.50-90 Sharps for Africa

[michael458]

I may have missed something in your commentary, are you saying that you pushed a 570gr CEB solid to 2200fps with H322? I can easily to the 475gr Raptor doing that; could you clear that up for me.

No, its the 510 gr CEB SOlid and its matching 475 gr Raptor......... My research partner is a double rifle fanatic, we did the research on the bands on the CEB bullets and the design that is safe in double rifles. He knew the incredible success I had with my various .500 caliber cartridges with the CEB Solid we designed here, in particular a 500 gr SOlid and matching 450 Raptor in .500 caliber. In 2012 he had Dan do a 510 gr SOlid and matching 475 Raptor for his 500 NE Guns...... and in 2012 we took these to Australia to test extensively on buffalo. They performed to the extreme. Buffalo would just stand and quiver after taking the hit from the Raptors. Later we did the load data on 500 NE here including pressure data. We were able to run the 510 Solids at 2300 + and the 475 Raptors over 2400 fps all under 45000 PSI. These were incredible results with 500 NE. They are used by many hunters with 500 NE the solids for elephant, buffalo and hippo, and of course the Raptors for buffalo. I just had a good friend return from elephant hunting last month, with success. He has taken several elephant with the 510 Solids.............

 

[Forrest Halley]

We were able to run the 510 Solids at 2300 + and the 475 Raptors over 2400 fps all under 45000 PSI. These were incredible results with 500 NE. They are used by many hunters with 500 NE the solids for elephant, buffalo and hippo, and of course the Raptors for buffalo. I just had a good friend return from elephant hunting last month, with success. He has taken several elephant with the 510 Solids.............

Do go on about this testing...how hot were you able to run them? That barrel on your #1 looks like a rechambering and reboring job? Any idea what the original caliber was?

 

[Rafiki]

No, its the 510 gr CEB SOlid and its matching 475 gr Raptor......... My research partner is a double rifle fanatic, we did the research on the bands on the CEB bullets and the design that is safe in double rifles. He knew the incredible success I had with my various .500 caliber cartridges with the CEB Solid we designed here, in particular a 500 gr SOlid and matching 450 Raptor in .500 caliber. In 2012 he had Dan do a 510 gr SOlid and matching 475 Raptor for his 500 NE Guns...... and in 2012 we took these to Australia to test extensively on buffalo. They performed to the extreme. Buffalo would just stand and quiver after taking the hit from the Raptors. Later we did the load data on 500 NE here including pressure data. We were able to run the 510 Solids at 2300 + and the 475 Raptors over 2400 fps all under 45000 PSI. These were incredible results with 500 NE. They are used by many hunters with 500 NE the solids for elephant, buffalo and hippo, and of course the Raptors for buffalo. I just had a good friend return from elephant hunting last month, with success. He has taken several elephant with the 510 Solids.............

That's really interesting. I don't shoot a 500 NE double so have no practical experience however I have read quite a bit on double gun regulation and the issues with changing loads from what the gun was regulated for. It would seem that pushing a lighter bullet at greater velocity would change the POI between the two barrels one way or the other. Did you (or your friend) find any appreciable change in the POI of the barrels?

Anyway, I shoot a No 1 so I'm particularly interested in the load data for the 50-90 Sharps, specifically the amount of H322 used and the cartridge OAL for the bullets mentioned .... and do you recall the primers used?

 

[michael458]

Do go on about this testing...how hot were you able to run them? That barrel on your #1 looks like a rechambering and reboring job? Any idea what the original caliber was?

Hey Forest, no I really have not done anything with this, nothing like any serious load data or pressure data. Just not my intentions with this rifle/cartridge.

Heres the deal, friend of mine had it for sale, contacted me, I love Big Bore rifles, and I thought it might be fun to play with. He told me that some years ago the rifle started life as a 416 Remington, he sent it somewhere to have it "ReBored"..... now I know nothing about "Rebore", I had always started with a new barrel and go from there......... It is also 1:15 twist rate, which seems common in .510 caliber. Later he sent the gun to SSK and Brian did a deep black mirror finish blue job on it, and it is incredible, Brian does a hell of a job with that high polish finish. Not sure what else he had Brian do at the time, if anything. He had 150 pieces of New Starline 50-90 brass and the dies...... I figured I had to see what it was about.

I had and have no serious intentions of doing extensive load data, that just was not my goal for this. I will never hunt the gun and won't be in the field with it, since I have retired from actual hunting. I have a lot of .510 caliber bullets on hand, and wanted to see if I could get the 475 Raptors to around 2200 or so along with the 510 Solids from CEB. That is accomplished now, so I may not dig much more into it. I have a good cast load for the Cast Performance bullets I have left over from 20+ years ago, so that won't be a pursuit either.

Its a spiffy rifle, I intend to look into some sort of better sight system, although it is able to put 510/475s in the same hole dead center at 25 yards, irons, and I can't see crap nor shoot irons very well, maybe we just got lucky yesterday...... HEH...... Also it needs a decent recoil pad.......

I don't shoot a 500 NE double so have no practical experience however I have read quite a bit on double gun regulation and the issues with changing loads from what the gun was regulated for. It would seem that pushing a lighter bullet at greater velocity would change the POI between the two barrels one way or the other. Did you (or your friend) find any appreciable change in the POI of the barrels?

No issues with the doubles and the CEB bullets, either 570/535s or 510/475s, just find the right loads and most of that is with RL 15 and we had a great load with WW 760 as well........ I am not a double rifle fan....... I don't own or want one. My friend however has well over 2 dozen of the things and he hunts mostly with 577NE....... using CEBs. He also dropped the standard weights of that caliber as well to 650 Solids and 600 Raptors...... Doubles are indeed finicky. I had one of his doubles here continuing the research on barrel strain, pressures, I even did some powder blending with it. He wanted me to get it ready, so I had a great load with WW 760, at 25 yards the left/right in the same hole for me.......... He arrived, shot the gun, and the same load was 4 inches apart for him? The way we held the gun........ Yeah, thats a little finicky for my tastes........

Anyway, I shoot a No 1 so I'm particularly interested in the load data for the 50-90 Sharps, specifically the amount of H322 used and the cartridge OAL for the bullets mentioned .... and do you recall the primers used?

Yeah, I am going to PM you this, since honestly I am not familiar with the various strengths of different rifles chambered in 50-90, I am quite sure that some of these loads might be a bit much for some guns, and would not wish to cause confusion, this is Ruger #1 only..........

And remember, I really have done very very little on this, just a couple of sessions on the range, no pressure data, and not really much to it........I took well established data from my own 500 B&M, which is .500 caliber, 2.5 inch RUM case for bolt guns......... I looked at the few powders I played with for 500 gr .500 caliber bullets, and moved that over to the 50-90....... whatever pressures I had in 500 B&M would be LESS in the 50-90, because of the larger case capacity and larger diameter. Regardless I lowered the charge to start with anyway, following good safe practices........ One of my powder choices did not work out, IMR 8208 did not behave well, and H-322 behaved pretty good with no issues..........

 

[michael458]

Out of curiosity I reviewed some of my 500 B&M data, and referred to the burn chart......other powders that I think would be worthy of taking a look at in the future would be V-N530, which I ran 500 CEB Solids at 2250 fps in my 18 inch 500 B&M at 55000 PSI, the same load in 50-90 would be less pressure, and with 24 inch barrel at least equal velocity I would think, or close..... X-Terminator is also a top end powder in the 500 B&M, but I have only worked with it with the 450/410s.... and not 500 gr bullets, but it could be tried easy. RL 10X and H-4895 could be looked at as well......I blended a mix of 60% RL 15 and 40% RL 7 that did well, but I think it was still a little slow, probably 50/50 mix might be better.

 

[Rafiki]

I received a Lee Factory Crimp Die yesterday, custom made for a 50-90 Sharps. The cartridge in the image is a dummy made with a Hornady 570gr DGX.

 

[Rafiki]

At long last I received my shipment of Peregrine's and loaded up a few 500 Sharps 2-1/2" (50-90 Sharps). These were 570gr VRG-2. I measured all of them and the all were .510", 575gr,; good quality control, very consistent.

At the range I was a bit disappointed. Although very accurate the loads I made up didn't produce my goal velocity, 2150fps.

80gr of W748 is a full case with this bullet and only produced 1986fps. 80gr of H335 is a little better at 2017fps with 94% load density. These are copper monolith solids so they take up a bit more case volume in a already limited case.

One subjective observation is that the recoil, while still substantial, seemed softer. Yes, they were travelling a little slower than what I'm used to but not all that much slower. They also were very accurate off the bench using my AimPointe H30L Red Dot.

 

[Forrest Halley]

@Rafiki have you considered H4895?

 

[Rafiki]

@Rafiki have you considered H4895?

Yes, but haven't found any. All loading supplies are very scarce here. I had H335 (my go to powder) and W748 (which I haven't found a good use for). Had high hopes for H335.

I may have to go for a shorter Peregrine, therefore lighter, that'll take another 6mos.