Shotgun weights

[WAB]

It’s not a bad guideline. The Brits know a thing or two about high volume shooting. They do tend to go a bit heavier on game guns. The traditional load was 1 1/16 oz of English 6’s (US 7’s, not 7 1/2’s) in a gun weighing about 6 lbs 10 oz. This is a very comfortable and effective combination for a day of driven shooting.

Today, they have caught the American disease and are transitioning to ultra fast steel loads in O/U’s weighing significantly more.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

@Nevada Mike - I have heard of some of those comparisons (shot load/gun weight) but really think that “formula” of 96 x shot load vs Gun weight is arbitrary and meaningless…..must’ve been when Einstein decided to try shotgun shooting - then got distracted by the Manhattan Project. I certainly would Not use that to determine my shotgun weight/load etc…there must be a simpler process? Top Shooters aren’t agonizing over Math Formulas…

I don't put much stock in that formula. Those British "bird hunters" are usually just standing in one spot while loaded guns are handed to them. No hiking involved. And looking at the videos of those pheasant shoots, the long barreled SxS shotguns used sure look to me to be heavier than 5.5 lbs! It certainly wouldn't be much fun shooting a couple boxes of twelve gauge ammo in rapid succession with an ultralight shotgun!

I have shot lightweight shotguns enough to know they can be painful flinch-makers and don't float to the target well, especially if the fit is off a bit (e.g. wrong LOP). On the trap range it is possible to make almost any shotgun work well (though why anyone would choose to beat themselves up shooting trap with a light shotgun is beyond understanding). There the shooter has the gun mounted and plenty of time to make himself fit it before target apoears. But in the field, especially for chasing uplands, the shooter typically needs to get the gun mounted, on target, and fired very quickly. A whippy light shotgun will not be as effective, even in lighter gauges that have less recoil. There are exceptions, of course. Some people are extremely accomplished shooters and can be deadly shooting big pheasants with a 28 gauge. But there are many more people hunting ringnecks with little guns who just think they are extremely accomplished shooters. And I'm picking their shot from my birds when I clean them. I will add that being accomplished with a little gun on the clays range is still a WORLD of difference from actually hunting with one.

 

[WAB]

I don't put much stock in that formula. Those British "bird hunters" are usually just standing in one spot while loaded guns are handed to them. No hiking involved. And looking at the videos of those pheasant shoots, the long barreled SxS shotguns used sure look to me to be heavier than 5.5 lbs! It certainly wouldn't be much fun shooting a couple boxes of twelve gauge ammo in rapid succession with an ultralight shotgun!

I have shot lightweight shotguns enough to know they can be painful flinch-makers and don't float to the target well, especially if the fit is off a bit (e.g. wrong LOP). On the trap range it is possible to make almost any shotgun work well (though why anyone would choose to beat themselves up shooting trap with a light shotgun is beyond understanding). There the shooter has the gun mounted and plenty of time to make himself fit it before target apoears. But in the field, especially for chasing uplands, the shooter typically needs to get the gun mounted, on target, and fired very quickly. A whippy light shotgun will not be as effective, even in lighter gauges that have less recoil. There are exceptions, of course. Some people are extremely accomplished shooters and can be deadly shooting big pheasants with a 28 gauge. But there are many more people hunting ringnecks with little guns who just think they are extremely accomplished shooters. And I'm picking their shot from my birds when I clean them. I will add that being accomplished with a little gun on the clays range is still a WORLD of difference from actually hunting with one.

Don’t be fooled by the appearance of those guns. The British game gun is truly within a couple ounces of 6lb 10oz. You have to realize that these are proofed guns so the entire gun including barrel wall thickness is designed for the intended shot charge. The result is a much more dynamic gun than what is designed for the NA market.

USA insanity knows no bounds in shotgun design. We insist that bubba can buy any O/U, stuff a 3” waterfowl load in it and be fine. The result is that we end up with guns that handle like clubs. The solution? Sub bore guns, which again we stuff heavy loads in. Look at Fiochi’s 28 gauge golden pheasant load, how in the world do those loads make sense in a 28 gauge?

 

[Nevada Mike]

Horses for courses. While a lightweight gun requires a shooting technique that is specific to its dynamics (moment of intertia) the upland hunter who carries his gun more than shoots it will appreciate a light, well balanced gun when pursuing chukars, prairie grouse, blue grouse, or desert quail - especially when carrying water enough to keep his dogs well hydrated during the hunt.

Years ago I began hunting chukars in very rugged country, I became interested in guns that were lighter, quicker, and easier to carry. At the same time I was shooting competitive International Skeet using my Perazzi or my Remington 3200 - both heavy guns. I found that mastering the lighter weight game guns was very difficult while I was shooting targets with the competition guns, I quit shooting IS and sold my target guns to concentrate on learning to shoot game guns. It took a good coach and a year or so of work before I became a reliable shot with the game guns.

While pheasants are not a bird I usually pursue, I have killed plenty of them with an ounce of #6 ot #7 shot out of my 5lb. 15 oz 16 gauge. Likewise with chukars, sharptail grouse, prairie chickens, and blue grouse. I really don't thiink that duck loads are necessary to kill ditch chickens.

Since I live in SE Arizona, I hunt quail - a lot. I carry my 5 lb., 9 oz. 20 ga English SxS and shoot 3/4 or 7/8 ounce of #8 or #8-1/2 shot. They all die if I do my part.

Again, target shooting, where hundreds of cartridges are fired over a short period of time, require heavier guns and specific techniques. I am not suggesting that anyone change their habits, but pointing out that there are benefits to be had with game guns when shooting game and over the last century and a half the Brits (and others) have proved that.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I hunt pheasants now mostly on a very large US federal refuge where nontoxic shot is required. Pheasants aren't as tough as waterfowl but finding steel loads that aren't for waterfowl has become very difficult. For the past couple of years I have even been forced to shoot 3" twelve gauge, often #4 shot (one box of #2 but only partially used up before finding the only two boxes of #4 three inchers in the entire state of Montana during 2020 pandemic). For those loads I am grateful to be shooting perhaps the heaviest twelve gauge ever made (31" Magnum Twelve Browning A5), especially when goose hunting. I don't find it terribly burdensome to carry and shoot it well enough. Took this triple (my one and only) after a long cold morning (1-4 degrees F) and several miles. I had earlier missed one and only shot right after leaving the truck. Finally gave up before I froze to death. A few hundred yards before we were back to the vehicle Ellie set me up on five roosters (yes, FIVE!) next to the road. Sure, I was tired and cold but that heavy gun seems to point itself. Bang, bang and two drop. Just reaching for a shell to reload when Ellie pushed up the other three. Dropped the shell and never did find it. But I got back on the gun and dumped the third one. Empty bag filled without taking a step ... but after taking a thousand steps first.

I agree, some of the specialty upland shells marketed these days are just plain crazy. Heavy lead loads pumped up to +1500 fps are brutal to shoot. I have bought them when that's all that was available. Ugh! And I shoot them (Federal red box, Prairie Storm, and Golden Pheasant) very poorly, probably because I'm flinching. I have done very well killing pheasants with low base #6 when I can get them (rare to find except in dove country). But I have an exceptional Lab that works very close and she's a dynamite pointer. Even spooky late season birds don't have a chance.

 

[NE 7x57]

Presently I shoot a Browning Superposed Lightening 20 gauge for pheasants. Usually with 2 3/4 #5 Golden Pheasant. Shotgun weighs in the 6 pound range. Also at times carry a Model 1912 Winchester in 16 ga but shoot the lighter shotgun better.

 

[BeeMaa]

@Nevada Mike - I very much agree with you on the "horses for courses".

It comes down to a few things for me. First is how much of a particular discipline (hunting/sporting clays/trap...etc) will I be doing and second is budgeting.

There are sooo many kinds of hunting that I could easily have an entire vault in my house dedicated to just shotguns. Waterfowl, driven game on peg, walked-up game, sporting clays, trap, skeet...

Could I just grab my SBE3 and do it all...sure. But what would be the fun in that? After learning the finer points of how a driven shotgun feels vs a waterfowl or sporting one does, it's hard to deny how much those little things begin to matter as your skill level grows.

As a result, I have more shotguns in my vault than rifles, and if my wife had not of stopped me I would have picked up another Benelli SBE3 Waterfowl Performance Shop in 20 bore a couple of weeks ago. Man it's hard to stay on budget with AH friends.

 

[WAB]

@Nevada Mike - I very much agree with you on the "horses for courses".

It comes down to a few things for me. First is how much of a particular discipline (hunting/sporting clays/trap...etc) will I be doing and second is budgeting.

There are sooo many kinds of hunting that I could easily have an entire vault in my house dedicated to just shotguns. Waterfowl, driven game on peg, walked-up game, sporting clays, trap, skeet...

Could I just grab my SBE3 and do it all...sure. But what would be the fun in that? After learning the finer points of how a driven shotgun feels vs a waterfowl or sporting one does, it's hard to deny how much those little things begin to matter as your skill level grows.

As a result, I have more shotguns in my vault than rifles, and if my wife had not of stopped me I would have picked up another Benelli SBE3 Waterfowl Performance Shop in 20 bore a couple of weeks ago. Man it's hard to stay on budget with AH friends.

Here to help bud, let me know when you’re ready for that British game gun. I am there regularly and am happy to shop for a friend! Particularly one who helped me spend so much money on a watch!

 

[BeeMaa]

Here to help bud, let me know when you’re ready for that British game gun. I am there regularly and am happy to shop for a friend! Particularly one who helped me spend so much money on a watch!

I appreciate your concern for my financial well-being.

However, that money would be better served on a trip with you over the pond to do a driven pheasant hunt on-peg. We could both wear our watches!

For now, I'll have to concern myself with saving up for our upcoming trip. Since Mrs BeeMaa is now going, there is even more to consider.

 

[Nevada Mike]

BeeMaa ...

It can get to be a costly affliction. While I have been accumulating (NOT collecting!) nice shotguns for a long time, visiting this site has definitely caused an increase in the rifle side of the gun rack.

Here's a nice example of a Brit game gun that I 'accumulated' several years ago and there have been a few since then...

 

[WAB]

Beautiful!