505 gibbs load suggestion

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Matt, Don't be too hasty before purchasing one of those .40's. Well, not until you've shot my .416Rigby in anyways.

 

[matt85]

Marius have you experienced a big difference between the 416 Remington and the 416 Rigby? while I haven't tried either, I have fired my 500/416 NE plenty of times (400gr at 2325fps) and found it very enjoyable.

-matt

 

[matt85]

doctari505, something I just noticed about the North Fork 600gr CPS sample pack that arrived last week is the bullets appear to be of different design then the ones in your article. http://kilimanjarorifles.com/press-kevin-robertson-article.html

the new design has a much smaller cup and a bevel in place around the cup which I assume is there to assist feeding. (http://www.northforkbullets.com/magento/products/bullets/?bweight=25)

have you tried this new design? is it still as effective?

thanks
-matt

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Marius have you experienced a big difference between the 416 Remington and the 416 Rigby? while I haven't tried either, I have fired my 500/416 NE plenty of times (400gr at 2325fps) and found it very enjoyable.

-matt

Matt,
Shooting the .416Rigby is total bliss! I'll tell you that I will shoot it 10 times over, rather than shoot my .300Win. Completely different recoil. The case capacity of the Rigby means that it operates at lower pressure levels. I read of a hunter who I could quite easily track down, that loads his .416Rigby to generate in excess of 6000ft/lbs of energy, which in essence means that it outperforms the .458Lott with its 500gr pill.
The great Sir Isaac Newton taught us for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, which in essence means that at these loads ,what goes out the front, must be reacted in a rearward motion.
But, since you are looking at shooting the big Gibbs, this should not be a problem for you. I, myself, don't enjoy having my retinas torn from my eyeballs...

 

[matt85]

I, myself, don't enjoy having my retinas torn from my eyeballs...

doctors can fix that now right?

ive heard the 416 Rigby can be loaded to 2600fps but I cant picture that being any fun to shoot. something about the higher velocities that makes the recoil tougher to handle. my 375 H&H loaded with my hand loads (300gr bullet at 2500fps) delivers less recoil then my 500/416 NE (400gr at 2300fps) but the 375 H&H will leave my shoulder a little sore after lots of shooting while my 500/416 NE seems to have little to no lasting effects. im perfectly happy with 400gr at 2300fps in both performance and recoil. that's why im considering the 416 Remington as well as the 416 Rigby. the 416 Remington if pushed hard can get a 400gr to 2500fps but in standard loads it sits nicely at 2300fps.

-matt

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

I have found my .416Rigby to recoil less than my .375H&H

 

[enysse]

You know what they say about perception Marius....lol

Yes, it not possible for the 300 Win Mag or the 375 H&H to out recoil the 416 Rigby. I have shot all 3 and the 416 Rigby seperates from the rest with ease . Physics 101!

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Eric,
It comes down to felt recoil, really. I will shoot that .416Rigby all day long, as compared to the sharp kick of the .300Win Mag.

 

[massad]

Eric,
It comes down to felt recoil, really. I will shoot that .416Rigby all day long, as compared to the sharp kick of the .300Win Mag.

 

[massad]

Hey Fellas,
Having shot the CZ .416 Rigby and Remington in .416 I have found the Remmy with @10% less recoil with similar performance of 400 grain @2300. I prefer my .458 Lott which is 10% again heavier recoil than the aforementioned Rigby but in a rifle that fits me well and this makes all the difference.

Having the MRC .505, I can say this is a fun rifle to shoot! Welcome Doctari! Recently purchased your book "The Perfect Shot II" I can highly recommend it to anyone interested in hunting Africa with a wealth of information on calibers and proper shot placement. I would ask if you would be okay with me emailing you for suggestions on reloading recipes (to be used at my own risk of course) for 525 grain and 600 grain bullet loadings. Also anything on low powered practice rounds, possibly using Trail Boss or 5744? Thank you again and thank you to all responding on this thread.
Dr. Mike

 

[enysse]

Eric,
It comes down to felt recoil, really. I will shoot that .416Rigby all day long, as compared to the sharp kick of the .300Win Mag.

For some reason I think they both kick sharp and hard. I love their ballistics but the 300 Win Mag has moved to back of the closet.

 

[ActionBob]

Just thought it was interesting that CZ loads and labels ammo for the 505

 

[450 Rigby]

not yet, the gun should hopefully be here either late next week or the following week.

will keep you updated if my retinas detach or my shoulder dislocates.

-matt

How has your experience been with your 505 Gibbs? I've gotten the 505 bug & it's pretty bad.

I've been shooting an 11.5 lb AHR CZ 550 #3 package in 450 Rigby with 500gr A-Frames & it's pretty darn brisk with a brake. The stock doesn't fit me the best so.....why not get another rifle??

The 505 I'm looking at is 12.5 lbs w/o brake. I'm thinking the recoil may be similar if I keep the velocity with 570gr Swift A-Frames, 600gr CPS's to 2100 fps or so. My gunsmith has lead me to believe the recoil will be very similar. I'm not sure if I've lost my mind or if I need a frontal lobotomy.

 

[zephyr]

Here is a recoil calculator to help you along

ShootersCalculator.com | Recoil Calculator

An online calculator that calculates the recoil energy, impulse, and velocity of a firearm according to the firearm's weight, powder charge, bullet weight, and bullet muzzle velocity.

shooterscalculator.com

you will see that powder choice can make a big difference in felt recoil
When loading for my 505 Gibbs (11 lbs empty) shooting 525gr CEB Solids and 485gr Raptors at 2300fps I chose RL15 to keep the recoil and time in recoil manageable
the Woodleigh reloading manual is one of the better sources for loads for the 505
Good luck

 

[Hunter-Habib]

I prefer Northfork 600Gr Flat Point Solids & 600Gr Cup Point Solids at 2150fps.

 

[450 Rigby]

I prefer Northfork 600Gr Flat Point Solids & 600Gr Cup Point Solids at 2150fps.

What powder/charge are you using?

 

[450 Rigby]

Here is a recoil calculator to help you along

ShootersCalculator.com | Recoil Calculator

An online calculator that calculates the recoil energy, impulse, and velocity of a firearm according to the firearm's weight, powder charge, bullet weight, and bullet muzzle velocity.

shooterscalculator.com

you will see that powder choice can make a big difference in felt recoil
When loading for my 505 Gibbs (11 lbs empty) shooting 525gr CEB Solids and 485gr Raptors at 2300fps I chose RL15 to keep the recoil and time in recoil manageable
the Woodleigh reloading manual is one of the better sources for loads for the 505
Good luck

How have the 485gr Raptors & 525 CEB solids performed?

Are there other powders you prefer in 505 Gibbs that develop less perceived recoil?

 

[zephyr]

This August past shot a Buff with the 485 Raptor and a Cow Ele with a 525 Solid each was one an done ...
Have shot numerous DG with CEB bullets out of my 400H&H, 450NE and 458 Lott now my 505 Gibbs very happy with their results.
Very happy with the RL15 next powder choice would have been H4350 both of these powders require a foam filler next powder choice H4831 no filler

 

[450 Rigby]

This August past shot a Buff with the 485 Raptor and a Cow Ele with a 525 Solid each was one an done ...
Have shot numerous DG with CEB bullets out of my 400H&H, 450NE and 458 Lott now my 505 Gibbs very happy with their results.
Very happy with the RL15 next powder choice would have been H4350 both of these powders require a foam filler next powder choice H4831 no filler

That says a lot about CEB bullets. I've never tried them but I will soon. I've heard nothing but great things about the Raptors.

I've never used a foam filler in all my years of reloading. I have read about it on occasion but never paid much attention as I wasn't shooting any cartridges that would require a filler.

Would you mind sharing the process? Is there a specific amount or type of filler you use? Do you buy them or procure them yourself? Probably a stupid question but better safe than sorry.

 

[zephyr]

Why Foam Fillers
One of my main concerns when stepping up to the 505 from my 450NE and 458 Lott was managing the Rifle's recoil and more importantly managing the Time in recoil. For managing the recoil I was happy with the Rifles weigh and Fit the Powder charge was next.... I used the Woodleigh Manual as a resource for loading data for my 505 Gibbs, they offered many powder choices for their 525gr and 600gr bullets. For their 525gr Bullet they went from 102grs of RL15 to 153grs of Norma MRP. If you apply those numbers to a recoil calculator with a velocity of 2300fps and a 11.5 lb rifle that gives you a recoil of 87 ft.lbs using RL15 and 112ft.lbs of recoil using MRP. I loaded the two different powders and the difference was more than noticeable
Back to Foam Fillers .... Their is a lot of space in a 505 case ...The Woodleigh Manual recommends Foam Fillers with their 3 fastest powders, the filler is there to keep the powder in a packed column insuring consistent burn. Foam vs the many other fillers used in the past has shown in pressure test to create consistent pressures unlike the pressure excursions associated with fillers like poly fiber.
The two types of foam filler that I have used are the precut and sized wads by Kynoch that you can purchase from Trader Keith or go to you local hardware store and buy a foam backer rod and cut them yourself.. They easily insert into the case over the powder and and I gentle push it down with the end of a pencil then load seat and crimp your bullet as normal.
I have some 15 year old RL15 loads with Foam filler loaded for my 450NE ,I recently pulled one to check on the foam for any deterioration and could not find any...
Sorry a little long winded but hope it helps
Let us know what you end up loading