Major Bank? Regional Bank? Local Bank? Credit Union?

[DLSJR]

The Swift system has a lot of flaws. And is pretty easy to defeat. It relies on employees at each end being competent.

One of my nephews that is a pretty savvy investor told me to buy a certain Blockchain-based platform that is faster and more secure than the current Swift system.

The Swift system is being replaced. It’s just a matter of which Blockchain system becomes the ubiquitous system.

At least for now and the foreseeable future, the Swift system is and will remain the main platform for moving money electronically around the world. I don’t disagree that it’ll eventually be replaced when something better is perfected, but that isn’t going to happen anytime soon.

 

[Altitude sickness]

DLSJR, I should have stated that Swift will most likely incorporate the “best” blockchain technology and upgrade the speed and security.

The best right now seems to be XRP

XRP or “Ripple” seems to be the industry favorite at this point. My nephew bought in at less than one dollar. He is confident that he will retire on that one purchase. I am old and can’t risk like he did. But I still think it’s a good speculation.

 

[DLSJR]

DLSJR, I should have stated that Swift will most likely incorporate the “best” blockchain technology and upgrade the speed and security.

The best right now seems to be XRP

XRP or “Ripple” seems to be the industry favorite at this point. My nephew bought in at less than one dollar. He is confident that he will retire on that one purchase. I am old and can’t risk like he did. But I still think it’s a good speculation.

Don’t get me started about crypto investments/speculation. Back about when 13-14 years ago, we were watching the 5:00 news one evening and the anchor was talking about some new digital currency that had just been invented that was called Bitcoin. My daughter asked me what I thought and if I wanted to buy some just in case it became valuable. IIRC, Bitcoin was 10 cents/coin at the time. She prodded me to just buy $1,000 worth to see what it’d be worth someday. I told her I thought it was just for drug dealers and money launderers and didn’t buy any.

If I’d bought just that $1,000 worth back then, today it’d be worth about $1,200,000, 000. Yes, 1.2 Billion dollars.

 

[Altitude sickness]

As a banker you know the G countries will eventually get their way. And outlaw paper currency. Digital currency is coming. Hopefully not in my lifetime.

It appears after this Trump administration. Crypto is here to stay. Bitcoin is still a good buy. But look at XRP “Ripple”
It’s speculation. So only throw at it what you can afford to lose.

 

[ActionBob]

I've used several methods of payment including handing over a check in person at a show (Outfitter had a US based bank account). Used a credit card once and not likely to do that again because of fees. Mailed a check to booking agent a couple times. One Outfitter had an account at the same big bank as I did so did a transfer.

But the Question was about sending to Africa. I've always worked with Outfitters I knew of through friends or at least acquaintances or knew personally, and sent wires. At first I used Wells Fargo. Since Covid they have been more difficult. We have moved away from that institution.

We have since moved most of our personal banking over to our businesses banker. It is a larger International bank but has what I would say is better than small town service. We know them and they know us. They come out to visit us. They know we hunt overseas. Heck they see the taxidermy

Small amounts we can enter in our banking app, they follow up with a confirmation call and it gets sent. Larger amounts we can email or call and talk to one of our personal bankers. We have 3 who know us plus a 4th coordinator so we can always get ahold of someone. And then there id always our primary business banker who can shake the tree if need be. Had him do that once and have never had an issue since In fact just Friday he told me he'd be available all weekend if needed... but i called him about 5:45 Friday, he picked up on the second ring and we took care of business so I could have the weekend off and he can get an early start on next week!'

If you have the ability, even in this time of electronic everything.... It is always good to know your banker. If you can't do that with a big conglomerate, there are still plenty of small banks around. Just walk in and say hello.

 

[ActionBob]

No matter what bank you use, don’t rely on emails for wire transfer information. Confirm the details over the phone with a human being who you know. And don’t use the phone number that was in the email with the wire instructions.

Very easy for scammers to insert themselves into an email string. Tons of this comes from Russia and China, and yes, Nigeria.

Part of what I do for a living is to move money. Probably three times a month I see fake wire instructions. Best practice is to get the wire instructions and then call and actually speak to a known human being and confirm them. This advice comes from the FBI cyber crimes unit. And they won’t even look at a loss of a couple of thousand dollars. Most likely, it would take a loss of six figures to get them to take it seriously. There’s just too much of this stuff going on and they have too much stuff to do.

Never rely on wire instructions that get changed via email. That is almost always a sign of an intercepted email string and it’s a scam. Be smart, don’t get taken.

For what it’s worth, I would much prefer using a bank like JPMorgan Chase than a credit union or a small regional bank. Chase has much greater resources and much better fraud prevention.

And don’t be pissed off at the bank because they’re asking you questions about your wire transfer. They’re trying to save your dumb a$$

Is WhatsApp more secure than email? For wiring instructions.

 

[ActionBob]

No matter what bank you use, don’t rely on emails for wire transfer information. Confirm the details over the phone with a human being who you know. And don’t use the phone number that was in the email with the wire instructions.

Very easy for scammers to insert themselves into an email string. Tons of this comes from Russia and China, and yes, Nigeria.

Part of what I do for a living is to move money. Probably three times a month I see fake wire instructions. Best practice is to get the wire instructions and then call and actually speak to a known human being and confirm them. This advice comes from the FBI cyber crimes unit. And they won’t even look at a loss of a couple of thousand dollars. Most likely, it would take a loss of six figures to get them to take it seriously. There’s just too much of this stuff going on and they have too much stuff to do.

Never rely on wire instructions that get changed via email. That is almost always a sign of an intercepted email string and it’s a scam. Be smart, don’t get taken.

For what it’s worth, I would much prefer using a bank like JPMorgan Chase than a credit union or a small regional bank. Chase has much greater resources and much better fraud prevention.

And don’t be pissed off at the bank because they’re asking you questions about your wire transfer. They’re trying to save your dumb a$$

My problems with Wells Fargo is that now you need an appointment. The "personal bankers" I've had are never in their job very long and you have to train in a new one. Especially since Covid and since John Stumph has been retired.

I had a younger supervisor (aka shit for brains can't do type) refuse to notarize a simple photo copy for me. Some government official in Africa wanted it notarized. Had to drive an hour to another Wells Fargo where an elderly lady, with bigger balls than that young guy, did it for me.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Is WhatsApp more secure than email? For wiring instructions.

WhatsApp uses end-to-end encryption. Gmail and Outlook for example do not. So WhatsApp is more secure than most email. But there are also encrypted email programs.

WhatsApp is part of Meta or Facebook. So there is that. Meta swears that they can’t see your message on WhatsApp.

But store and sell the data. What good is the data if they can’t see it?

Soon nothing but face to face will be safe. AI will have your voice and facial recognition. And nothing will be safe from scams.

 

[Flipper Dude]

Usually Chase. Last trip with D & Y I just sent pics of checks thru WhatsApp. No problemo

 

[Ridge Runner]

As with a couple other members have mentioned I have accounts with USAA and a local Credit Union. I sat up a separate Safari Account (name the account whatever you want) at my Credit Union. This account only has enough funds retained in it to keep it open and is the only account used for wire transfers and the account is not linked to my regular Checking and Savings Accounts. The only time and only the amount money goes into my Safari Account is when I need to wire transfer funds. Doing it this way keeps any of my banking information secure.

The only trouble I have had with a wire transfer was my Zimbabwe outfitter wanting funds wired to their Swiss Bank Account. My credit union didn't have a problem with the transfer it was the bigger bank my credit union uses for wire transfers. Seems a few "red flags" went off at the bigger bank. Eventually the wire transfer went through while I was in Zimbabwe with the outfitter.

As for the "20 questions" to do a wire transfer there are certain countries on the [US] government watch list that financial institutions are not allow to transfer money to; Zimbabwe is/was on that list with exceptions. Other African countries on the list have no exceptions due to terrorist organizations within the given country.

Word of Caution on wire transfers is to confirm the outfitters banking information for the wire transfer preferably in two seperate emails, email and phone call follow-up, two separate phone calls. The objective is to verify bank, bank location, bank branch/number, account information: ie routing number, account number, etc because once the wire transfer has been made its overand done and the sender is responsible for the money going to the correct account. You as the sender don't want to be responsible for any transposed numbers or mis/erroneous information where the money is being sent.

For those comfortable with doing their own and wire transfers great. I don't routinely do wire transfers to be comfortable. Therefore I prefer doing wire transfers in person at my local credit union. My local credit union is also familiar with me I don't have much of a problem getting a wire transfer done. I say much of a problem because:

My local credit union is small and uses a larger bank to complete a wire transfer

My credit union does very [very] few wire transfers (LOL so few I think I'm their textbook example on how to do a wire transfer]

When they are training a new cashier and I need to do a wire transfer I'm the " How to example" . Me, personally, I go with the flow and become an understanding PITA to the new teller....(with some restraint).

 

[Ridge Runner]

As a banker maybe you could answer this question. I see people on here saying you should use a separate account set up only for wire transfers so that people on the other end couldn't draw more money later after you sent them money.

I have asked my bank in the past about this and they said that no one could get money from the wire transfer other than whatever amount I was sending in that moment.

Is there some backdoor way for the recipient or recipient's bank to draw more money than what is sent by the sending bank/individual?

As for the amount of money of the wire transfer the scammer can only get that amount.

However, the scammer now has your routing and account numbers to hack into. First withdrawing obscure amounts that look like service charges, checking the validity and account balance before the hacker/scammer drains the account

Since financial institution (bank, credit union) customers/members have their checking and saving accounts and possibly other accounts connected, hackers/scammers can also drain these connected accounts.

By having a separate non linked account hackers/scammers only have access to one account.

This may not prevent hackers/scammers from getting into the financial institution's computer system to access customers'/members' accounts, but no matter how little the prevention is, it's better than no prevention.

Among other things it's bad for business, therefore no financial institution will freely advertise or acknowledge a security breach until it goes public by a "whistle-blower" or it makes the negative msm news.

 

[Sabre]

As for the amount of money of the wire transfer the scammer can only get that amount.

However, the scammer now has your routing and account numbers to hack into. First withdrawing obscure amounts that look like service charges, checking the validity and account balance before the hacker/scammer drains the account

Since financial institution (bank, credit union) customers/members have their checking and saving accounts and possibly other accounts connected, hackers/scammers can also drain these connected accounts.

By having a separate non linked account hackers/scammers only have access to one account.

This may not prevent hackers/scammers from getting into the financial institution's computer system to access customers'/members' accounts, but no matter how little the prevention is, it's better than no prevention.

Among other things it's bad for business, therefore no financial institution will freely advertise or acknowledge a security breach until it goes public by a "whistle-blower" or it makes the negative msm news.

I am generally a fan of more layers of security just to be safe. So, I may also set up a separate account just for wire transfers because nowadays it's not difficult to manage things like that.

I gotta ask though, you bring up that the scammer now has your routing number and account number. But that is also printed on every check you've ever written as well. I feel like they would be able to deposit money into my account with that information pretty easily, but it's hard for me to imagine that the banks would willingly just send anyone money from an account just based on the two numbers that are on every check ever written. Is there something I am missing in that equation?

 

[ActionBob]

I am generally a fan of more layers of security just to be safe. So, I may also set up a separate account just for wire transfers because nowadays it's not difficult to manage things like that.

I gotta ask though, you bring up that the scammer now has your routing number and account number. But that is also printed on every check you've ever written as well. I feel like they would be able to deposit money into my account with that information pretty easily, but it's hard for me to imagine that the banks would willingly just send anyone money from an account just based on the two numbers that are on every check ever written. Is there something I am missing in that equation?

I think they have to be properly set up as a legitimate business. Butvi don't really know. There is an auction company i do business with that take "check by phone" payments. I give them those two numbers and verify the amount and they pull payment out of my checking account. Doesn't sound very secure does it?

 

[Rare Breed]

credit union. 5 minutes. No problem.

@Badjer what exactly was their issue?

A second credit union I deal with argued with me about a trust one time. I sent a letter to the president and asked her if I should find a new bank. Next day all was well.

Dunno.

For me I have a separate brokerage E trade account just for Africa. No problems wiring anything

 

[Ridge Runner]

I am generally a fan of more layers of security just to be safe. So, I may also set up a separate account just for wire transfers because nowadays it's not difficult to manage things like that.

I gotta ask though, you bring up that the scammer now has your routing number and account number. But that is also printed on every check you've ever written as well. I feel like they would be able to deposit money into my account with that information pretty easily, but it's hard for me to imagine that the banks would willingly just send anyone money from an account just based on the two numbers that are on every check ever written. Is there something I am missing in that equation?

I haven't used a check since the debit/credit card came into use. Except for gas, and vehicle maintenance, I use cash for most purchases under $100.00 and credit card for all other purchases. For purchases requiring a check I use my credit union's cashier check or postal money order.

With the account information: a hacker: can use an algorithm / program to electronically remove/reroute transfer funds. A scammer, can imitate you to gain access and transfer funds, or counterfeiter can make multiple duplicates of your check to transfer funds.

Think of it as:
A hacker inserts an algorithm or hidden program to an email or text message. The receiver then opens that seeming innocent email or text message. The algorithm or program is activated. Personal information can then be gathered from computer, phone files. Mm

A scammer calls, texts a person then gains general information. They can then call the bank and using short simple edited words to respond to questions to gain loans, transfer money out of a person's accounts, etc.

A counterfeiter has a check then they can make photocopies of that check adding/changing the amount the money draining the account holders funds.

In the end the criminal makes off with the funds and the account holder is left trying to prove they didn't authorize these withdrawals, payments, etc.

That's why there are so many advertisements, commercials, etc offering ID protection services. Although some if not most of these companies' commercials, ads are relying on "scare tactics" to sell their products. They do somewhat, very weakly, legitimately alert the public to beware on giving out personal information to unknown callers, solicitation calls, etc., opening unknown, harmless looking, etc, emails and text messages.

Sharing/posting personal information on social media: family members names, pets names, favor places, etc. Then all it takes is a Google search. Then a scammer, hacker can impersonate their victims.

 

[Ridge Runner]

I think they have to be properly set up as a legitimate business. Butvi don't really know. There is an auction company i do business with that take "check by phone" payments. I give them those two numbers and verify the amount and they pull payment out of my checking account. Doesn't sound very secure does it?

That doesn't sound secure at all. There should be at least a password verification.

My credit union use to be like that then they implemented password verification, whether in person or by phone, a few years ago.

 

[Mtn_Infantry]

I’ve got a couple different bank accounts with different banks, but my main one is USAA. Generally this is where I wire the money from and haven’t had an issue. I’ve got an account with a small local bank, and they’ve asked some questions, but after about 20 minutes and a bunch of questions about hunting in Africa they wired the money and pocketed a couple different outfitters contact information to look into themselves.

 

[BryceM]

I use a branch of a small regional bank where I know several of the big-wigs. I'm in there enough, and I've sent enough transfers that it's no big deal. It took a couple of tries to find a bank with the right sort of people and policies.

If your bank doesn't want to do it, don't waste a lot of time pushing against things that don't move. Ask for all of your money, close your accounts, and go somewhere else where there are people with brains in their heads.

 

[coreydb]

I use my bank with no problems or issues. Just search out a bank with a good reputation with wire transfers.

 

[mrpoindexter]

I have used XE.com to wire money to Africa. They have very good exchange rates. All my safaris are in US dollars, but I import things from South Africa and had to pay in rand in the past and XE gave so much better rates than I got from my banks here.