Firearms Confiscation - Frankfurt Airport

[BRICKBURN]

This is really sad and preventable.

So, the lesson is: Do not smuggle firearms! Get your permits in place.


A hunter has reported that his firearms were confiscated in Frankfurt, Germany, while he was trying to board a connecting flight with Air Namibia.

The reason is that he did not have a transit/import permit for his firearms and was forced to claim his bags between flights.

The hunter, who wishes to remain anonymous, flew to Frankfurt aboard Lufthansa, which has an interline baggage agreement with Air Namibia but could not check through his luggage because he originated travel with United Airlines.

United does not have an interline baggage agreement with Air Namibia and checked the bags only to Frankfurt, where the hunter had to claim his bags and subsequently clear immigration and customs, officially entering Germany with the firearms.


The hunter whose guns were confiscated did not declare his firearms to customs, but when he tried to check in with Air Namibia, the ticket agent told him she had to call the airport police.

When the hunter could not produce a permit and could not pay the $2,000US fine a magistrate levied over the telephone with the police officer, the firearms were confiscated.


Excerpt from Hunting report.

 

[AfricaHunting.com]

Thanks for the information! First time I have ever heard of this happening to someone!


By the way I emailed on July 30th the Frankfurt weapons authority in regards to the transiting procedure through Frankfurt Germany with hunting bow and arrows but have not yet received any reply... If anyone has any info in this regard please let us know.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Man I'm so glad my flight originated with Lufthansa who has a luggage agreement with SAA which I connected to/from in Frankfurt/Munich!

 

[BRICKBURN]

or, like I did. Get a permit.

Have a nice chat have the customs guys store your firearms have a beer or some sleep and head on your way.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

or, like I did. Get a permit.

Have a nice chat have the customs guys store your firearms have a beer or some sleep and head on your way.

You got it done for sure, but I seem to remember it being somewhat of a hassle with the form written only in Deutsche. Being in the southern side of North America, the Delta flight from Atlanta to Jo'burg looks better and better all the time. I know people gripe about Tambo and the tips/bribes, but all that crap gets bypassed if you use one of the services for pre-approved permits.

It costs to be sure, but at least you don't run into this b.s. of having your rifle confiscated. On that note, I read this report the same place you did. I can't help but wonder if the bigger problem was going through customs without claiming the rifles. I wouldn't even think of trying that trick coming back to the U.S. as a citizen.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Hands down it is all about "smuggling", failing to declare a firearm for sure.

I made a mistake on a trip into the US once.
Wrong shotgun ( ie serial number of the exact same type of shotgun)
The officer said he could confiscate it and charge me. Which he could have.
Since I actually declared it and just made a mistake he just let me walk it back into Canada.
The embarrassment was good enough punishment for the officer.

Mistakes are one thing. Obviously failures to declare are taken a little more seriously.


Direct flights to anywhere would be better. If you have the option, do it.

One way or the other I am filling out forms no matter what route I take.

Now that I have a copy of the form properly filled out and an email address I am set.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Obviously failures to declare are taken a little more seriously.

Yup that can be construed as willful intent which will definitely earn a frown from the fellow wearing the badge. But mistake do happen, and it happened on my trip this year. After the final evening hunt, we got back and dinner was already being served. We just dumped our gear into the chalet and headed over. I missed my routine of emptying the magazines.

You see where this is going.........?

Yup, got to the airport in Kimberly and still had rounds in the magazine. Fortunately none in the chamber as I don't chamber a round until we're on something. I fell to pieces, but the gent there at the airport was very understanding. He just dumped the rounds while at the same time admiring my M70. However never again will I make that mistake.

 

[Rob404]

I thought Lori Spears Posted something about Firearms thru Gremany

 

[sestoppelman]

WHOOPS!!!!!!!!!!:blush:

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

WHOOPS!!!!!!!!!!:blush:

To say the least! After discovering the rifles were still loaded I about loaded my pants!

 

[Diamondhitch]

Yup that can be construed as willful intent which will definitely earn a frown from the fellow wearing the badge. But mistake do happen, and it happened on my trip this year. After the final evening hunt, we got back and dinner was already being served. We just dumped our gear into the chalet and headed over. I missed my routine of emptying the magazines.

You see where this is going.........?

Yup, got to the airport in Kimberly and still had rounds in the magazine. Fortunately none in the chamber as I don't chamber a round until we're on something. I fell to pieces, but the gent there at the airport was very understanding. He just dumped the rounds while at the same time admiring my M70. However never again will I make that mistake.

We had a bit of an oops in dulles a few years back. I always make sure each peice of brass is accounted for. When I came up 1 short for Christines .270and after a very exhaustive search I wrote it off as ejected in the veld.

1 live round had actually somehow ended up in a small pocket in the video camera bag with the sd cards which was located in Christines CARRY ON! SAA had missed it in their scan but not so on the US side. The border agent called a police officer over who after letting us stew for awhile said since it was clear there was no ill intent we could go, he of course kept the shell!!! Lol we even made our connection on time. The US gets a bad rap but I have had nothing but good dealing with them.

 

[sestoppelman]

Back in '85, 19 that is..on my first trip to Africa, then current advice was to make all your own luggage transfers! So all the way across the US, several stops due to plane problems, finding and checking guns onto planes, we finally fetched up in NY, had to get our luggage at one airport, taxi to the other and barely made the KLM flight to Amsterdam. I remember finding my gun case strewn about in a garage type holding area at JFK with no one looking after it! Anybody could have picked it up and walked away. My how things have changed! I just love handing over my guns at SEATAC and knowing I wont have to deal with them again till I get to RSA. Always amazes me when they actually arrive!

 

[BRICKBURN]

I thought Lori Spears Posted something about Firearms thru Germany

Lori followed up on my earlier posts. Easy enough to avoid a conflict.

http://www.africahunting.com/before-after-hunt/9899-return.html


http://www.africahunting.com/latest-hunting-news/10139-frankfurt-firearms-new-forms.html


http://www.africahunting.com/before...ns-transit-process-effect-10-july-2013-a.html

 

[lwaters]

I went through Frankfaurt the last time and had no problems except for the price of thier beer. Delta had a baggage aggrement with Air Namibia. Sounds like now a premit is required. This time I will go through RSA and than to Namibia and stay at the Afton House. Going to hunt both countries. If I go back a third time may be easier just to rent a weapon.

 

[BRICKBURN]

We had a bit of an oops in dulles a few years back. I always make sure each peice of brass is accounted for. When I came up 1 short for Christines .270and after a very exhaustive search I wrote it off as ejected in the veld.

1 live round had actually somehow ended up in a small pocket in the video camera bag with the sd cards which was located in Christines CARRY ON! SAA had missed it in their scan but not so on the US side. The border agent called a police officer over who after letting us stew for awhile said since it was clear there was no ill intent we could go, he of course kept the shell!!! Lol we even made our connection on time. The US gets a bad rap but I have had nothing but good dealing with them.

I was just about to do the same thing on the trip back this time. Some cases were missing,.....

I decided to search every last pocket, nook and cranny.

I found three live rounds that had made their way into my camera bag.
No idea when it happened but glad I checked.

There might have been a few questions in Germany.

 

[sestoppelman]

Another trip coming back going thru NY, I somehow wound up dragging my rifle case all over whatever airport I was at, looking for whatever plane I was supposed to get on, totally on jetlag time and messed up! I tried to check my rifle to some twerp behind a counter somewhere and she asked what was in the case. I said a "hunting rifle". So off to the big ol XRAY machine, she rolls it thru and guess what it dings! The ever bubbly twerp says,"yep, there's a gun in there!". To which I reply, "yes, that is what I told you". The nimble twerp then calls a security guard on the intercom! SECURITY SECURITY!!!! Now we have a new player on scene. This uniformed rentacop looks at me and with great brilliance asks, "have you got a gun in there?" "Uh, yes, thats what I told the twer,,,, I mean the lovely lady back there". "Got your form for it" "But of course" I attempt to produce said form, whereupon the erstwhile lawman waves it off. "Thats OK, long as you have it". A few minutes later I was telling my wife over the phone about this ridiculous event when the same cop walks by and of course hears me describing the silly business, but he kept on walking, he probably thought it was silly too.!

 

[Stretch]

Thanks for the information! First time I have ever heard of this happening to someone!


By the way I emailed on July 30th the Frankfurt weapons authority in regards to the transiting procedure through Frankfurt Germany with hunting bow and arrows but have not yet received any reply... If anyone has any info in this regard please let us know.

I just traveled though Frankfurt with bow and arrows. I flew Delta direct from Green Bay, Wisconsin (USA) to Detroit, Michigan to Frankfurt. From Frankfurt I flew Air Namibia to Windhoek then the reverse on the way back. On the way there was no issue. On the way back I had to answer questions from 2 different Frankfurt airline security agents explaining to them I did not have any firearms just bow and arrows in transit in my checked baggage. After about 10 minutes of questioning they told me to board the plane As I attempted to board I was stopped again by a 3rd agent that ask to see my ticket and passport again. I ask what was the problem. She explained that she needed to change my boarding information because I had a weapon. I politely explained to her that I did not have any weapons as determined by her colleagues. She said that they consider my bow and arrow a firearm and she needed to enter the information into the computer to indicate this. After a few minutes she returned, gave me my ticket and passport, which on it she had placed a blue and white Delta security sticker with someones initials on it. I was then able to board the plane. When I recovered my checked luggage bow case at customs in Detroit, someone had cut the plastic tie band, I assume to check my bow case for firearms. Nothing was missing. No other issue was encountered at any airport.

 

[BRICKBURN]

I just traveled though Frankfurt with bow and arrows. I flew Delta direct from Green Bay, Wisconsin (USA) to Detroit, Michigan to Frankfurt. From Frankfurt I flew Air Namibia to Windhoek then the reverse on the way back. On the way there was no issue. On the way back I had to answer questions from 2 different Frankfurt airline security agents explaining to them I did not have any firearms just bow and arrows in transit in my checked baggage. After about 10 minutes of questioning they told me to board the plane As I attempted to board I was stopped again by a 3rd agent that ask to see my ticket and passport again. I ask what was the problem. She explained that she needed to change my boarding information because I had a weapon. I politely explained to her that I did not have any weapons as determined by her colleagues. She said that they consider my bow and arrow a firearm and she needed to enter the information into the computer to indicate this. After a few minutes she returned, gave me my ticket and passport, which on it she had placed a blue and white Delta security sticker with someones initials on it. I was then able to board the plane. When I recovered my checked luggage bow case at customs in Detroit, someone had cut the plastic tie band, I assume to check my bow case for firearms. Nothing was missing. No other issue was encountered at any airport.

Astonishing hassle on the way through for the bow hunter in our group.
On the way back through Frankfurt, nothing.


It continued to be treated like a firearm everywhere he went, except Namibia.

SAPS, SAA all had to check it out.

Big black cases mean guns I guess.

 

[Stretch]

I thought Lori Spears Posted something about Firearms thru Gremany

This is a heads up from Lori's e-mail to me just before I left for Africa on July 30th. I had no problem with any extra charges.

There is a new baggage rule with Air Namibia where they are charging for archery equipment which you may encounter on your return check-in at Windhoek. This took effect for tickets issued on or after May 1st. Your tickets were ç™»riginally issued on November 5, 2012, so this rule should not apply to you and I would argue with them if you run into this. Your tickets may have recently been reissued but they should go by original issue/purchase date.

Safe Travels,
Lori Spears, Owner/Agent

 

[DOC-404]

A client from the USA, who has become a dear friend, started hunting in Namibia thirteen years ago. After a similar unpleasant episode, he decided that he would never travel with rifles again. He did, but only once..he bought two identical .375's, has one at home and has left one in Namibia ever since. He comes over every year and hunts with his own rifle..without any hassles.