404 Jeffery Hodgdon H 4350 loads feedback?

[SkullKeeper]

I am seating Barnes X 400 gr to OAL 3.53" or 89.75mm.
View attachment 627151
They cycle in my 98 Mauser and group well at 50 yards. Taking my time working up to 100 yards. I'm only good for half a dozen rounds per range trip. I killed my first buffalo at 110 yards but that is outer limits in my opinion, especially for 404. That 400 gr bullet won't have enough gas at 150+ yards.

North Fork makes a 430 grain soft nose that I like a lot (muzzle velocity from my 24” barrel is 2320 FPS)

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Feedback:
H4350, 83gn, BARNES X 400gn bullet at 56meters /183.727ft (v-express sight ) open sight no pressures , bolt opens smooth ..
1) 2204 f/s
2) 2193f/s
3) 2163f/s

S365, 76gn(max) BARNES 400gn bullets 60 meters/196.85ft (v-express sights ) open sights no pressure, bolt opens smoothly..

I will be reloading the following:
H4350, 84gn, BARNES X 400 bullets , OAL 89.5

Thank you kindly for the members who participated in this thread, it is as always much, much appreciated

Today:
S365 , 76gn ( maximum load SONCHEM) BARNES X 400gn , OAL 89.5mm
1) 2128 f/s
2) 1581f/s
3) 1610 f/s
I suspect the primers was not able to ignite this much propellant, I would like to hear your opinions.. 60m/196.85ft

 

[Dirtdart]

Today:
S365 , 76gn ( maximum load SONCHEM) BARNES X 400gn , OAL 89.5mm
1) 2128 f/s
2) 1581f/s
3) 1610 f/s
I suspect the primers was not able to ignite this much propellant, I would like to hear your opinions.. 60m/196.85ft

I have friends that avoid Somchem if possible because of inconsistency issues but that velocity spread is extreme! If my chrono spit out those numbers I would triple check my charge weights.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I agree. The Sonchem loads are obviously not working. How much room in the case? I'm also a bit surprised at low velocity of 83 gr H4350. I am shooting 80 gr Accurate 4350 same Barnes X bullet and they seem to have plenty of gas. No chrono but my teeth bang together pretty hard with recoil. I started at minimum 77 gr. Recoil was much gentler but primers were pushing out = not enough gas. With 2x scope the 80 gr loads were putting holes on top of each other at 50 meters.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

I have friends that avoid Somchem if possible because of inconsistency issues but that velocity spread is extreme! If my chrono spit out those numbers I would triple check my charge weights.

Dirtdart , I am using the RCBS Chargemaster Supreme, I am sure it is quit accurate and consistent. The RCBS Chargemaster has a LEARNING function to assess the type of propellant every time you want to re-load ...It can either be the Remington primers that did not ensure a complete ignition, or the chrony did not registered correctly..I am changing to CCI Large Rifle primers for the next reloads, or the S365 not working optimally..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

I agree. The Sonchem loads are obviously not working. How much room in the case? I'm also a bit surprised at low velocity of 83 gr H4350. I am shooting 80 gr Accurate 4350 same Barnes X bullet and they seem to have plenty of gas. No chrono but my teeth bang together pretty hard with recoil. I started at minimum 77 gr. Recoil was much gentler but primers were pushing out = not enough gas. With 2x scope the 80 gr loads were putting holes on top of each other at 50 meters.

The volume of the S365 propellant is about the same level in the case as the H4350 propellant...I decided on the H4350, 84gn , BARNES X 400gn bullet, OAL 89.5
If I was a better shot it would be possible to get smaller groups with the v-express sights..at 60 meters a hunter is suppose to get a good shot placement on a buffalo cow..it depends how good your PH is to get you as near as possible to the buffalo...
Even at 100 meters you are suppose to be able to get a good shot placement on a large body game animal like a buffalo cow for sure

I am contemplating building a ghost ring to fit on the 404 Jeffery or a red dot sight..

 

[Ontario Hunter]

The volume of the S365 propellant is about the same level in the case as the H4350 propellant...I decided on the H4350, 84gn , BARNES X 400gn bullet, OAL 89.5
If I was a better shot it would be possible to get smaller groups with the v-express sights..at 60 meters a hunter is suppose to get a good shot placement on a buffalo cow..it depends how good your PH is to get you as near as possible to the buffalo...
Even at 100 meters you are suppose to be able to get a good shot placement on a large body game animal like a buffalo cow for sure

I am contemplating building a ghost ring to fit on the 404 Jeffery or a red dot sight..

I'm thinking 84 gr must be close to maximum for H4350?

 

[Gert Odendaal]

I'm thinking 84 gr must be close to maximum for H4350?

According to members who re-load for the 404 Jeffery , they only use H4350, 84gn, with Rhino 400 gn bullets , North Fork 400gn and other bullet types in the 400gn range...I am using the suggested load as pointed out to me on the forum..
H4350 , 83gn did not show any pressures , the bolt opened smoothly, the case extracted well....The hunt will take place in Thabazimbi area..it is hot during the days ..I am not sure of the heat will have an impact on the H4350 propellant, it will be a first for me to use it for hunting. The bullets used in this loads will be BARNES X 400gn..

 

[Ontario Hunter]

According to members who re-load for the 404 Jeffery , they only use H4350, 84gn, with Rhino 400 gn bullets , North Fork 400gn and other bullet types in the 400gn range...I am using the suggested load as pointed out to me on the forum..
H4350 , 83gn did not show any pressures , the bolt opened smoothly, the case extracted well....The hunt will take place in Thabazimbi area..it is hot during the days ..I am not sure of the heat will have an impact on the H4350 propellant, it will be a first for me to use it for hunting. The bullets used in this loads will be BARNES X 400gn..

I've been told (on this forum) our old Barnes X bullets are notorious for copper fouling. How are you finding them?

 

[Gert Odendaal]

I've been told (on this forum) our old Barnes X bullets are notorious for copper fouling. How are you finding them?

Nothing so far...I always cleans the 404 Jeffery `s barrel after using it..the barrel /rifling is clean, no residue or fouling ....I think the low muzzle velocity of these heavy bullets is not causing fouling..maybe the small caliber high velocities /shooting many shots in a short time is likely to cause fouling...

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Nothing so far...I always cleans the 404 Jeffery `s barrel after using it..the barrel /rifling is clean, no residue or fouling ....I think the low muzzle velocity of these heavy bullets is not causing fouling..maybe the small caliber high velocities /shooting many shots in a short time is likely to cause fouling...

Yes, I've been scrubbing my barrel after each range trip with ammonia based cleaner and not seeing a lot of stuff on the rags. Nothing unusual. Bore looks fairly clean to me but I don't have a fancy bore scope.

 

[Dirtdart]

Dirtdart , I am using the RCBS Chargemaster Supreme, I am sure it is quit accurate and consistent. The RCBS Chargemaster has a LEARNING function to assess the type of propellant every time you want to re-load ...It can either be the Remington primers that did not ensure a complete ignition, or the chrony did not registered correctly..I am changing to CCI Large Rifle primers for the next reloads, or the S365 not working optimally..

If you are confident in your charge weights then look elsewhere.

In the past my chrono would be suspect but, not the Garmin model I am currently using.

The primer is the easiest variable to change. I use a Federal 215 with a 76 grain charge of a different powder under a 400 grain bullet in my 404. If a standard large rifle primer is of good quality and condition I believe it would light the charge you are using with much less velocity spread. I will be watching to see what the culprit is. Good luck!

 

[Gert Odendaal]

If you are confident in your charge weights then look elsewhere.

In the past my chrono would be suspect but, not the Garmin model I am currently using.

The primer is the easiest variable to change. I use a Federal 215 with a 76 grain charge of a different powder under a 400 grain bullet in my 404. If a standard large rifle primer is of good quality and condition I believe it would light the charge you are using with much less velocity spread. I will be watching to see what the culprit is. Good luck!

I suspect the 91/2 Remington Magnum Rifle primers, I convert to the CCI 250 Large Rifle primers .

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I suspect the 91/2 Remington Magnum Rifle primers, I convert to the CCI 250 Large Rifle primers .

Where did you buy your magic wand?

 

[Shootist43]

Gert, I use Federal Large Rifle Magnum Primers. For what it's worth my velocities were 2300, 2309 and 2306 FPS.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Gert, I use Federal Large Rifle Magnum Primers. For what it's worth my velocities were 2300, 2309 and 2306 FPS.

That's a lot of gas. What powder load?

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Final loads results:
Open sights V-express 70 meter /229ft , standing shooting over a bag (front) rear support bag ...

1X fouling shot reflects a few millimeters higher on the target , 3x shots grouped together in the bull..

H4350 , 84gn , BARNES X 400gn bullets, OAL 89.5 mm , 9 1/2 Remington Magnum Primers
1) 2227 f/s
2) 2225 f/s
3) 2225 f/s
No pressure on primers, nou pressure in chamber, bolt opens slick, extraction of brass cases perfectly ..
Explanation:
Please take note, my point of aim was on the black circle, since I noticed the 404 Jeffery open sights shoot at 1 o`clock at 50mm high...so I moved my point of aim down to compensate for shooting in the center/bull target.
The hunters will be fitting a Smidt & Bender 1,1 -4 x 24 rifle scope .

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Final loads results:
Open sights V-express 70 meter /229ft , standing shooting over a bag (front) rear support bag ...

1X fouling shot reflects a few millimeters higher on the target , 3x shots grouped together in the bull..

H4350 , 84gn , BARNES X 400gn bullets, OAL 89.5 mm , 9 1/2 Remington Magnum Primers
1) 2227 f/s
2) 2225 f/s
3) 2225 f/s
No pressure on primers, nou pressure in chamber, bolt opens slick, extraction of brass cases perfectly ..
Explanation:
Please take note, my point of aim was on the black circle, since I noticed the 404 Jeffery open sights shoot at 1 o`clock at 50mm high...so I moved my point of aim down to compensate for shooting in the center/bull target.
The hunters will be fitting a Smidt & Bender 1,1 -4 x 24 rifle scope .
View attachment 628490View attachment 628491View attachment 628492

How was the recoil?

 

[Gert Odendaal]

How was the recoil?

Ontario, recoil never is a factor to me at all. especially when shooting the 404 Jeffery..I would be able to shoot the 400 gn bullets at 2300f/s without experiencing felt recoil as considering it at all..my Westley Richards 404 Jeffery is a well build rifle from 1930 era is a pleasure to shoot for sure, as I mentioned, no pressure in the chamber at all..so recoil really is not an issue for me...My recoil platform is at an .458 Win Mag 530gn bullet at 2300 f/s ..
When building the .500 Jeffery I will see what my recoil platform will be..
The grouping I shot this morning , with open sights , V-Express on my 404 Jeffery indicates that recoil did not have any effect today with the H4350, 84gn , 400gn BARNES X bullets , 89.5 OAL at the 2227f/s ...3f/t more will not amount to an increase in felt recoil at all..all comes down to rifle stock design..

my Westley Richards 404 Jeffery has the best rifle stock design you can possibly hope for, I build the same rifle stock design for my .375 H&H Magnum rifle ..I will duplicate this rifle stock design as well when building my .500 Jeffery rifle .

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

I'm thinking 84 gr must be close to maximum for H4350?

The Swift manual doesn't list H4350 for the 404J.

The Hornady 10th Ed manual lists 78.9 gr max load for the 404J for DGX and DGS bullets (400 gr).