Anyone use Berger VLD on plains game?

[wysongdog]

I will be headed to Africa next year to hunt primarily plains game. I'm taking 28 nosler that is shooting 180 grain Berger VLD's @ 3152. This rifle shoots this bullet extremely well. I just don't know if this bullet is tough enough for a large Kudu or Eland? I haven't shot any elk with this set up yet so I don't have anything to compare it to. Shot a good muley buck at 405 yards with it and it performed perfectly. It's not to late that if we have to find a different bullet and load we can.
Thanks Bryan

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

My fear is you'd take a shot at 100 yards and with that impact velocity somewhere around 3000+ fps, the bullet breaks up before getting into the vitals. I've never used Bergers but have always had the understanding it's for long distance. A PH tries to get you close.

Were it me, I'd find a different bullet especially for those velocities.

 

[Hogpatrol]

I've used Berger hunting VLDS on four trips in a 6.5x47 Lapua, 6.5-.284, 26 Nosler and 28 Nosler. Don't know the exact number but I've killed at least fifty plains game with them up to a blue wildebeest. Maybe two were not DRT. In the 28 Nosler, they should drop any of those animals in their tracks out to mid range distances and smaller stuff out to 1000. In my first 28 Nosler, I shot the 168 HVLDs. I built another to exclusively shoot the 195 EOL hybrids. Had it out yesterday shooting to 900 yards with less than one inch of vertical and six inch spread. I leave in two weeks. I'll let you know how it work.

Go here and look through the pages of Berger bullet success stories. Clicking on the individual photos will bring up the particulars of each kill.
http://www.bergerbullets.com/information/success-stories/hunting/p1/

 

[Hogpatrol]

My fear is you'd take a shot at 100 yards and with that impact velocity somewhere around 3000+ fps, the bullet breaks up before getting into the vitals. I've never used Bergers but have always had the understanding it's for long distance. A PH tries to get you close.

Were it me, I'd find a different bullet especially for those velocities.

Phil, The Bergers are designed to go in two to three inches and explode sending shrapnel out six or more inches. Out of all the animals I've killed, I recovered one complete jacket and it had no lead remaining.
Having said that, don't know the OP but most guys taking a 28 Nosler are looking for long range shots. I cull hunt mostly springbok and blesbok and where I hunt, in daylight hours, it's rare to get within 400 yards of them.

 

[Divernhunter]

Knowing how that bullet is designed I would leave it at home. I would work up a load with Swift A-Frames or if you feel a need for a boattail bullet a Swift Scirocco. They have preformed excellent for me on 2 trips and close to 100 animals from short range out to 480 yards. They have worked in 338win mag, 257R, 257W and 30-06.
Generally speaking the PH will work to get you close for your shots.
My 2 Cents

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Phil, The Bergers are designed to go in two to three inches and explode sending shrapnel out six or more inches. Out of all the animals I've killed, I recovered one complete jacket and it had no lead remaining.
Having said that, don't know the OP but most guys taking a 28 Nosler are looking for long range shots. I cull hunt mostly springbok and blesbok and where I hunt, in daylight hours, it's rare to get within 400 yards of them.

Sounds similar to the CEB non-cons.

 

[Red Leg]

I have never used it. I have twice help friends look for lost deer shot with them. One we found - crater in the left shoulder (25-06 at 120 meters). The other the coyotes finished. Could have been the only two that have ever failed, but I won’t touch them.

 

[GA Hunter]

I used them one year on PG in a 300 WM and a 300 RUM. Everything I shot, including kudu and zebra, was either DRT or only stumbled a few yards to fall over. They performed exactly as advertised. The only bullet that “passed through” was on a warthog. He was shot through the shoulders at about 50 yards and his chest cavity basically exploded. I attribute that to the combination of velocity and the bullet performance.

Despite the results every PH in camp turned their nose up at them and mine very respectfully asked that I not bring then back if and when I return. I no longer use them when in Africa.

Will they work? Absolutely they will.

Best choice?? Probably not.

 

[Hogpatrol]

I used them one year on PG in a 300 WM and a 300 RUM. Everything I shot, including kudu and zebra, was either DRT or only stumbled a few yards to fall over. They performed exactly as advertised. The only bullet that “passed through” was on a warthog. He was shot through the shoulders at about 50 yards and his chest cavity basically exploded. I attribute that to the combination of velocity and the bullet performance.

Despite the results every PH in camp turned their nose up at them and mine very respectfully asked that I not bring then back if and when I return. I no longer use them when in Africa.

Will they work? Absolutely they will.

Best choice?? Probably not.

Trying to get one of the old school PHs or hunters to admit anything but a cup and core bullet will work is like trying to scale Mt. Everest without oxygen. Odd that a PH would ask to not use them if they worked as advertised. Maybe they like to show off their tracking skills?

 

[Dr Ray]

Good point there.

 

[gillettehunter]

I have taken several animals with the 180. They should do just fine. They are better if used behind the shoulder and not on the shoulder. I found mine exiting on both deer and antelope. Performance has been impressive. On larger animals there is often no exit and thus little blood for tracking. That is the PH's concern I believe. Remember to use a small drill to make sure the tips are not plugged. If the tip is plugged then they act more like a solid. That causes issues for some that use them. Good luck and report back.
Bruce

 

[Prariehunter]

I went to South Africa in 2013 for my first safari with only a 7mm wsm and 180 bergers. I killed 15 animals with 16 shots the extra bullet was for a croc that was dead first shot but ph was insisting on another shot. They will work for sure in saying that when I went back for my second safari last summer I took a 375 with 270 tsx which performed flawlessly.

 

[Tra3]

I just took a cow elk with a 180 grain berger VLD out of a 7 rem mag. Complete Pass through from a 240 yard shot, the cow went a few steps and tipped over. That was the second elk I shot with the Berger VLD. It worked very well.

 

[JMM]

I would leave the Bergers at home. I was in Namibia in late 2019 culling gemsbok, wildes, and a lot of zebras. One of the camps I stayed at had 2 hunters from Colorado. Both had new .300 win mag from a custom builder. The rifle builder had built up 180 grain Berger HVLD loads for both guns. First day, lost a kudu. Second day lost a gemsbok. Very dejected hunters and PH. Found the gemsbok on 3rd day and finished it off. Had a crater in the shoulder and lead fragments, but no penetration to vitals. They left their guns in camp and used the PH .308 the rest of the time I was there.

Swift a-frames will work great for the large plains game. I use 30/06 for the large stuff and a .223 bolt action for the impala class culling.

 

[Hogpatrol]

I would leave the Bergers at home. I was in Namibia in late 2019 culling gemsbok, wildes, and a lot of zebras. One of the camps I stayed at had 2 hunters from Colorado. Both had new .300 win mag from a custom builder. The rifle builder had built up 180 grain Berger HVLD loads for both guns. First day, lost a kudu. Second day lost a gemsbok. Very dejected hunters and PH. Found the gemsbok on 3rd day and finished it off. Had a crater in the shoulder and lead fragments, but no penetration to vitals. They left their guns in camp and used the PH .308 the rest of the time I was there.

Swift a-frames will work great for the large plains game. I use 30/06 for the large stuff and a .223 bolt action for the impala class culling.

You need to hunt with me. I'll show you how Bergers are supposed to work. They are a lung shot bullet, not a shoulder or bone breaking bullet. Those that screw up with them don't know how they are supposed to work, i.e, double lung, hand grenade. Been using them over seven years on seven hunts in RSA, Killed blue wildebeest to warthogs with them, at least 100 animals. Never lost an animal. 95% were DRT or walked a few steps and keeled over. Ranges were 100 to 700 yards. They perform as advertised if you use them properly, easy lung shots. The 300WM guys you referred to
had other issues, namely poor shot placement. It wasn't the bullet. I'll bet you never used them either.

 

[Bert the Turtle]

Why handicap yourself with a bullet that requires you to go only through ribs when there are other bullets that give more leeway? Do they give you much better ability to shoot at long range than other more forgiving bullets? It sounds like they are great if perfectly placed. What’s the upside when something like a TSX will kill plenty fast when put through the lungs and also gives you a larger margin of error. These are honest questions- I like shots to be perfect but plan for shots to be imperfect so I’m having a hard time seeing the upside.

 

[Hogpatrol]

Why handicap yourself with a bullet that requires you to go only through ribs when there are other bullets that give more leeway? Do they give you much better ability to shoot at long range than other more forgiving bullets? It sounds like they are great if perfectly placed. What’s the upside when something like a TSX will kill plenty fast when put through the lungs and also gives you a larger margin of error. These are honest questions- I like shots to be perfect but plan for shots to be imperfect so I’m having a hard time seeing the upside.

For me, the lungs are a huge target and relatively. easy to hit so they don't have to be perfectly placed. Anywhere in that area and it's lights out. The Berger website used to have photos of animals killed worldwide with their bullets, from Kodiak bear to springbok, and their largest bullet is a 300 grain .338. As far as accuracy, everyone has their preferences. Some like a sledgehammer Others prefer a guided missile.

 

[Hogpatrol]

I was in camp with a couple eastern Europeans. They both had custom 300WMs topped with Swaro scopes. Don't know what ammo they were shooting. They both had a fruitless first day, a bunch of misses and no animals in the salt. I guess it was either the ammo, their rifles or the Swaros that made them miss. Then again, it could have been the twelve empty wine bottles they deposited in the trash while the other hunters in camp slept. Blaming equipment for lost animals is folly.

 

[Newboomer]

I was in camp with a couple eastern Europeans. They both had custom 300WMs topped with Swaro scopes. Don't know what ammo they were shooting. They both had a fruitless first day, a bunch of misses and no animals in the salt. I guess it was either the ammo, their rifles or the Swaros that made them miss. Then again, it could have been the twelve empty wine bottles they deposited in the trash while the other hunters in camp slept. Blaming equipment for lost animals is folly.

I took my kudu with a 95gr VLD in a suppressed .243 at about 150 yds. It was the outfitter's and when he handed it to me I asked him if he was serious about taking a kudu with that popgun. He said he'd used it for years culling. We were going to hunt in an area where they raised bufs and didn't want the noise to scare them. I really had doubts but when I shot the kudu he was going away up a bank I hit him right between the shoulders. He dropped in his tracks with a severed spine. The bullet shattered the spine like a bomb. Bullet in the right spot but I wouldn't try it again.

 

[Shooter375]

To answer your question the 180 Berger VLD will work just fine on any African plains game if you shoot them broadside into the vitals. But there are more suitable 7mm projectiles depending upon the area and type of hunting you are doing. For example I hunt elk in thick timber and on open plains. I have a 28 Nosler that I use for long range open plain or cross canyon elk hunting. I have a 7 Rem Mag and a 375 H&H that I use in the timber. In the timber I shoot 160 grain Nosler Partitions in the 7 Rem Mag and 300 Swift A-Frames in the 375. Two years ago I shot an elk in the timber with the 7 Rem Mag. It was thick and the shot was at 30 yards. The only shot was a quartering away shot. I place the bullet into the stomach area off the elk just in front of the hind leg. The partition penetrated through the elk to the off side shoulder and killed the elk quickly. Three years ago, while hunting on the plains, I used a 195 Berger at 3050 fps out of the 28 Nosler. I hit the elk in the crease behind the shoulder with a shot from 539 yards. The elk dropped out of sight down the hill into a cedar canyon. When I approached the area that it was last seen, I saw the elk standing facing directly towards me. I put a second 195 Berger into the bottom of the V at base of the neck from 100 yards. The elk dropped "DRT." Upon inspection the first shot had penetrated with a small hole straight through the elks rib cage like a solid. No expansion. This second shot exploded in the heart lung area perfectly. I was lucky the elk did not run into the next county after the first shot. Soon after, I switched to a 175 grain Nosler Accubond Long Range (NABLR) at 3100 fps. Last year I used the 175 NABLR to drop an Elk at 730 yards. On Saturday, I used the 175 NABLR out of the 28 Nosler to drop an Elk at 463 yards. The bullet impacted on the high side of the shoulder dropping the elk instantly with both shoulder scapula's broken and penetration to the skin on the far side of the elk. However next month when I get to hunt a second elk in thick timber I am going to use my 375 H&H if the weather is good and my all weather 7 Rem Mag if it is snowy and wet. I wrote all this to illustrate that it is important to pick the right bullet for the conditions. If you are hunting Africa in the low veld where the bush is thick and shots are typically within a 100 yards then use a premium controlled expansion bullet like a Swift A-Frame, Nosler Partition, or Barnes TSX. But if you are hunting in the Karoo or other area that shots are typically 200-400 yards then use the 180 grain Berger's and wait for a broadside shot.