

 

[Inline6]

I’ve had Dan build several guns for me and friends. All have been quick turn arounds for a Good gunsmith of 6-12 months and all of them shot to where a 3 shot group could be covered with a dime at 200 yds. Feeding and fit was exceptional, barrels, and chambering off the charts. I’ve had nothing but great work from him and had a couple of friends even send him work that they were ecstatic about when they got them back.

How long ago was that?

By the sound of the police comments alone, this is now an ongoing issue and has been for a while.

We all have that person sometime in life that did right by us, not so much by everyone else.

 

[Proneshooter]

I’ve had Dan build several guns for me and friends. and all of them shot to where a 3 shot group could be covered with a dime at 200 yds.

A quarter MOA gun, not one, but several.... That is an exceptional gunsmith and also some exceptional shooters that can hold that tight of a group. Joined this forum just to make that post?

 

[Doug3006]

Joined this forum just to make that post?

Uhh…..the OP @deewayne2003 joined AH Jan 27, 2020. His post that started this discussion was dated Aug 2022.

 

[deewayne2003]

@Kyhunter73 ….. Yes by all means please provide all the details you can on calibers of rifles and work done.

Because there is a line of people “down the block and around the corner” that will say otherwise.

 

[Proneshooter]

Joined this forum just to make that post?

Uhh…..the OP @deewayne2003 joined AH Jan 27, 2020. His post that started this discussion was dated Aug 2022.

Doug,
The post I quoted was not from deewayne, I was questioning the post of KYhunter73. deewayne and I have done business together and spoke on the phone a few times about the situation he is in with Dan, heck I almost ended up sending Dan some stuff for a build...Glad I did not.

 

[Doug3006]

Hi Proneshooter. I totally understand. Thanks for setting me straight on that.

 

[deewayne2003]

NO JUDGEMENT GRANTED!

The judge ruled - That because I did not have a written contract and that Dan's wife had returned the box of parts to me with an invoice for $0.00 that I had received a new barrel for free and he was NOT interested in hearing my evidence that Dan perjured himself and he flat out refused to call either of my witnesses; the first being the smith Colt that worked with Dan and the other being the Detective that investigated the criminal complaint.

I asked the judge if we could at least hear from Dan's wife to see if she had returned the property of the other people who I gave her a list of their contact info; and the judges answer.....

"I will not allow her to answer that because the answer could be used against her if future criminal charges were brought; furthermore I appreciate your frustration but you took a risk by sending a $2,000 item without a service contract and this should be a lesson learned."

To which I could only politely thank the court for its time, but stated it seemed like Dan was off the hook because his WIFE had been informed of their lawsuit by the very gunsmith they were both slandering and that was the only reason they sent my parts back.

Before Dan Pederson

2 years later and small claims court later....

FYI rear sight block is not soldered on, barrel not to length, front sight not installed, stock not inletted, feed work not performed.

Yes it certainly has been a lesson learned and as I said before this post was started as a warning to others, check recent references and beware what you may be in for.

What now you ask? I spoke with Dennis Olson this week and he inspected the parts and the headspace is good and he believes he believes the project is worth moving forward with, and I asked him what his turn around time looked like?

"Slow!" Was his jokingly honest reply and no I didn't ask him for a service contract either!

 

[CJW]

WTF is a "demention"?

Unfortunately it seems like the judge is correct. It seems gunsmith's and taxidermist's are a couple risky groups and get off scott free after they've returned nothing for your money. Maybe we should start demanding accountability for our patronage no matter the name.

Just my $.02.

Hoping for a brighter future for the rifle.

 

[frog stealer]

Figured I would chime in as well…long story short, I sent my Winchester M70 Safari to Dan back in 2015 for a rebore to 404. After his quoted turnaround time elapsed, I began calling and emailing him to get a status update. Never received any response.

I got as far as sending a certified letter, but finally gave up because I figured it would cost more than the rifle is worth to get it back. He still has my barreled action, almost a decade later. The worst part is that rifle was used on my first trip to Africa, so it holds some sentimental value.

 

[Retired Spook]

What a sin. I just read through this thread and I signed up just to reply to it.

I am not going to take the time to describe my rifle dilemma but my gut instinct has kept me from sending my rifle to more than a few "well respected" gunsmiths - some with some pretty well-known names. Not one that I have ever spoken to has ever even mentioned the concept of a service contract and one said "send me your rifle, brass and dies and I will take a look at it."

Man am I glad that I did not do that.

If there was something I could say or do to correct all of this for the OP it would already be done.

I detest people that operate like this. Unfortunately, there are lots of them.

 

[deewayne2003]

UPDATE!

I have received UNCONFIRMED word that Dan allegedly got drunk and shot up his house with his wife inside.

 

[Tam Dl]

There seem to be a lot of pistolsmiths out there who do a good job. Though the possibility to get a better product cheaply made on CNC has to be affecting them.

Basic rifle work is pretty easy. Is there much money in it? There aren't many secrets any more. The actual work on lathes and mills is pretty easy. And there was lots of info from the point VHS came out.

The thing with small businesses is that the guy only has to get sick for a short while, and he can never get out from under the bills and the backlog. I know one guy who builds bikes. He is a master he could get all the work required to finish him. His approach is to spend one month a year, where all he does is sell the new bikes, which is a custom thing, and customer service. He then does the work for the next 11 months. I forget when he gets paid, possibly with the orders. But the deal is he can never, short of some huge awful thing, get himself into the trap where he falls behind, and spent the front money, and is toast from then on. He does not answer the phone, or otherwise communicate with people during the 11 months, though he must call for pickup or delivery info. That is the other thing that kills these small guys, with the internet they can literally spend all day in communication mode, and have to work all evening to do the work. First thing that was a warning to me in the story above was that the communitcation actually sounded good for a while, even if it wasn't good news.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@Boyd Brooks

I don't think it's a lack of interested or motivated younger people.... Try placing yourself in their shoes, you would have to find a GOOD smith to apprentice under that will not screw you over and make enough money doing so to support yourself and then if you want to go out on your own where are you going to get the capital to do so?

After all families with the capital to finance/support their child going into gunsmithing would most likely laugh at the idea and instead push their children to more lucrative and socially glorious career paths; and families that lack capital for gunsmithing, trade school or college will most likely push the same narrative that I was force fed......."Go to college or you are an idiot!" I know I was pushed that way and FYI College tuition & fees have outpaced inflation by 5X!

There are plenty of bright hard working people in this world that want nothing more than to succeed by merit ..... but today it's a much steeper climb in this country, and if you don't believe that, then check out these stats from 1971.

WTF Happened In 1971?

"I don't believe we shall ever have a good money again before we take the thing out of the hands of government, that is, we can't take it violently out of the hands of government, all we can do is by some sly roundabout way introduce something that they can't stop." - F.A. Hayek 1984

wtfhappenedin1971.com

@deewayne2003
My gunsmith is the busiest he has been in his life and he is getting older and has arthritis in his hands so work is getting harder.
I asked him about taking on an apprentice. He said the hassle just wasn't worth the effort plus the insurance was a killer that he just couldn't afford. Top that of with the difficulty of finding someone that wanted to do the work in the first place and you have an up hill battle from the start.
Bob