Hodgdon 2023 Reloading Manual Fail

[Slickshooter]

I live remote and ordered the manual from a shop by mail as an upgrade to my older 2018 version. More pages and updated data it boosts on the cover. To my shock and dismay it does not have any data whatsoever for 375 Ruger, 416 Ruger, 416 Rem Mag or 416 Rigby (as the 2018 version did). What’s the deal with that lol. Anyways a little rant here of my disappointment with the New Hodgdon manual.

 

[JimP]

Loading manuals take out and add cartridges all the time. They also add powders and loads along with removing others. I have some Hornady load books that have just the popular cartridges and I have another one that has everything under the sun.

And that is why you pick up more than one book. One might have what you want where the other one doesn't.

 

[Slickshooter]

That’s stating the obvious. Thank you for that

 

[Fryeguy]

The new nosler manuals (printed versions) dropped the 9.3x74R.. I found it on the data online, but like my books on the bench, not a damn computer. I think #6 still had it, but same complaint!

 

[mdwest]

what I find more interesting is how loads change fairly dramatically in the same companys reloading manual over time (always getting more conservative/lighter over time)..

some of the differences in the speer manual Ive got thats about 25 years old compared to whats in the current manual for "max" loads.. for the same projectile in the same cartridge using the same powers... can be as much as 4-5 grains lighter in the most recent manual vs the old one for some of the larger capacity cartridges..

 

[mdwest]

The new nosler manuals (printed versions) dropped the 9.3x74R.. I found it on the data online, but like my books on the bench, not a damn computer. I think #6 still had it, but same complaint!

yep...

the only manual I can find that has any decent data for the 416 Taylor is the Ken Waters Pet Loads...

For the longest time I refused to pay $65 for a loading manual.. not when there are several options out there for $25... so I just found the data online, printed it, and then inserted it into the back of one of my other manuals for reference..

I finally broke down and got the Waters book though... I like being able to put hands on the manual.. and really detest loading with the laptop open beside me lol..

 

[JimP]

With me being 70 and having manuals from the 60's up to the early 2000's I am done buying manuals. I have my own book on what I have loaded and what works for me in my rifles.

The only way that I might purchase a new paper manual is if I get a wild hair and buy a new rifle and cartridge.

I also found it interesting in opening up a couple of manuals from the same company and the same cartridge and seeing what the difference is in loads. Some are so drastic it might scare you to load up the older load from a manual.

But in today's suit happy world and product liability I can understand just why they are doing it.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

Gentlemen,

Load data dot com, for $35 per year, provides data form several to many different manuals for almost all cartridges.

• 416 Taylor: 8 sources
• 404 Jeffery: 7 sources
• 458 Lott: 12 sources
• 500 Jeffery: 12 sources
• 505 Gibbs: 8 sources
• 500/416: 1 source
• 450 Rigby: No data
• 450 Dakota: 1 source

The book, African Dangerous Game Cartridges provides many, many loads for each cartridges, and lists the source of each!
https://www.amazon.com/African-Dangerous-Game-Cartridges/dp/0620483393

The Woodleigh Bullets Loading Manual is a great source for dangerous game cartridges.

Both of the above manuals are out of print but do show up in the classified section of this and other forums.

 

[Nevada Mike]

I have a shelf full of manuals going back to the early 60s. If you shoot a 308 NM or a 404 JefferyYou have to exploit whatever there is available- old magazines, web sources, books like van der Walt’s, waters, Hagel, etc. I also find the Lee manual helpful.

 

[Hunter4752001]

While I agree that some manuals may have become more conservative due to liability fears, other, more genuine reasons include:
i. The powder branded XYZ today is often not the same powder as in yesteryear. Companies change their formulas over time but retain the product name for marketing reasons. The new XYZ will be somewhat similar to the old XYZ, but not necessarily identical. Often the branding is in the hands of a distributor, such as Hodgdon, they will issue a general specification for a particular powder and then tender out the production to actual powder manufacturers. Your batch of XYZ may not have been made by the same company as the previous batch.
ii. Pressure measuring technology has changed significantly. In the old days most pressure was estimated from copper crush technology. Now a days digital technology and transducers are the go to. In some cases some cartridges weren't tested but rather interpolated from similar cartridges and/or calculations based on case volume, burn rate etc.
iii. Worse still, in some manuals, loads weren't scientifically tested at all. They were based on the author's, and his mates, best guess using subjective judgements from the look of primers, expansion of case heads, ease of extraction etc.

 

[Hogpatrol]

May not be everyone's cup of tea but I use Quickload software to develop loads. Their cartridge, bullet and powder libraries are extensive and include European and South African powders.

 

[Slickshooter]

I love my manuals, I like flipping through the pages, marking down notes and reading the cartridge intros. Searching on the computer just seems to cheapen the experience…of course I do it but it just isn’t the same to me.

 

[Nevada Mike]

I love my manuals, I like flipping through the pages, marking down notes and reading the cartridge intros. Searching on the computer just seems to cheapen the experience…of course I do it but it just isn’t the same to me.

AH! A fellow Luddite.

 

[Puddle]

Hmmm...

I get why some "classic" cartridges get dropped from loading manuals, but when Hornady drops both the .375 & .416 Ruger's, which they co-developed, it makes me wonder what their sales data is telling them about those two cartridges.

 

[Mike B.]

Hmmm...

I get why some "classic" cartridges get dropped from loading manuals, but when Hornady drops both the .375 & .416 Ruger's, which they co-developed, it makes me wonder what their sales data is telling them about those two cartridges.

I don't know what is in the current book because I am too lazy to leave the computer desk to go look but I can look on my phone at the current manual and both of these are still listed in their reloading app. My guess is they leave out stuff from the hard cover books so they can keep a manual to a somewhat manageable size, but the phone app doesn't have those limitations so everything is listed there. Or maybe it was an oversight during editing of the manual.

 

[Hogpatrol]

Hmmm...

I get why some "classic" cartridges get dropped from loading manuals, but when Hornady drops both the .375 & .416 Ruger's, which they co-developed, it makes me wonder what their sales data is telling them about those two cartridges.

The thread concerns the Hodgdon manual, not the Hornady manual which still lists the OP's cartridges.

https://www.hornady.com/assets/site/hornady/files/load-data/basic-rifle-data.pdf

 

[sgt_zim]

May not be everyone's cup of tea but I use Quickload software to develop loads. Their cartridge, bullet and powder libraries are extensive and include European and South African powders.

i use GRT. i find them extremely conservative

 

[Rule 303]

Another reason Hodgdon may drop cartridges is the supplier of the powders used by Hodgdon may have dropped those cartridges from their manuals/reference publications.

I prefer the printed manuals as I find it easier and more consistent (in the brain) to flick back and forth between pages/different manuals than to go back, forward or roundabout on a computer. Also I hold on to old manuals due to the cartridges that get dropped or added.

 

[Puddle]

The thread concerns the Hodgdon manual, not the Hornady manual which still lists the OP's cartridges.

https://www.hornady.com/assets/site/hornady/files/load-data/basic-rifle-data.pdf

Huh. Sure enough. My bad.
Never mind...