Looking at another 458 Lott

[kiwihunter 260]

I am looking at getting another 458Lott what are the pros and cons for the CZ 550 Safari Lux and the CZ 550 magnum Lux i owned a cz 550 magnum lux in the past so what dose the big bore boys think i have a gunsmith mate that i hunt with that would put in some more recoil pins to stop the stock from spliting if need be
Cheers

 

[matt85]

the CZ rifles in 458 Lott have a bad reputation for feeding issues. expect it to need work in order to feed 100% but otherwise it should be a good rifle.

-matt

 

[kiwihunter 260]

Had this trouble with my last one found an artical in an old copy of man magnum had to take about 1/4 inch off the left hand feed rail and it worked great

 

[CAustin]

It is very interesting that a company can produce a firearm and no doubt know it has this feed issue but do nothing about it. Am I missing something here? Is this feed issue very minor and only shows up when having fired twenty rounds in three minutes or something? OR is it a constant that every time you work the action there is a problem?

 

[bassasdaindia]

It is very interesting that a company can produce a firearm and no doubt know it has this feed issue but do nothing about it. Am I missing something here? Is this feed issue very minor and only shows up when having fired twenty rounds in three minutes or something? OR is it a constant that every time you work the action there is a problem?

Charlie , I am of the opinion that they all need to be worked , but after working them they become even better rifles , I have just always accepted this as a fact .

 

[CAustin]

Charlie , I am of the opinion that they all need to be worked , but after working them they become even better rifles , I have just always accepted this as a fact .

And a CZ is not a cheap rifle really.

 

[Benevolence]

For what it's worth, I've only shot 7 rounds (handload development) through my CZ-550 American Safari Magnum but there's two points that I could see that could cause failure to feed for mine: (1) the top of the 'controlled feed' extractor bumps into the receiver and will require some touch up with a fine stone to put a radius/fillet on each and (2) from the bolt fully back, returning to pickup a cartridge, if you're pushing slightly 'up' (as I tend to do) on the bolt instead of forward , it tends to bind when you've got the maximum slop and maximum bending moment. I think #2 will be fixed when/if I polish the bolt and any receiver touchup. I personally don't mind small things like this (though I can 100% understand someone being frustrated with getting that on a new gun), I just got more frustrated when my 338LM show(s/ed) pressure signs at any/every loads.

Edit: I did forget to mention; shooting this is an absolute hoot and it feeds the 500gr Woodleigh FMJ Round Nose bullets from the mag great.

 

[Edward Wright]

My 02 cents, as I own a CZ, and a few other controlled round feeders. The Mauser action I feel needs polished after manufacturing , and most old Mausers with silk like actions have been worn in to be that way. I cannot comment on the new Mausers, and I would believe they are polished after manufacturing. I feel the "catch" that others speak of in my CZ. I have not, but intend to polish the action with cutting compound, and try for the silk action my old Mauser rifle has. My Winchester 70 Safari grade has a smooth action, but still not silky like the old Mauser. I believe they all would benefit from polishing at some point.

 

[rookhawk]

I had an English Mauser that fed .375HH like horse pucks. I concluded it was either 1.) Weak spring, or 2.) rifle wasn't built and tested in an era with longer bullets and modern monometal solids.

I bought one of those magnum strength springs and tried it out in conjunction with a designed from ground up .375HH follower. (not a "standard" follower)

Worked flawlessly.

I question whether stuffing the extra cartridge in the older guns or stuffing an extra round in, pushing down, closing bolt on an empty chamber, doesn't cause more spring problems.

Obviously your gun is new so my problem isn't necessarily your problem, but my cure may be your cure. These CZ guns really weren't tested and built ground up for these big calibers like the Lott, Gibbs, etc. We are reliant on a small custom shop modifying a gun that was really built as a 375HH or a 458Win in Czech and then altered in the USA for a budget pricepoint. They are cheap, they are rough. When worked over properly they are one of the most affordable, reliable DG rifles at their pricepoint.

 

[sierraone]

It is very interesting that a company can produce a firearm and no doubt know it has this feed issue but do nothing about it. Am I missing something here? Is this feed issue very minor and only shows up when having fired twenty rounds in three minutes or something? OR is it a constant that every time you work the action there is a problem?

Agree. Since I have been on this forum for going on 4 years, this has always been an issue. Hard to believe the company doesn't fix them at the factory before they pass an inspection!

 

[rookhawk]

Agree. Since I have been on this forum for going on 4 years, this has always been an issue. Hard to believe the company doesn't fix them at the factory before they pass an inspection!

Because its not a factory. Its a dad and his daughter running a little gunsmith shop in Missouri, USA. Quickly modifying CZ guns and turning them over at low margins branded as the "CZ custom shop" via triple river gunsmithing. This is not a bespoke gunmaker making them one at a time, its a modification service to put a non-production caliber into the chassis of a $1000 gun. Add some pretty $800 wood, a decent $500 barrel, a $300 bluing, and you have $2600 wrapped up before covering parts and other labor, liability insurance and freight.

If CZ was making them by the 10,000 lot, all alike, off a conveyor belt in a large manufacturing facility things would be better. There is no such demand. So they are cobbled together in small numbers. But hey, they are$2600-$3500. If you want a real custom gun they cost over $10,000 and they do feed right as they are given hundreds of hours more attention to detail. That being said, there is no market. I have a $10,000 custom DG rifle unused for sale and no one will pay less than half of what it cost as almost nobody is spending $4700 for a custom gun these days.

So if $2600 is your budget, you're going to get a lousy gun. It's saving grace is that it can be worked over into a very reliable $3000 gun. It's that last $400 of do-over work that gets everybody's undies in a bunch. In the end, the gun you got for what you paid was a decent value.

 

[sierraone]

Because its not a factory. Its a dad and his daughter running a little gunsmith shop in Missouri, USA. Quickly modifying CZ guns and turning them over at low margins branded as the "CZ custom shop" via triple river gunsmithing. This is not a bespoke gunmaker making them one at a time, its a modification service to put a non-production caliber into the chassis of a $1000 gun. Add some pretty $800 wood, a decent $500 barrel, a $300 bluing, and you have $2600 wrapped up before covering parts and other labor, liability insurance and freight.

If CZ was making them by the 10,000 lot, all alike, off a conveyor belt in a large manufacturing facility things would be better. There is no such demand. So they are cobbled together in small numbers. But hey, they are$2600-$3500. If you want a real custom gun they cost over $10,000 and they do feed right as they are given hundreds of hours more attention to detail. That being said, there is no market. I have a $10,000 custom DG rifle unused for sale and no one will pay less than half of what it cost as almost nobody is spending $4700 for a custom gun these days.

So if $2600 is your budget, you're going to get a lousy gun. It's saving grace is that it can be worked over into a very reliable $3000 gun. It's that last $400 of do-over work that gets everybody's undies in a bunch. In the end, the gun you got for what you paid was a decent value.

As is usual, something learned from this forum! I would suggest the feeding problem could be corrected at the factory. If I understand you correctly, the large calibers that most people on this forum are wanting to buy, are not produced at the factory, only at the "custom shop".

 

[rookhawk]

As is usual, something learned from this forum! I would suggest the feeding problem could be corrected at the factory. If I understand you correctly, the large calibers that most people on this forum are wanting to buy, are not produced at the factory, only at the "custom shop".

Correct.

 

[Edward Wright]

Yes, well if CZ bashing is over I would like to say that there is a very different gun in $2500 and $10000. Without saying, if i drop 10K, I better get a flawless action. I would only drop 10K or more on a double, and let me remind the elitist attitude, that the double action will weaken over time, when fired enough. paint it as you choose, but that is a fact.
A DG rifle is a rifle to protect your life, not your opinion. I will take 5, $2500 rifles that I have confidence in over a 10K double I do not.
I feel ALL controlled round feed rifles, based on Paul Mauser's action, are reliable, and work almost flawlessly at production. I have a WWII 98 Mauser converted to 338-06. It is as smooth as silk, I doubt you could jam it upside down. It was a battlefield rifle right from a Nazi's hand. No custom shop, just wartime honing to produce this action. I would not take 10K for this rifle. The Mauser action is reliable, and very, very functional in a DG rifle. Improve it if you must, but frequent range use, and familiarity will give you what need.
Now stuffing a magnum cartridge in a non magnum Mauser is not the wise thing to do, and a magnum Mauser action is expensive. CZ has produced a magnum action to accommodate DG calibers, and offers that in a package under $2500. If you want to spend more, do so, but that action is solid.

 

[rookhawk]

Bashing? No bashing. Facts yes. Bash, no.

More like accepting the reality of the situation. Spending $2600 earns you $2600 of complaints. Not $10,000 of complaints. A CZ can be made to be a very able DG rifle. Emphasis on "can be made to be", not IS.

You can't have your cake and eat it too!

 

[Edward Wright]

Well I will be glad to send a picture of my CZ, when I get finished with some customization. I will give an honest up or down, on whether it is reliable, or not. Then, I will take my simple self to inside 20 yds, and see what Black Death himself has to say. The time cannot pass fast enough until that meeting occurs.

 

[rookhawk]

@Edward Wright i know you mentioned love of Mausers, I have the same affliction. For about $250 you can get a CZ bolt shroud replaced with a Mauser/ win mod 70 side safety. Worth every penny if you like that consistent muscle memory of the Mauser style. I considered having it done to mine but I ended up selling it to buy a Mauser. Another forum member now owns that CZ 375HH that had been tuned for smoothness and proper feed and it had been previously used on buffalo in Zim.

 

[Edward Wright]

Good to know, thank you. I will talk it over with the gunsmith that is doing some other work. As of right now, I am most interested in putting this particular rig thru it's paces. I believe in adapting to a rifle first, vs adapting the rifle to me. Sounds a bit odd to some, but I must find a common ground with a rifle, or I need to sell it.
Have an older Win 70 Safari Grade in 375 H&H, and I swear that rifle can talk to me. Never had one I thought had a soul like that girl does. Hope to find it in the CZ somewhere. That double I want would get me a plains game hunt, and it already is talking from across the ocean. I would rather have an affair with the Czech girl, it would be cheaper.

 

[rookhawk]

Gents, I have to write an updated retraction.

I stated that the reason for the feed issues of the .458 Lott specifically was that it was not a mass-manufactured gun. Apparently, that is no longer true. As I peruse the CZ website they now offer the 458 Lott and 458 Win in their standard ~$1000 made in Czech product suite. This is in their "CZ 550 American Safari" line that has an MSRP of $1300.

The question begs, will these mass manufactured rifles have better feed results than the older ones that were the customized CZ Custom Shop models in 458 Lott and other calibers? Looking forward to a review to hear if this new model works better out of the box.

Again, apologies, but last time I looked the 458 Lott was not available outside of the custom shop so this must be a relatively new offering.

 

[8x68]

My question would be: If there is a known issue wouldn't CZ send someone to the company that is producing said issue and try to remedy the situation?