ARGENTINA: Epic Argentina Hunt

[Red Leg]

Notice how tall and wide just the skull is...

View attachment 671291

One hell of a buff. I'll get my opportunity early next year.

 

[Green Chile]

One hell of a buff. I'll get my opportunity early next year.

Where are you going? Will you rent a camp rifle? I have a lot of thoughts on that subject I will be posting here in the report.

 

[WAB]

Great hunt and fantastic trophies sir!

 

[Green Chile]

Ok, so from my perspective the hunt was over. I had accomplished my major goals and could have kept shooting trophies but that would have detracted from my main experience being the buffalo. It's not about quantity but about quality of the experience. The rest of the hunt I spent time with the skinners observing their processes, etc. to share with you here.

I was told by the camp manager that the most valuable employee was their head skinner. The man was amazing to watch in action. Here he is caping my buffalo in the field...

 

[Green Chile]

Here are some more photos of the skinner's work and a video of the last 2 weeks of stag trophies to give you a sense of the quality and consistency of this ranch's stag program.

 

[WAB]

Absolutely incredible!

 

[BourbonTrail]

That buffalo almost has Aussie sized horns. The hand in the picture really gives scale.

Oh, and yes +1 on stag trophy quality being incredible.

 

[Green Chile]

Yes I agree. I would say in some ways that my stag was one of the lesser ones taken that week if you consider score to be the main factor (I don't but some feel that way). The head guide estimated mine (based on 40 years experience) of being around 360. Many taken were 380+. I have a photo of one taken the week before us that was over 400"...free range! The high fence ones look ridiculous to me...like cartoon exaggerations. Take a look at our group photos just to get a sense of what is happening almost every day on this ranch.

 

[cls]

Thank you for a well written report. Well done on the stag and buffalo. Congratulations.

 

[Green Chile]

Thank you for the compliments. As usual in my hunt reports, I will be offering some thoughts on a few topics and observations that may help someone to have a good trip themselves.

Let's talk about the guides for a minute. They were all locals, Spanish speaking of course and most of them spoke very limited English. This was an area of general comment that I heard from the group of hunters. There was a definite language barrier for most of the hunters and there were moments of confusion/frustration in the field. Imagine a scenario where the guide is describing which animal to shoot...is that 2nd from the left...or the right...and the animals just moved again...which one is it? Each guide had a CB radio and some would call back to the lodge to get an interpretation for the hunter into English. That seemed clunky at best. I have enough Spanish to work out my hunting with no issues. Most hunters do not have that option. Consider learning some basic Spanish before you go to Argentina. Some used Google Translate but that only works if you have a signal.

There was evidence of the guides having some poor economic conditions...they wore a lot of clothing left behind by hunters and those that had nice Sitka or Kuiu clothing wore it with pride. One hunter left his new boots, Kuiu jacket and a good tip to his guide. I thought that was pretty awesome. Consider taking some gear to leave with the guides. You have more than you need already so give some to him and he will never forget that.

The guides were eager to hunt but there was a wide range of skills among them. Some had grown up on the ranch and knew every shortcut and honey hole for game. Some were inexperienced and didn't understand tracking or the use of wind in hunting. Some guides actually hunted the wind backwards and the client had to try and explain that to their guide. Most of the guides were good and a few were very inexperienced. The conclusion I made on this subject is that there is so much game of good quality here that if the guide gets it wrong, they just try again. This would have been a bigger issue if opportunities were less frequent on the ranch. Pros and cons to having such good quality on the ranch.

I laughed some at my guide as he would be walking in his rubber boots and they would scrape against a bush or something...he would then turn to me and say Shhhh. He was shushing me for his own noise. Pretty funny as I actually walk very quietly and often wasn't even moving when he would turn to me. Those are some of the things you remember that make a trip special.

 

[Green Chile]

Let's talk about guns for a minute. You will notice that I didn't bring a gun on this trip and neither did anyone else. It was recommended that we rent a camp gun/ammo. Unlike Africa, there are no VIP services for gun permitting. I think this is a HUGE opportunity for an enterprising business person who speaks Spanish and maybe has some govt connections in Argentina or at the airports. No one is bringing in guns to the country that has MORE hunters annually than all of Africa combined. Let that sink in...no typo, no exaggeration. We were told that you can fill out the permits but end up waiting hours for an official to show up and sign it. You might miss your flight or have trouble with your next leg of the journey waiting on someone to arrive. Some have waited 8 hours...some have waited over a day. There's no way to plan around that kind of randomness. We all missed our own guns and optics.

What about camp gun/ammo quality? Ehhh...that could definitely improve. All of the guns were well worn but operational. Scopes varied a lot from 2.5x to 6x to variable in totally random ways mixed with a variety of calibers...all different kinds of safeties and models of guns. Ammo was whatever was left over...3 of this type...5 of that type mixed together...different bullet weights for the same caliber...no ammo for the 375 and then oh wait, we found 3 rounds somewhere. You are also charged for ammo use and that is not clearly specified at all. There seemed to be a pattern of $5 per round fired but that wasn't consistent. I shot less than most of the group but paid a lot more. Was that because I shot one round of 375? Hard to say.

If there isn't someone to step up and run a VIP gun permit service for Argentina, I would like to see this outfitter buy some new guns/optics/ammo. Gun rental fees were $250 per hunter plus ammo costs. Let's say 10 hunters per week...that's $2500 in gun rentals for 1 week. Season is at least 6 weeks long, which is 15k in rental fees. Let's go buy 10 Savage rifles in .308 or 30-06 and 300 win mag. Let's get some basic Vortex or Leupold scopes for them...something like 2-10x. Let's get a couple 375's and set them up with 1-4x or something like that. Let's buy a quantity of ammo for those 3 calibers that is consistent. Maybe do that every 5 years or something like that. That would be a better experience for everyone.

 

[JonathanG]

Awesome hunt and report Green Chile! On the subject of guns, I think it has a lot to do with who is in power at the time. Ten to 15 years ago we brought our shotguns with little issue, after that we were told about the new difficulty bringing them in and were advised to shoot camp guns. We had no issues with camp guns as they knew Beretta and Benelli were all that would hold up, well-worn but worked.

 

[mdwest]

Thank you for the compliments. As usual in my hunt reports, I will be offering some thoughts on a few topics and observations that may help someone to have a good trip themselves.

Let's talk about the guides for a minute. They were all locals, Spanish speaking of course and most of them spoke very limited English. This was an area of general comment that I heard from the group of hunters. There was a definite language barrier for most of the hunters and there were moments of confusion/frustration in the field. Imagine a scenario where the guide is describing which animal to shoot...is that 2nd from the left...or the right...and the animals just moved again...which one is it? Each guide had a CB radio and some would call back to the lodge to get an interpretation for the hunter into English. That seemed clunky at best. I have enough Spanish to work out my hunting with no issues. Most hunters do not have that option. Consider learning some basic Spanish before you go to Argentina. Some used Google Translate but that only works if you have a signal.

There was evidence of the guides having some poor economic conditions...they wore a lot of clothing left behind by hunters and those that had nice Sitka or Kuiu clothing wore it with pride. One hunter left his new boots, Kuiu jacket and a good tip to his guide. I thought that was pretty awesome. Consider taking some gear to leave with the guides. You have more than you need already so give some to him and he will never forget that.

The guides were eager to hunt but there was a wide range of skills among them. Some had grown up on the ranch and knew every shortcut and honey hole for game. Some were inexperienced and didn't understand tracking or the use of wind in hunting. Some guides actually hunted the wind backwards and the client had to try and explain that to their guide. Most of the guides were good and a few were very inexperienced. The conclusion I made on this subject is that there is so much game of good quality here that if the guide gets it wrong, they just try again. This would have been a bigger issue if opportunities were less frequent on the ranch. Pros and cons to having such good quality on the ranch.

I laughed some at my guide as he would be walking in his rubber boots and they would scrape against a bush or something...he would then turn to me and say Shhhh. He was shushing me for his own noise. Pretty funny as I actually walk very quietly and often wasn't even moving when he would turn to me. Those are some of the things you remember that make a trip special.

Im really surprised about the language barrier thing..

we've hunted with 2 different outfitters in Argentina.. all of the guides we've dealt with spoke impeccable english..

many of the staff in the lodges spoke very limited English (cooks, housekeepers, etc).. and the entry level help to the guides (bird boys, etc) spoke very limited English.. but our actual guides in both lodges spoke excellent English

 

[Green Chile]

I haven't been to a wing shooting destination in Argentina yet but I have heard many reports of well maintained shotguns that are cleaned, oiled and repaired regularly. Due to the volume of shooting, that makes a lot of sense. I didn't see that in this camp with the hunting rifles. It's an opportunity for improvement in an otherwise excellent operation.

 

[Green Chile]

Im really surprised about the language barrier thing..

we've hunted with 2 different outfitters in Argentina.. all of the guides we've dealt with spoke impeccable english..

many of the staff in the lodges spoke very limited English (cooks, housekeepers, etc).. and the entry level help to the guides (bird boys, etc) spoke very limited English.. but our actual guides in both lodges spoke excellent English

Yes, I was a little surprised by that myself. I thought it would be a smaller gap but for some of the hunters who spoke no Spanish, they were frustrated every day by it. I always want to learn basic phrases at least, whether that's Africa or wherever. I think the hunt experience would be better if the guides had more English speaking skills.

 

[mdwest]

Let's talk about guns for a minute. You will notice that I didn't bring a gun on this trip and neither did anyone else. It was recommended that we rent a camp gun/ammo. Unlike Africa, there are no VIP services for gun permitting. I think this is a HUGE opportunity for an enterprising business person who speaks Spanish and maybe has some govt connections in Argentina or at the airports. No one is bringing in guns to the country that has MORE hunters annually than all of Africa combined. Let that sink in...no typo, no exaggeration. We were told that you can fill out the permits but end up waiting hours for an official to show up and sign it. You might miss your flight or have trouble with your next leg of the journey waiting on someone to arrive. Some have waited 8 hours...some have waited over a day. There's no way to plan around that kind of randomness. We all missed our own guns and optics.

What about camp gun/ammo quality? Ehhh...that could definitely improve. All of the guns were well worn but operational. Scopes varied a lot from 2.5x to 6x to variable in totally random ways mixed with a variety of calibers...all different kinds of safeties and models of guns. Ammo was whatever was left over...3 of this type...5 of that type mixed together...different bullet weights for the same caliber...no ammo for the 375 and then oh wait, we found 3 rounds somewhere. You are also charged for ammo use and that is not clearly specified at all. There seemed to be a pattern of $5 per round fired but that wasn't consistent. I shot less than most of the group but paid a lot more. Was that because I shot one round of 375? Hard to say.

If there isn't someone to step up and run a VIP gun permit service for Argentina, I would like to see this outfitter buy some new guns/optics/ammo. Gun rental fees were $250 per hunter plus ammo costs. Let's say 10 hunters per week...that's $2500 in gun rentals for 1 week. Season is at least 6 weeks long, which is 15k in rental fees. Let's go buy 10 Savage rifles in .308 or 30-06 and 300 win mag. Let's get some basic Vortex or Leupold scopes for them...something like 2-10x. Let's get a couple 375's and set them up with 1-4x or something like that. Let's buy a quantity of ammo for those 3 calibers that is consistent. Maybe do that every 5 years or something like that. That would be a better experience for everyone.

Also really surprised by the gun situation..

With the 2 different outfitters we have hunted with, all firearms and all ammo have been of very good quality..

Shotgun wise both outfitters had a selection of benelli montefreltos and beretta A400's to choose from as well as a handful of beretta O/U (Im guessing they were silver pigeons.. but I didn't look closely).. Rifle wise one outfitter had a couple of Winchester 70's with Swaro glass on top chambered in 338 WM.. ammo was basic Rem Core-Lokt, but it was well maintained, etc and there was plenty of it.. that outfitter also had a couple of Win 70's in 308 available as well.. I never saw what ammo they were providing for that rifle, but I would assume Core-Lokt as well..

The other outfitter I only saw a couple of rifles on the shelf, and honestly didn't pay close attention (we were bird hunting) but IIRC they were modern bolt guns of some sort (maybe Rem 700's or 700 clones?) and they probably had 10x boxes of ammo sitting on the shelf next to the rifles.. I don't recall what glass the rifles were topped with, but Im sure it was at least good to very good glass (I would have likely noticed if the guns were topped with junk)..

Guns were provided at no cost to us for our hunts.. but we did have to pay for all ammo.. prices were slightly higher than what we typically pay in the US.. but they weren't outrageous..

I was told by both outfitters that US hunters bringing guns into Argentina was a huge PIA.. they recommended we use camp guns.. but they also told me that importing guns for their own use was pretty easy and affordable to do.. one of the outfitters always has a big booth at DSC.. they typically stay a few days late after the show in Dallas and hit the gun shops and outdoors stores like Cabelas and stock up on stuff to take back home with them.. apparently they bought all of their firearms in Dallas over the years since they are more plentiful in the US and significantly cheaper to buy here.. They told me they buy 4-5 shotguns every year and occasionally buy a new rifle.. (the shotguns wear out pretty quickly due to the super high volume of use they get on dove hunts.. so they have to be replaced every +/-5 years according to the guide I was speaking with)..

 

[JG26Irish_2]

GC - Congratulations on your outstanding hunt and thank you for writing this excellent hunt report. I was particularly impressed that you had the presence of mind to use the 300 for the followup shots saving the two last 375 rds for use if necessary. That buffalo bull was a stud. I know the photos often cannot do justice but it is obvious that yours are a special animal. Well done Sir!

 

[Green Chile]

Thank you. The use of the 300 from a distance was intentional and also those were lung shots versus the 375 on the shoulder. I saved the 2 shells of 375 for emergency. I could have easily put a 2nd 375 shell into the buff at first but that seemed foolish. One good shot with the 375...then let's see what happens. I had a pocket full of .300 win mag and only 3 shells for 375. I had never been in that situation before but was as strategic as I could be considering the circumstances.

 

[deewayne2003]

Notice how tall and wide just the skull is...

View attachment 671291

You were right, built more like a Gaur

Out of curiosity, was the .375 sighted in after all?..... I know you hit it with the first shot, just wondering if it was true to point of aim and any idea what the ammo was?

 

[Green Chile]

I think buffalo/bovines are a fascinating DG subject. It's one of my passions. I do think that these Argentina water buff have similarities to gaur and particularly my oversized bull. My dream would be to hunt gaur but that is almost impossible today.

Here are some gaur photos...