WJ Jeffrey, double barrel rifle

[Kyle Gower]

Hello I am looking for some information on a double barrel rifle, WJ, Jeffrey air is approximately 1924 serial number on the rifle is 19013. We acquired rifle from longtime friend of family who had purchased it while living in Africa to go elephant hunting. I was told any information that you would have would benefit us greatly. Thank you..

 

[Kyle Gower]

In formation we are in need of rounds can safely be used and where to purchase ammo and any precaution or help full hints pertaining to this rifle.

 

[mdwest]

Jeffrey keeps pretty good records I believe (like most well known/regarded brit gun manufacturers).. Im sure if you reached out to them, they could be of help..

W.J.Jeffery & Co

W.J. Jeffery & Co. are pleased to reintroduce a limited production of their classic bolt action .500 Jeffery and .404 Jeffery rifles. Modelled after Jeffery’s original Magnum Mauser rifles of the 1930’s, these classic Big Game rifles are once again made in Birmingham and remain the pre eminent

www.wjjeffery.com

we have quite a few members here that have forgotten more about doubles than I'll ever begin to know... @rookhawk , @Red Leg come to mind.. they might be able to help..

 

[Kyle Gower]

Thank you I appreciate the info!

 

[Kyle Gower]

I’m adding a few more pic. Keep in mind must be a mountain of a man to chase down a big game Mamoot considering the overall Weight separates the men from the boys.

 

[Major Bonkers]

Another option is to approach Holts auctioneers and ask them to value the gun. Squinting at your pictures, a starting price for what you have there is somewhere around £10,000 ($12,500), but it is very difficult to tell without knowing more.

As to the ammunition, first you need to know the calibre of the rifle. You can determine this either from the serial number (ie. the manufacturer ought to know) or by taking it to a gunsmith. Warning: certain old rifles have been rebored from their originally manufactured calibre and hence have a new, different, calibre. Kynoch will be able to supply ammunition. You will shortly discover that it is not cheap to feed these rifles.

You seem to know how to take the rifle apart and put it back together. Is the rifle tight on face? (ie. can you move the barrels by shaking them while holding the stock).That is a big no-no, but can be cured relatively inexpensively. It may be worth getting the rifle re-proofed, which again is relatively inexpensive and any competent gunsmith ought to be able to arrange. (It is important to do this via a competent gunsmith and seek his advice beforehand because proofing a rifle is a destructive process.)

At this stage, consider having the rifle thoroughly cleaned by a competent gunsmith - which will involve stripping it down and getting rid of any grease or dirt before putting it all back together. This differs from restoring it, which means reblacking the metalwork and oiling up the woodwork. You run the risk of devaluing the rifle by ill-advised restoration, and I suspect most people on this forum will advise against it.

Your profile does not say where you live. I can advise a number of British gunsmiths, but anywhere outside the UK is a closed book to me.

Of course, the whole point of having a rifle like this is to use it. Africa awaits!

 

[deewayne2003]

@Kyle Gower - what is the caliber?

The marks say “cordite 80 - 480 max” which is the powder charge for cordite and the 480 is the weight/grain of bullet.

I’m guessing it’s a .450Nitro but again I’m asking because I’m curious and I’m sure someone vastly more knowledgeable will be along shortly to clarify.

As others have said - I would contact Jeffrey and ask for a letter from them; which would greatly increase the value and probably even tell you who it was sold to.

If you are in the USA - I would send it to JJ Perodeau for inspection and cleaning.

JJ Perodeau Gunmaker

 

[rookhawk]

The gun was made and proofed in Birmingham, likely by Webley from the appearance of the action and engraving. I believe the best guess as to caliber would be a 450 Number 2, Nitro Express. That is only conjecture based on the 80gr of Cordite and 480gr bullet stated on the barrel flats. Any number of one-off proof requests and slightly odd-ball loadings have occurred. The only way to be 100% sure is confirmation of proofs by a chamber cast of BOTH barrels and using pin gauges in both barrels. But I'd give it 70% odds its a 450NE #2 since that was the only .45 cal that had a standard proof of 480gr bullets over 80gr of cordite.

 

[zephyr]

Judging from the proof marks 80grs Cordite and a Max Bullet 480 as mentioned above it should be a 450#2 plan a trip to a good gunsmith to strip and clean the action make sure that it is on face and the barrels ring true and bores are in good shape.. As far as having the gun refinished if you have the where with all it will not harm the value Just had my Gibbs 1903 450NE redone as it needed it .. Barrels re blackened furniture re-blued checkering re-pointed and wood re-finished looks great and is ready for another 120 years

 

[Troubleshooter]

Gentlemen: Take a good close look at his #3 photo, and you can just barely make out where it says "450EX" which should correspond to the .450 Nitro Express.

However as has been stated, Kynoch's discontinuance of the big Nitro Express cartridges meant that it was unavailable for many years. This led some owners to re-chamber their rifles to more commonly available calibers, such as the .458 Winchester Magnum. Depending on where that work took place, the rifle may or may not have been re-proofed for the new chambering. I believe that if it was re-chambered in England or Germany it would have likely been re-proofed. If done in the US or some other countries, probably not.

So to the OP, your rifle appears to have been originally chambered for the .450 NE but whether it remains that way is yet to be determined. Incidentally, the .450 NE underwent something of a revival a few years ago, with Hornady producing cartridges in that calibre. Not very common in recent years though.

Hope that helps.

 

[zephyr]

We have yet to see the top of the barrels where it should give an address and chambering

 

[Troubleshooter]

We have yet to see the top of the barrels where it should give an address and chambering

I'm not so sure that the top of the barrels will show all of that. My Jeffery double (1908 manufacture date) has the address on the top of the barrels but not the chambering. The only place that the chambering appears in on the bottom of the barrels, as on the OP's photo.

 

[rookhawk]

I'm not so sure that the top of the barrels will show all of that. My Jeffery double (1908 manufacture date) has the address on the top of the barrels but not the chambering. The only place that the chambering appears in on the bottom of the barrels, as on the OP's photo.

No disrespect intended whatsoever, but your understanding of British proof marks is very light. 450ex is not a definitive statement of what cartridge the gun was made, its merely a rough guide that it is a .45 caliber express cartridge of some sort. The fact that it has original proofs for Birmingham and Nitro applied in a manner that suggests they are mutually contemporary to the gun’s manufacture, leads it to not just being an express cartridge, but a Nitro Express cartridge. The 80-480 is an important detail, indicating the proof house tested for a 80gr cordite charge with a 480gr bullet.

So what is it? It can be anything you dreamed up to have Jeffery make. Anything, esoteric, and even a one of a kind cartridge you invented in your head while sipping too much gin on a safari. But in spite of the fact it can literally be anything, it is most likely that it is a 450 #2 nitro express because that was the only STANDARD .45 caliber express cartridge in the 1921 ICI / Kynoch catalog with an off-the-shelf load of 80gr of stranded cordite and a 480gr bullet. (Although it could still be a custom cartridge featuring 3 necks, 4 rims, a partridge and a pear tree). Hence, you need more information.

1.) A close look at the forend loop, as a sympathetic maker occasionally engraved the load details there.
2.) A really close look at the tubes and rib, for the same reason as point 1.
3.) And when 1+2 turn up nothing, pin gauges in both barrels to determine bore diameter, coupled with chamber casts in both barrels to ensure someone didn’t ruin/wildcat the gun at a later date.

 

[Kyle Gower]

Another option is to approach Holts auctioneers and ask them to value the gun. Squinting at your pictures, a starting price for what you have there is somewhere around £10,000 ($12,500), but it is very difficult to tell without knowing more.

As to the ammunition, first you need to know the calibre of the rifle. You can determine this either from the serial number (ie. the manufacturer ought to know) or by taking it to a gunsmith. Warning: certain old rifles have been rebored from their originally manufactured calibre and hence have a new, different, calibre. Kynoch will be able to supply ammunition. You will shortly discover that it is not cheap to feed these rifles.

You seem to know how to take the rifle apart and put it back together. Is the rifle tight on face? (ie. can you move the barrels by shaking them while holding the stock).That is a big no-no, but can be cured relatively inexpensively. It may be worth getting the rifle re-proofed, which again is relatively inexpensive and any competent gunsmith ought to be able to arrange. (It is important to do this via a competent gunsmith and seek his advice beforehand because proofing a rifle is a destructive process.)

At this stage, consider having the rifle thoroughly cleaned by a competent gunsmith - which will involve stripping it down and getting rid of any grease or dirt before putting it all back together. This differs from restoring it, which means reblacking the metalwork and oiling up the woodwork. You run the risk of devaluing the rifle by ill-advised restoration, and I suspect most people on this forum will advise against it.

Your profile does not say where you live. I can advise a number of British gunsmiths, but anywhere outside the UK is a closed book to me.

Of course, the whole point of having a rifle like this is to use it. Africa awaits!

Thank you for the information I do plan on passing the riffle along to someone better suited for it.

 

[Kyle Gower]

Thank you for the information I do plan on passing the riffle along to someone better suited for it.

Hello and thank you all for your help and info I believe the rifle had spent most of its time in Africa would’ve been brought to the states until early 2000s where it’s supposedly been stored ever since a lot of research thought went into the idea of buying it before it was purchased, but I know that he did not use it very much I believe it may have been a dream more than reality for our friend but he did live in Africa for 20 years also on the top of the barrels it does have the address out of London added a couple couple more pictures, but I will have to get it out of storage tomorrow and take a few more of the top of the barrels and some of the tooling for better look thank you for your patience and your information is much appreciated

 

[uplander01]

Let me know if you’re interested in selling.

 

[Huvius]

Kyle, sounds like you are in the States.
If you were in the Denver Colorado area, I could help you figure everything out easily.

I’m sure there are many members here whom could do the same if you are in their locale.

Doing 95% of everything mentioned above is very straightforward without the worry and cost of shipping it off to a gunsmith.

 

[Pondoro]

That rifle need a good home...and an owner who brings it to Africa..

 

[Kyle Gower]

That rifle need a good home...and an owner who brings it to Africa..

Yes my friend lived in Africa for 17 years

 

[Nevada Mike]

Since the OP stated that the rifle was purchased IN AFRICA it is a good bet that it was a 'production' rifle' resold by a dealer. Therefore it is probably not a 'custom' or special ordered rilfe. My two cents.