Tamed down 375

I was thinking PG up to about the size of wildebeest. Not including eland or giraffe, but all else should be fine. Not sure about zebra, they may need the full 375 300 grain treatment.
 
I would hunt an Eland with that load with no reservations. A 338 win mag sends a 225-grain to 2,800 ft/s. Not that much different. I wonder how many Eland have been killed with lesser cartridges like the 303 Brit and 7x57? Giraffe? Perhaps not.
 
I’m not sure the areas you’ll be hunting, but it seemed like every shot I took in dande had brush between me and the animal. How do you think the 235 will do compared to a 300 gr shooting through some brush? My 250 gr Barnes at faster speeds don’t do well in brush.
 
The same as your 30/06 with 180gr non premium bullets, they are a small plains game/deer bullet, I use them in my 375Ex 2 1/2in

Not trying to be argumentative but I don't think comparable to the 338Win bullet of similar weight unless it was a Coreloc or similar.

I would hope if going to Africa a client hunter would use a top class slug, bit different when you live there, yes I have shot some big Eland Bulls with a 308Win but I would like to see my hunters with min of 30/06 & good 180gr bullets .
 
If I load a 235 grain speer point 375 cal bullet to 2400fps muzzle velocity, what can I hunt with it?

Hi @Kevin Peacocke we’ve been researching this a ton over here and we went to the range yesterday to test it all out. Our plot was aided by two of the top largebore ballistics experts in the nation, Ken Owen and Lance Hendershot.

I’m parroting back what I learned on the journey that will hopefully help you out. I’m not an expert, but these guys are and the results were astounding.

The facts. We were told to use fast burning powders. Get all that powder/recoil to incinerate close the chamber and the perceived recoil will be less. We also were following the scientific fact that all things being equal, the powder that requires the fewest grains to achieve the desired velocity will have the lowest recoil. Just the brand of powder and type can make a huge difference.

Due to typos and errors, please double, then triple check everything below without relying on its accuracy.

IMR4895 is a great powder because it can be loaded to as little as 60% of published load data safely. I believe it was 67gr of IMR4198 in a 375HH case that will send a 260gr Solid at 2400fps. If you think this is a diminished load for a 375HH, it is and it isn’t. Rather than putting out 38lbs of recoil, it puts out 26lbs of recoil. By coincidence, this load is nearly identical to a full 9.3x62mm load. So if you felt comfortable killing an animal with a 9.3x62mm factory solid load, this is the same thing in a 375HH. My 11 year old tried it at the range off shooting sticks and put his first three shots into about 1.5”, regretting that he pulled one shot or it would have been less than an inch. He said the recoil was easy and he weighs about 110lbs, but he has been shooting big game rifles since he was 6.

Another great load is IMR3031, the closest replica to the original stranded cordite all our guns were designed to use a century ago.

270gr standard soft, 59gr to 66gr of IMR3031
59gr is 2369fps (27.7ft lbs of recoil)

300gr starts at 57gr and goes to 63gr of IMR3031
57gr is 2150fps (27.43ft lbs of recoil)
63gr is 2386fps (33.7 ft. lbs of recoil)

300gr most accurate is IMR4350 at 80gr at 2500fps (Ouch, and 42lbs of felt recoil)

73gr of imr4350 with a 300gr nosler partition at 2350fps (36.31 ft. Lbs of felt recoil)

Now to your load question with 235gr bullets. As you’re aware, the 235gr bullets are fairly soft jacketed, so regardless of speed the purpose Is to do devstating damage to thin skinned game. Zebra, Kudu, Croc, Wildebeest, Waterbuck, Tsessebe, Gemsbok…all those 400-800lb animals would do great with the soft jacketed 235gr bullets. At 2500FPS the bullets will operate well and the recoil will be very light. I *think* a 235gr bullet with 62gr of IMR4895 should get the bullet running at about 2500fps and 25.5ft lbs of recoil.

All the data above approximate for anecdotal, not official purposes.

Your proposed load would be literally in the 30-06 recoil class and would do a lot more damage than any 30-06 load you could dream up. The big question would be “why”? I think for most Africa situations you’d be happier with the 260gr and 270gr loads at 2400fps putting out nearly the same recoil as the 235gr at 2500fps. The exception to that would certainly be the flat shooting bonus you get from the 235gr, but the BC of the 235gr lead softs would be terrible for longer range shooting. The 235gr copper loads would be the same volume as a 280gr lead soft so you would get a better BC and the flat shooting.

Planning a shoot in the lowveldt or Kalahari? Your proposal would be perfect.
 
I’m not sure the areas you’ll be hunting, but it seemed like every shot I took in dande had brush between me and the animal. How do you think the 235 will do compared to a 300 gr shooting through some brush? My 250 gr Barnes at faster speeds don’t do well in brush.
You are right @375 Fox, this would not be good through brush. I shoot more in open areas like Save.
 
You are right @375 Fox, this would not be good through brush. I shoot more in open areas like Save.

@Kevin Peacocke it seems like the 250gr or 270gr Barnes (or their copies) is a match made in heaven for you.

1.) You Get a physically huge bullet, 22% larger by volume than its weight. (Copper being lighter than lead)

2.) The greater volume enhances the BC and therefore both its penetration, resistance to deflection, and ability to stay the course through heavier cover as found throughout Zimbabwe.

3.) You can opt for a modest recoil load and still make a gigantic hole because of point 1.


We decided to try the 260gr nosler monometal solid (an incredibly stout bullet the physical size of about a 315gr steel jacketed lead core solid. It has a weight matched twin in the nosler 260gr accubond which is a great large plains game round.

You certainly can try that matched pair of softs/solids, or the Barnes banded solid and TTSX which may be an even better option for you.
 
Shoot a nice Woodleigh 300g soft point at 2150 fps. I like sectional density and at those speeds the Woodleigh will still open up and retain 90% of its weight. I load my 500 Jeffery with 570g TSX's at 2300 fps. At 2500 fps recoil is brutal, at 2300 fps it's sporty but still fun. I'm thinking of shooting 570g A-Frames or Woodleighs at 2150 fps.
 
I shoot .375/270 grain A frames and accubonds at 2050FPS from my 12” pistol. Usually get pass thrus on plains game, but still ample penetration and expansion on larger animals.
 
Hi @Kevin Peacocke we’ve been researching this a ton over here and we went to the range yesterday to test it all out. Our plot was aided by two of the top largebore ballistics experts in the nation, Ken Owen and Lance Hendershot.

I’m parroting back what I learned on the journey that will hopefully help you out. I’m not an expert, but these guys are and the results were astounding.

The facts. We were told to use fast burning powders. Get all that powder/recoil to incinerate close the chamber and the perceived recoil will be less. We also were following the scientific fact that all things being equal, the powder that requires the fewest grains to achieve the desired velocity will have the lowest recoil. Just the brand of powder and type can make a huge difference.

Due to typos and errors, please double, then triple check everything below without relying on its accuracy.

IMR4895 is a great powder because it can be loaded to as little as 60% of published load data safely. I believe it was 67gr of IMR4198 in a 375HH case that will send a 260gr Solid at 2400fps. If you think this is a diminished load for a 375HH, it is and it isn’t. Rather than putting out 38lbs of recoil, it puts out 26lbs of recoil. By coincidence, this load is nearly identical to a full 9.3x62mm load. So if you felt comfortable killing an animal with a 9.3x62mm factory solid load, this is the same thing in a 375HH. My 11 year old tried it at the range off shooting sticks and put his first three shots into about 1.5”, regretting that he pulled one shot or it would have been less than an inch. He said the recoil was easy and he weighs about 110lbs, but he has been shooting big game rifles since he was 6.

Another great load is IMR3031, the closest replica to the original stranded cordite all our guns were designed to use a century ago.

270gr standard soft, 59gr to 66gr of IMR3031
59gr is 2369fps (27.7ft lbs of recoil)

300gr starts at 57gr and goes to 63gr of IMR3031
57gr is 2150fps (27.43ft lbs of recoil)
63gr is 2386fps (33.7 ft. lbs of recoil)

300gr most accurate is IMR4350 at 80gr at 2500fps (Ouch, and 42lbs of felt recoil)

73gr of imr4350 with a 300gr nosler partition at 2350fps (36.31 ft. Lbs of felt recoil)

Now to your load question with 235gr bullets. As you’re aware, the 235gr bullets are fairly soft jacketed, so regardless of speed the purpose Is to do devstating damage to thin skinned game. Zebra, Kudu, Croc, Wildebeest, Waterbuck, Tsessebe, Gemsbok…all those 400-800lb animals would do great with the soft jacketed 235gr bullets. At 2500FPS the bullets will operate well and the recoil will be very light. I *think* a 235gr bullet with 62gr of IMR4895 should get the bullet running at about 2500fps and 25.5ft lbs of recoil.

All the data above approximate for anecdotal, not official purposes.

Your proposed load would be literally in the 30-06 recoil class and would do a lot more damage than any 30-06 load you could dream up. The big question would be “why”? I think for most Africa situations you’d be happier with the 260gr and 270gr loads at 2400fps putting out nearly the same recoil as the 235gr at 2500fps. The exception to that would certainly be the flat shooting bonus you get from the 235gr, but the BC of the 235gr lead softs would be terrible for longer range shooting. The 235gr copper loads would be the same volume as a 280gr lead soft so you would get a better BC and the flat shooting.

Planning a shoot in the lowveldt or Kalahari? Your proposal would be perfect.
Rook, thank you very much for a very thorough answer. The purpose of all this can be answered in one word - Verney. If you are interested in all the details I will pm you. It has been an interesting but bumpy road as you know, but I believe we now underatand what is going on with my problem child.
 
Hi Kev

Wouldnt hesitate on zebra with that, or any other plains game
 
Rook, thank you very much for a very thorough answer. The purpose of all this can be answered in one word - Verney. If you are interested in all the details I will pm you. It has been an interesting but bumpy road as you know, but I believe we now underatand what is going on with my problem child.

Send me a PM if you’d like, Kevin. We may have some other ideas to work through.

It sounds like your question in hindsight was based on a desperate attempt to get a 375 Flanged gun to regulate? If your desire for 235gr bullets was based on a desire to regulate a double, like a 375HH flanged at 2400fps, you’re barking up the wrong tree.

Ask the wrong questions, get the wrong answers. :(
 
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I was thinking PG up to about the size of wildebeest. Not including eland or giraffe, but all else should be fine. Not sure about zebra, they may need the full 375 300 grain treatment.
@Kevin Peacocke
I personally don't think zebra need the full 375H&H 300gn treatment.
My son killed his quite happily and easily with his 308 loaded with 140gr outer edge mono projectiles. They ain't armour plated
 
@Kevin Peacocke
I personally don't think zebra need the full 375H&H 300gn treatment.
My son killed his quite happily and easily with his 308 loaded with 140gr outer edge mono projectiles. They ain't armour plated
Thanks Bob, I feel the same. 308 and 30-06 seem to be adequate for all PG, so why not a 375 235gr at the same energy?
 

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