458 WM to 458 Lott Re-Chambering

[HookMeUpII]

The 450 gr and 500 gr bullets are better I think. 400 gr is a little light on elephant and buffalo. Probably good on Eland and plainsgame but I think that there are better calibres for that. I think that higher velocity causes a more vigorous kick of recoil. I find my current 515 gr load at 2200 fps has the same recoil as 480 gr at 2250 fps and 450 gr at around 2300 fps. I would try 450,480 and 500 gr and check your velocity is comfortably around 2100 + fps

Interesting. I am new to the DG idea so not being argumentative, just really curious.

Why does 375HH get the nod so often for buffalo?

Is it one of the cases in which it works, but could be better?

 

[WAB]

Interesting. I am new to the DG idea so not being argumentative, just really curious.

Why does 375HH get the nod so often for buffalo?

Is it one of the cases in which it works, but could be better?

Look at the SD of the 300 gr bullet. I think it will answer your question.

 

[HookMeUpII]

Look at the SD of the 300 gr bullet. I think it will answer your question.

.305

Makes sense. I didn't really understand SD.

Now its clear why it's so favored.

 

[gibbs30c]

I had two 458 WM that I built on P-14 Enfield actions back when these actions poured into the country in the late 80's and '90's.

It was a no brainier to take one out to 458 Lott and the job was simple, as you don't have to touch the headspace, simple put index marks on the action and barrel if they are not already there then remove the barrel, chuck the barrel in the lathe, and ream the Win Mag chamber .300" longer to become a Lott.

Then simply reinstall the barrel to the index marks. If you didn't touch the belts headspace in the barrel you are good to go.

I have a friend who also did the same job by hand just using the "T" handle and a rented reamer and it came out just fine. However you are lengthening the chamber .300 or 3/10 so if great care is not taken to keep the pilot of the reamer tight in the throat you may get the chamber slightly out of round. The key would be to go slow and use plenty of lube, cleaning the chamber and reamer often.

Having both the Lott and the Win Mag on the same action with the same barrel manf., I'm able to compare the two chamberings performance side by side, and I can honestly say I'm not sure the effort is worth it to rechamber the Win Mag to the Lott.

That being said my Lott is faster especially since in a bit of a haste, I cut the Win mags barrel to 22" thinking it would be a lot more handy in the this bush.......which it is, but at a cost of about 50 to 75 FPS with the same bullets weights and different powders.

I load AA 2460 in both rifles and get very good results in all bullet weights and types.

You really can't put too much 2460 in the Win Mag as the case volume is the real limiting factor. You can do a little better with AA 2460 ALMOST (but faster) twin AA2230. However the 2460 does just about as well with lower pressures.

I always use Federal 215M primers and always get good ignition.

Everyone is correct the 450 grain bullets has really allowed to Win Mag to come into it's own.

But the 500 can still give very good results with proper loading techniques, such as a powder drop tube, and vibrating the Win Mag case with it's powder loaded in the case before seating the bullet.

Everyone by now knows the history of the Lott created by Jack Lott after being tossed by a very upset Buffalo after Jack shot him with a 458 Win Mag.

Jack was sure the 458 WM round had Squibed. Whether that is what actually happened , or the bullet failed, or brush got in the way, or etc.,etc., etc,.......we really don't know.

But it was enough for Mr Lott to lengthen the 458 WM that .300" and give us this very fine round the "LOTT" with a little more case capacity.

More important what Mr. Lott stopped was the unmerciful compacting of the powder in the Win Mag case, which many believe led to the "Squib Loads" the 458 WM gained a reputation for putting out.

But this all happened in 1959 65 YEARS AGO! Powders, Primers, and Bullets have come a long way since then. Also 458 Ammo in Africa was often left to bake on the dash board of the"Rover" then exposed to rain, rivers, and left to turn green in ammo belts, to God only know what effect.

After working with the 458 WM for almost 40 years and having loaded and fired hundreds of rounds I can honestly say it does not deserve the "trash talk" some give it.

The 458 Win Mag is a very effective, dependable and powerful round. I can get 2200 + with 500 grains bullets in my 458 WM with good loading techniques even with the 22" barrel. But I can also get 2350++ in the Lott with the same bullets and it's 24" barrel. Does that make a huge difference.....Maybe?

The 2150 FPS goal of course, was Winchester trying to duplicate the old English Nitro Express loads as some have already mentioned here.

2150 FPS seems to be the "Gold Standard" for the 45 Cals. It is the same with the 2400 Fps standard for all the various 40 Cals pushing 400 grain bullets.

I doubt any well hit buffalo ever knew the difference if any of the various 45 calibers or the various 40 calibers were 100 or even 200 FPS slower.

I love both my Lott and my Win Mag, both have been to Africa and both have performed very well.

I would not consider trading either one, and fully intend to see them in my Grandsons hands, after all PaPa built them.

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

As has been mentioned before, Lott did not invent that case, he basically stole the idea from Watts.
gumpy