7x57 favorite loads

[zephyr]

Way to many things beyond my control have kept me from working up loads for my 7x57 this summer. I have settled on either the 150 or 160gr Partitions as I want one bullet for the gun, I finally got to the bench this past week.
First let me state that I am fully aware of using other peoples load data an take all info and suggestions with a grain of salt and again thank them for their time.
With that said I would like to ask a few questions.
I chose H4350 as I have more than enough on hand most manuals like the 4350's and earlier posts above recommended "any of the 4350's" for the 150's and 160's. I was somewhat surprised by the velocities suggested for the above bullets as I am close to max and 200fps short using the various reloading manuals that I have on hand as a reference source.
I have seen on "Load Data" that they have loads for "Modern Strong Actions Only" which gets me within "close enough " to the suggested velocities above.
When hand loading are people treating older Mauser actions differently than new modern actions?
Are there published pressures for new and old actions?
When looking at published pressures for the 7x57 they average around 45000psi.
Your thoughts will be greatly appreciated..

 

[stug]

Check the 708 velocities with a similar projectile, then load the 7x57 to get similar velocity. My BRNO 600 has a very long throat, but I am getting 2700 fps with a 162gr projectile and 2600 fps with a 175gr. The Norma cases show no pressure signs and the primers have a nice rounded edge. I am using ADI2209 which is rebadged H4350.

 

[Steve Steyr]

My Winchester Model 70 Lightweight, which is nearly the same as your Featherweight save yours has a better stock, has a looong throat. I get an easy 2950 fps with 140 grain bullets. This should translate, providing yours also has a long throat, to @ 2850 fps with 150 grainers and @2750 fps with 160 grainers if maximum velocity is your goal.
I have never had the best of luck with IMR4350 in any 7x57 as the case gets quickly overcrowded with this "big log" powder. If I recall, H4350 grains are about the same size as IMR4350. At 51 grains of IMR4350, there is heavy compression, which I'd just as soon avoid. 4350SC may overcome this problem but I have never tried it. H4831SC may also work.
Long ago, I switched to H414 (W-W 760) and/or N204. The older N204, which was a small grained product, was different than today's N204. It had a specific density of @ .970. This meant that a charge of 54 grains barely reached the shoulder where 51 grains of IMR4350 overflowed the case.
H414 (W-W760) is a ball powder with (usually) a slightly faster burn rate than any of the 4350's but takes up far less case space. It is a favorite for both accuracy and velocity with most bullet weights.
You also might consider RL17. It has been reported to deliver higher velocity in several cases but Alliant doesn't show much testing with it in 7x57.
New N204 is listed as being slightly faster burning than RL19 but many folks opine they are the same powder made in the same plant at the same time.
Anyway, those are my thoughts from handloading for my favorite for over 40 years now.
And, if your loads lack 200 fps from some desired maximum but are accurate, you can never lose with an accurate load in which you are confident.
Good luck on your great rifle in a great caliber.

 

[sestoppelman]

Re19 and 22 are my favorite powders and since I shoot mine mostly for targets, I shoot Nosler Ballistic Tips and Sierra Game Kings as they shoot great.

 

[Ray B]

Great information. I have a '98 action that turns 100 this year that has been rebarreled to 7x57. Considering the age, I'd show some respect and go with loads on the milder side, but it's a great rifle and cartridge.

 

[sestoppelman]

My Winchester Model 70 Lightweight, which is nearly the same as your Featherweight save yours has a better stock, has a looong throat. I get an easy 2950 fps with 140 grain bullets. This should translate, providing yours also has a long throat, to @ 2850 fps with 150 grainers and @2750 fps with 160 grainers if maximum velocity is your goal.
I have never had the best of luck with IMR4350 in any 7x57 as the case gets quickly overcrowded with this "big log" powder. If I recall, H4350 grains are about the same size as IMR4350. At 51 grains of IMR4350, there is heavy compression, which I'd just as soon avoid. 4350SC may overcome this problem but I have never tried it. H4831SC may also work.
Long ago, I switched to H414 (W-W 760) and/or N204. The older N204, which was a small grained product, was different than today's N204. It had a specific density of @ .970. This meant that a charge of 54 grains barely reached the shoulder where 51 grains of IMR4350 overflowed the case.
H414 (W-W760) is a ball powder with (usually) a slightly faster burn rate than any of the 4350's but takes up far less case space. It is a favorite for both accuracy and velocity with most bullet weights.
You also might consider RL17. It has been reported to deliver higher velocity in several cases but Alliant doesn't show much testing with it in 7x57.
New N204 is listed as being slightly faster burning than RL19 but many folks opine they are the same powder made in the same plant at the same time.
Anyway, those are my thoughts from handloading for my favorite for over 40 years now.
And, if your loads lack 200 fps from some desired maximum but are accurate, you can never lose with an accurate load in which you are confident.
Good luck on your great rifle in a great caliber.

Do you have a long magazine to go with the long throat or are you getting those very high velocities for single loading rounds? An easy 2950 with 140 gr bullets is not usually an easy thing to do with the 7x57. No loading manual will show speeds as high as those you list I don't think. I too like 760 in this case and it worked best for loading the 140 Barnes Triple Shocks in our .284 Win which has a somewhat larger case capacity than the 7x57. Our top load for it runs just over 3000 with MOA accuracy. It takes 55.5 grs of 760 to do that and that is over the Barnes manual max load. Be curious to know your load that gets 2950.

 

[Steve Steyr]

I just single load the M70. It is a long-action model so I assume it will accept rounds up to 3.34" but I've never really checked.
By my records, the fast load was with a heavy dose of old N204, with a specific density of .97. I won't give the exact charge (it was over 5 grains more than the new Norma Reloading Manual recommends for a 139 grain bullet) since I find the new formula for N204 is lighter in weight and is closer to RL17 or IMR4350 in burning rate. The old (1978 purchase) was in the RL19 burning rate range. I will say it was with a 140 gr Sierra Spitzer, W-W brass, a WLR primer, and an OAL of 3.09". In two series of 3 shots each, the average was 2981 fps and 2995 fps. I reduced the charge a grain or two and settled for 2950 fps.
A few years ago I bought several pounds on closeout of Winchester WXR ($10/lb) and Winchester WMR ($8/lb). I clocked some loads with WXR in the M70 7X57 yesterday and they were as follows:
51 gr WXR/150 Nosler Ballistic Tip/W-W/WLR/3.185" = 2658 FPS and touching at 50 yards.
50.5 gr WXR/150 Remington PSPCL/W-W/WLR/2.97" = 2570 fps. 1" at 50 yards.
48.5 gr WXR/168 gr Sierra HPBT/W-W/WLR/3.095" = 2554 fps. 1.3" horizontally at 50 yards.
All the fired cases had smoky necks and the primers were well rounded. When I was researching the WXR I bought, concensus was it was a fill-in stick (not the traditional Winchester ball) powder the same as RL22. The Hornady #8 Manual often found its burning rate closer to RL19 but to me it seems slower.
The WMR is slower still. I've yet to do much testing with WMR in the 7X57.

 

[sestoppelman]

Pressures must have been close to the ragged edge to get those kinds of speeds. 3.09 is no overly long, most will take longer. I have several loads that run 3.1 or a tad longer. My Ruger No. 1 has a longer throat than any other 7x57 I have owned. In it I was using 53 grs of R19 with 140 Ballistic Tips and only getting 2850 fps. and figured that was far enough. When you coax nearly 3000fps out of a 7x57 with 140 gr bullets that is well beyond any published data that I have ever heard of. The other loads you list are much more in line with normal expectations for this round. I have never used N204 before, rarely seen around here.

 

[Steve Steyr]

Please note: The loads I mentioned are in no way recommended loads, I am merely relating what I fed my rifle a couple of times.
There are several references to higher pressure 7x57 loads. Elmer Keith had one load, I forget now what it was, which seemed hot. Jack O'Connor recommended 50 gr IMR-4350 behind a 160 gr Sierra BT bullet. Most loading manuals stop at @ 46.5 grains or so.
Bob Hagel, in a May-June, 1973 Handloader article entitled "MODERN LOADS FOR THE 7X57 MAUSER" got 2981 fps from his 22" Ruger 77, throated long for 175 gr factory loads, using 55 gr N-204 and a 139 gr Hornady. His comment was "Little hot". He got 3014 fps from 57 gr N-205 from the same bullet. Hagel was never one who was afraid to 'tip the can" a little more than others.
There was another article in a 1977 (?) Handloader which I can not find now. The author went over Hagel's loads and showed several cases with blown primers and head separations. His velocities, also from a 22" Ruger 77, were scary fast.
Also, back in the late 1970's, Norma 204, 205, and MRP were, if they could be found, looked upon as magic potions. I am still using my once large stash of this old stuff, in 400 gram red and black metal cans, and it's not to be confused with the newer Norma powders of the same name.
As I mentioned, the current N204 (Cabela's in Wichita had some on closeout for $24.lb) is closer to IMR4350 and RL17 in burning rate. The old stuff is slower and very heavy. In W-W brass, I could not get 51 gr IMR4350 to work under a 140 gr Sierra without severe, loud crunchy, compression. 51 gr (or more!!) of the older N204 didn't come up to base of the shoulder.

 

[sestoppelman]

Man that is living on the edge! Too much of a good thing in my view, that is after all what makes rounds like the .280 Rem - 7x64 - .270 Win etc., more sensible. You can get those velocities easy but without pushing 65K cup, beating the hell out of the rifle and staying safe and not having to always have a mallet along to hammer open the bolt!

 

[Steve Steyr]

As I mentioned, this was a "trial" I did a few times in 2007, I believe. Anymore, I load like an old man because, well, I have become an old man! I think I will write the "Grandpa Grunt Wussy Loading Manual".
I found an accurate load for my .250 Savage that coasts a 100 gr bullet along at 2650 fps and I'm thrilled. My 26" Ruger #1 .218 Bee shoots a 45 gr bullet at 3050 fps and I tremble. I shiver in ecstasy when 8 people shoot 26 rounds from my 1905 made Winchester 1894 32-40 into a 6"x4" group at 300m, even though the load clocks only 1269 fps. I spend half my reloading time with 0000 steel wool polishing the carbon off case necks due to low pressure slow obturation. My salad years have slowly morphed into a time of wilted lettuce.

 

[sestoppelman]

Gee you sound like me, must be about the same age, LOL! Not a grandpa yet though!

 

[Michael Dean]

I've got a Ruger No. 1 in 7x57. I've been searching for load data that takes advantage of this chambers strength. Wondering if anyone has any experience pushing 2,700-2,800 fps pushing a 168 grain bullet using Reloader 17. Lots of info out there for 4350 powder but little if any for reloader 17.

Any information and or experience shooting Reloader 17 using heavier bullets at these levels would be appreciated.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

I've got a Ruger No. 1 in 7x57. I've been searching for load data that takes advantage of this chambers strength. Wondering if anyone has any experience pushing 2,700-2,800 fps pushing a 168 grain bullet using Reloader 17. Lots of info out there for 4350 powder but little if any for reloader 17.

Any information and or experience shooting Reloader 17 using heavier bullets at these levels would be appreciated.

I would think you'd need to find your max OAL for this bullet first to maximize case capacity in order to obtain that high a velocity. Link below has a RL17 recipe for a 160gr Speer. It shows the load as 44gr of RL17. If it were me I'd back down from that a fair amount to ensure I had a safe starting load. If that shows safe, then work up from there until either you hit your velocity desired or you see high pressure signs.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reload...2&weight=160&shellid=70&bulletid=185&bdid=933

 

[sestoppelman]

That is pushing the limits of the round especially in a 22" barrel. You are talking .270 or .280 Rem territory there and the smaller 7x57 really isn't built for that within safe pressure limits. I have not used 17 but in my experience 19 and 22 give very good results. Phil makes a good point about OAL. Some Rugers have long throats, others dont and that will determine powder capacity. I doubt anyone will willingly give you a recipe for loads that produce those speeds, as the pressures are going to be necessarily high. Too adventurous for me anyway.

 

[Areaonereal]

You are expecting way too much from the 7x57 with that bullet and speed. Would not try that in any way.

 

[Michael Dean]

You are expecting way too much from the 7x57 with that bullet and speed. Would not try that in any way.

I know it's asking a lot; my intention is to start out slow and increase with .3 increments. Any pressure signs and I'm done. The rifle does have a long throat, allowing me to seat the bullets much further out. I do believe that stated maximums for this cartridge are due to the older 98 rifles out there that have much lower tolerances.

 

[sestoppelman]

No, not the 98 Mauser but earlier 95's. The 98 derives its attributes thru its design and not its materials. The 98 is a very strong action, however any good modern action does offer a higher margin of safety due to ITS better steels. Tread carefully and don't ignore the signs. If you get a sticky bolt lift you are already in dangerous territory.

 

[fourfive8]

Looking back in my load log I found my favorite load for the 7x57. Use the interlocks for punching paper. I settled on the 150 Nosler Partition and 4064 loaded to a mv of 2500-2550. Now I've converted all my 4064 loads to Varget. Very similar powders. Varget is temperature insensitive. Stay in those velocity parameters with that bullet in the 7x57 and be a very happy camper.

 

[Rick Cox]

My old data has me using a 139 Gr bullet over 52.4 Gr. of Win. 760, velocity will be dependent on your barrel length. I like using Win. 760 because it meters very well through my Dillon 550B press. In colder climates a Magnum Primer might be a good idea to insure proper ignition. I took several nice white tails using this load. The 7x57isn't very fussy, many other powders i.e. 4895, 4350, 4064 will all give acceptable results.

Good tip on the primer.