Double rifle for a child

[Bushbuck]

I have always wanted to go on a hunt in Africa with a double rifle. My 10 year old Daughter would really like to join me on this hunt. My idea was to find a 410 shotgun for her and have it custom fitted with iron sites. I am open to the idea of a small caliber double, but I have not seen any small enough. I am considering this hunt for 2012 so we have this year to practice and get her familiar with the gun. She is going on a bear hunt this Sept and will be deer hunting this fall.

I really would like to stay with the side by side concept. Do any of you have any experience with this? What models of 410 shotguns do you suggest. Do you have another idea?

Thank You,
Marc

 

[Bert the Turtle]

If you have the coin for a bespoke double, you can have it made in any caliber and size you want, but I doubt it would be ready for this fall. I recently read about a 22LR double. I personally think a 30-30 double rifle would be pretty sweet.

 

[AkMike]

Kep your eye's peeled for a 9.3X72R DR. I have a sweet one for my wife that'd be perfect for a kid. Little to no recoil, about like a 38-55 for power/recoil. It'd be fine for deer sized animals at under 100 yds.

 

[Bushbuck]

Bert I would love to have one made, but I think I will save that for the next one. I would hope she could grow out of this one to a little bigger cartridge in a few years.

AkMike, That might be a good option. Is there any particular brand that makes a reasonable lightweight good quality one you would reccomend?

 

[AkMike]

Mine is a best quality from Ferlach Austria back in the early 1900's. Just keep looking around at the major sites.
No-one has any off the shelf rifles available I'm pretty sure.

 

[Mike70560]

Bushbuck,

This may be the answer to what you are looking for.

Small bore double rifle

I have handled some of Bailey's rifles at DSC. His work is nice. He also seems to be a real good guy and is well respected.

 

[johnfox]

You've lost me.....the thread title is "Double rifle for a child" and then you're straight into talking about .410 shotgun choices.........

 

[Bushbuck]

You've lost me.....the thread title is "Double rifle for a child" and then you're straight into talking about .410 shotgun choices.........

Hi John,
It is common here to start a child hunting with a 410 slug because there is little recoil. I wanted her to learn how to use a double rifle style gun, so my idea was a side by side 410 shotgun with slugs instead of a pump.

 

[Bert the Turtle]

I somehow missed that you were looking for a shotgun although it is perfectly clear from your post in retrospect. You could get her a Stoeger coach gun. It will most emphatically not be a thing of beauty, but if she likes it half as much as my son likes his $79 NEF 410, you will be golden. Have the gunsmith cut the stock to fit when he puts sights on it.

The only concern I have with using a double 410 as a slug gun is that the barrels are almost assuredly not going to shoot to the same point of impact with slugs. I don't see any easy way around that.

What about starting her with a break action single shot rifle such as the NEF? They are cheap and the action is as close to to a double as you are likely to get without spending some big bucks.

 

[Bushbuck]

Hi Mike, bailey's is on the idea I was thinking about. Looks like he makes some fine s/s. The big bonus of that style 410 frame is the weight and the size. That frame size is much easier for a clild to hold and get there hands around.

Bert, i understand and appreciate your concerns. The point of impact would certainly have to be something that is tested. A break open single shot is still an option. My Ruger #1's are bigger than what I would want her use. I pick up some of these 410 s/s guns and they are nice and light around 6#'s but mostly I like the size of the gun around the pistol grip area. I just feel if I can get something to work at that size it would be real comfortable for her to carry and use.

Thanks to everyone for your ideas so far.

 

[35bore]

Mike,
If you reload, Cabelas use to sell a fairly affordable SXS double rifle in 45-70 Gov. The way I understand it you can load down and use a lighter bullet, I think they were made by ("Persolli"?) If I am spelling it right. I don't have any experience with the 45-70 I mentioned, but, did own a "kodiak" double black powder rifle that was sold by Cabelas years back, and it shot pretty good, very heavy though. Hope this helps, Scott.

 

[Bushbuck]

Hi Scott,
I have a couple of those black powder guns. I like using them for turkeys. I have a pretty good selection of shotguns, and love to shoot them.

I am sure I can load down any cartridge to a light load, but what is more important is the size and weight of the gun. I think any 45-70 would be more than what I am looking to put in her hands.

 

[AkMike]

Tarawa now has a Pedersoli Kodiak 9.3X74 R that I used to own. A true DR that uses cartridges. But they're about 10# and too much for a 10 yo.
Baily's rifles are looking very good but there is already a backlog til next year form what I'm told.
Travel to Africa might be severly hampered with a BP. DR. Regs don't allow BP on flights and it may be hard to find there.

 

[35bore]

Mike, even with 45 cal. bullet made for hanguns? 240gr. range. Weight of the rifle may be the issue, but, would help with recoil. The way I remember they are 14lbs. give or take. I don't reload, so I'm really just trying to defend my original post, LOL. Thanks, Scott.

 

[AkMike]

A handgun takes a .452 IIRC and a rifle takes a .458. It wouldn't be accurate at all.
The Remmy/Baikal 30-06 DR might be a good option for a first rifle after thinking about it for a bit. Cheap and very accurate and a manageable caliber for a young lady IMO. It'll most likely need a trigger job because they're very heavy pulls. After adjusting the barrels they are very accurate.
If you'd consider an O/U I think you can find them in 308 also.
Personally I wouldn't cry as much about cutting one of these down for a youngster.


(edit) I just looked thru Gunbroker and there are several listed FYI.

 

[35bore]

AkMike, I wasnt sure if it would work or not, I know several reloaders that use .308 bullets for the 7.62x39 and the 303 enfelid which take the .311 bullet. I guess I don't know how much deviation in bore diameter vs. bullet diameter there can be before you start loosing accuracy, so thanks for clarifying that for me. Also excellent recmendation on the Remingtons I had forgotten about those, held one never fired, but felt solid as a rock, and they are inexpensive (bonus).

 

[AkMike]

Personally after shooting several of the Baikals, I'd go for one if I were a beginner to DR's. They make a great brush gun for here since they're a tool that can be used and abused w/o the worry of a 100 y/o rifle or a $pendy high quality one. No worry about whittleing down the wood either.
They shoot great with factory loads since you adjust the barrels to the loads used. BUT the triggers suck!

 

[tarawa]

I think that I would look at the Baikal doubles on gunbroker. Since they can be regulated for point of impact, you can get some of the reduced recoil 30-06 rounds that Remington makes. There would be a problem with a 410 shooting to point of aim.

 

[35bore]

Bushbuck, this thread really got me searching, and researching. With what I have found and read, I think you are right on the money with the 410 sxs slugger for a young girl, but if you want a rifle cartridge I will have to put AkMikes suggestion for the Remington in front of everything else sugested.

 

[35bore]

There really are not alot of choices, Being this is for your 10 year old daughter. If you are lucky, maybe you could find one of those old 32 or 38 caliber double BP rifles for her to cut her teeth on. Wish I could be more help, I will keep searching though.