.450 BPE Case Slightly too Wide in Vintage Rifle?

[Tom Leoni]

All ~

I have recently acquired a lovely Alex Henry .450 BPE single shot, probably from the mid 1880s. Upon attempting to insert an empty resized case, it appears that the head is slightly too wide for the chamber, thereby preventing the case to fully insert. It's probably a matter of just a few thousandths of an inch, but the very rear portion of the case just wouldn't go in.

I know that some of you also toy around with antique rifles and attempt to solve the little idiosyncrasies and vagaries associated thereto.

Do you have any suggestions on how to get around this problem? The easiest seems to be to have someone like Steven Bertram recut the chamber to match modern SAAMI-spec .450 NE brass. Or I could make a chamber casting and order a custom resizing die, but that would probably also take forever, but perhaps some of you have an easier and more expedient solution, like using some other caliber resizing die to slightly slim down the case head (just spitballing here).

Thank you in advance!

 

[Green Chile]

I'm working on the exact same issue in my singles and doubles. Some of the brass drops in and some does not. Interestingly, about half of my Kynoch brass is the same. I also have the same experience with 450 NE brass. Please don't cut the chamber on your vintage guns! We will get it sorted and I would far rather have a custom die than greatly reduce the originality of the gun. They are classics.

 

[Tom Leoni]

Hi, Bryan--thanks for the heads-up. I'm interested in knowing more about your experience with this. I have dozens of vintage rifles and this is the first time I've experienced this problem.

 

[Green Chile]

I was planning on getting the advice of a very seasoned collector/shooter friend of mine. Bertram is another good idea...he sold me some of my guns...JJ is another good source. I ended up loading the brass that fits and separated the brass that doesn't...but don't have the answer yet.

 

[Green Chile]

I just took this photo with the Purdey single to show what Tom is talking about...this is with vintage Kynoch brass.

 

[Green Chile]

Same thing with modern 450 NE brass from Hornady...

 

[Kdgj]

Tom,

I had a problem with a 400/360 Fraser single shot. The only new brass I could find was from Bertram brass. Very few cases if any would fit. Like you, it looked so close but they didn’t fit. I FL resized the brass a few times. People more experienced than me gave me two techniques to try:

1) while resizing turn the brass 90 degrees. Resize and then lower the the case to to turn it and resize again.
2) put a thin piece of scotch tape around the case during resizing

Neither of these worked 100%, but I got a few more cases to fit. Even after firing in the rifle, the brass needed to be resized again to fit the chamber. I finally used cut down and resized 9.3x74R brass to make life easier.

Also, are you sure the head is where the case is too large. You may want to smoke the case to make sure it isn’t tight somewhere else.

Ken

 

[Huvius]

Also, are you sure the head is where the case is too large. You may want to smoke the case to make sure it isn’t tight somewhere else.

Ken

Was going to say this too.
Two options to try are to press your case into the die without the shell holder to get that last little bit sized and tap it out of the die with a brass rod or similar.
Also, you can take your die and lathe off a few thou of the face to shorten it a bit. This works well with a straight tapered case such as the 450 as it will give a little more squeeze over the entire length of the brass - as long as the die doesn’t have an edge to get hung up on at the mouth of the brass.

 

[degoins]

I received some Hornady brass with a vintage double .450 a few years ago that the previous owner had turned down on a lathe to make them fit. I've loaded them many times and they are still going strong. I also sent one of those case to Rocky Mountain Cartridge and had them make me some cases based on the measurements of that case.

 

[Huvius]

As degoins says, turning down the base is another option and really no worry as modern brass is pretty stout down in the web and BPE loads will be no problem.
I’ve done this too just after other methods don’t satisfy.