458 Lott Hornady DGX / DGS

[Rob 458]

Hello

I just recently started reloading 458 Lott and I am using Hornady DGX 500 gr , 350 gr interlock FP. I tried a few of their recommended loads and was not to impressed with what I got compared to the factory stuff they sell.
When surfing the net and in the cartridges of the world reloading book along with Hog tech service , Jack Lott himself all indicate 500 gr bullet with 75-85 max gr of IMR 4320. Hornady for some reason recommends a Max of 77 gr IMR 4320 with DGX / DGS ??? with real poor velocity ratings as expected.
Has anyone ever shot the DGX / DGS rounds with IMR 4320 before and if so how did it work pressure wise ?
When I asked Hornady about this they just said that they used a Ruger 1-10 twist 24" and that's all they could get out of 4320 in that rifle. I also noticed all their recommended loads are are lower velocity then what they sell pre made. They won't give up their secrets either I tried already. They use 77 gr of something they won't share ?

Can the 500 gr hornady rounds be so different then others that IMR 4320 at 85gr is not an option because of their reload data or did they just have a bad shooting day at Hornady ?

 

[Mike70560]

What velocity are you getting out of the 77 grains of 4320 with the 500 grain bullet? Are you shooting DGS or DGX? What is your barrel length?

 

[Rob 458]

Shooting a Parker hale 458 WM rechamberd to 458 Lott with 24" barrel not sure on the twist yet still trying to find out. I don't have the Hornady manual yet because of local stock issues but talked to them on phone and I think they were getting around 2150 ?? but do get around 2250 with win 748 . Not 100% on that but there seems to be other non bullet specific reference on 500gr with IMR 4320 max 85 gr putting out little over 2300 fps. Can the DGX be so different then other 500gr rounds ?. I have shoot the DGS factory and its at 2300 fps . currently I'm reloading the DGX

 

[Mike70560]

You said you were not impressed with velocity you were getting. Are you shooting over a chronograph or just guessing?

I would not look for 2300 FPS out of a Lott. 2200-2225 is easily obtainable with zero pressure issues with several different powders.

 

[Rob 458]

No chronograph yet just guesstimating based on other data. Would like to get the highest velocity safely possible but not compromising accuracy. Was hoping that someone may have experimented with DGX / IMR already and had some data. I loaded 3 each from 80 gn going up to 85 gr in 1 gn increments to see how it works out accuracy and pressure considered. Some day I will get some time to try it out at the range.

 

[PaulT]

Rob,
I have loaded Woodleigh 500gn Weldcores to about 2250fps (chronyd in a 22"bbl) with 77gn of AR2206H.
This load is mild in MY rifle but I suggest working up to it in YOUR rifle.

The problem I have with these and any other load pushing some 458 bullets at that velocity is that on close range (50yds and under) shots at thick skinned game this velocity is too much for a lot of standard 458 projectiles and you will suffer some bullet failures.

If your wanting to get the most out of your Lott I strongly urge you to load with the very best quality, controlled expansion projectiles i.e North Fork, C.E.B, Swift & Barnes.
They need to be tough to withstand the Lott velocities, especially so when impacting at close range which is the essence of most big game hunting.

Learn to be able to read signs of pressure when working up loads and back off at least 2 - 3 % from max for loads to be used whilst hunting.
You should sacrifice a little velocity for loads that cycle, chamber and eject without any effort.

A well constructed, controlled expansion 500gn slug at 2200 - 2250 out of any Lott is an absolute powerhouse load that will stop anything on this planet.

Good luck and happy hunting.
Paul.

 

[RickB]

If I'm not mistaken hornady DG ammo is loaded with superformance powder. Gives 100fps more than regular powders. They just released the powder last year I belive. Here is a link for it. It is made by Hodgdon.

Sperical Rifle Powders

Scroll to the bottom of the page. It's the last powder listed.

 

[huntingbigun]

Shooting a Parker hale 458 WM rechamberd to 458 Lott with 24" barrel not sure on the twist yet still trying to find out.

Real easy to find your twist use a good cleaning rod that has a swivel handle, use a jag with tight patch stuff it in the barrel so you can see the rod turn as you push it in a bit then mark the rod with tape say at the end of the breech then push it in till it makes one revolution, mark it again measure and poof you have it, say one turn in 12 inchs = 1 X 12

Buy a chrono it is the start of getting great handloads, you can see if your getting even pressure, avg velocity etc . At the price of the heavy caliber ammo it will pay for itself in no time.


Try this site great info for small investment

LoadData.com - Ammunition Reloading Data, Supply and Equipment. Over 100k Loads Currently Listed.


Have fun

engoy

 

[Rob 458]

Rob,
I have loaded Woodleigh 500gn Weldcores to about 2250fps (chronyd in a 22"bbl) with 77gn of AR2206H.
This load is mild in MY rifle but I suggest working up to it in YOUR rifle.

The problem I have with these and any other load pushing some 458 bullets at that velocity is that on close range (50yds and under) shots at thick skinned game this velocity is too much for a lot of standard 458 projectiles and you will suffer some bullet failures.

If your wanting to get the most out of your Lott I strongly urge you to load with the very best quality, controlled expansion projectiles i.e North Fork, C.E.B, Swift & Barnes.
They need to be tough to withstand the Lott velocities, especially so when impacting at close range which is the essence of most big game hunting.

Learn to be able to read signs of pressure when working up loads and back off at least 2 - 3 % from max for loads to be used whilst hunting.
You should sacrifice a little velocity for loads that cycle, chamber and eject without any effort.

A well constructed, controlled expansion 500gn slug at 2200 - 2250 out of any Lott is an absolute powerhouse load that will stop anything on this planet.

Good luck and happy hunting.
Paul.

Thanks for the response Everyone

I chickened out with the IMR 4320 at 85 gn . I am using H335 at 79.3 gn 500 DGX with good results at 2200 fps . Getting 1 1/4 " groups at 50 yard with two out of 3 holes touching in a 3/4 " group and one stray making the group 1 1/4 ?? could be me or variables in my loads. Not sure if the powder you mention is available around here but sound like you get good results with that and will see if I can find it. How can I test the Hornady bullets for disintegrating problems ?? at the range .
Another load that not two bad is 350 gn flat points with 79.8 gn of H 322 at 2600 fps. Better for deer sized animals at a distance.

No superformance load data for the Lott but it is used in the win mag and I'm not sure why it would not work in the Lott or why hornady did not make a load.

My rifle has a 1-10 twist at 24 " and same twist as hornady test barrel so there load data as is seems to work good in my rifle. I tried going up and down a 1/2 gn with recommended loads and the groups widened. Strange how 79.3 gn is more accurate then 79.8 or 78.8 gn makes you wonder what .4 and .2 would be like but scales are not that accurate at weighing powder to find out.

 

[PaulT]

Rob, I'm pretty sure Ar2206H is not available in the U.S.

Powders with similar burning rates (loads are NOT interchangable !) are Hodgdon Benchmark, IMR 3031 and AA2015. You could try some build up loads with one of these, whichever is available to you.

Other loads you may want to trial (500gn);
IMR 4064 72gns (start) 78gns (max).
IMR 4320 75gns (start) 80gns (max).
As with all trial loads build up slowly one grain at a time watching for pressure.

Get a digital caliper. Measure an unfired virgin brass case and note that any case head expansion beyond .002 the original virgin case head measurement is getting pressure build-up.
Any stickiness in the up-lift of the bolt during extraction, any shiny rings around the lower portion (head) of the case are all signs of building pressure which is what you don;t want in a rifle being used for DG.

Also get a chrony(their not expensive and invaluable when reloading).
Fire your loads in batches of four or five.
Start at minimum loads and record velocities.
As you increase powder charges you'll also note a pattern of increase velocity per grains increase of powder. When that pattern is slowed you are getting near max.
I.E if you loaded (example only);
74gns of xyz powder and got an average of 2000fps, then
76gns of the same powder gave you 2200fps, then
78gns of the same powder gave you 2225 fps your getting near max with between 76gns and 78gns.

With judicious loading it is not difficult in getting mild pressure loads in most Lott chambered rifles up to 2250fps with most 500gn bullets, just pick a good one to hunt with.

I have shot quite a few Hornady D.G.X's into buffalo here in Aus and must honestly say that their performance has been both acceptable and consistant but even I find it hard to ignore the numerous reports and complaints of recent failures.

Practice with the Hornadys, hunt with North Forks, C.E.B's, Swift A-Frames etc.
Expensive dangerous game hunts are not worth gambling on.

By the way I am currently on my third .458 Lott chambered rifle in 14 years. It is an awesome cartridge in every respect.

Best of luck, good hunting.

 

[Bobpuckett]

Rob if you haven't gotten a chrony yet you can get a new one for around $85 I reloaded for years relying on the book to give me the speed (not even close) get a chrony I don't know how I did with out it.

 

[sestoppelman]

Makers of chronographs say they often get queries about a chrony giving lower velocities than expected but not about one that reads higher than expected! Agree with the above, you gotta get a chrony to know whats really happening.

 

[Wolverine67]

Every ammomanufacturer, gunmaker, bowmanufacturer use unreal techniques to achieve unreal velocities.
Special testbarrels, max dl, with knitting pins arrows....All because we hunters are speedfreaks. Thats why you rarely achieve speeds advertised.

 

[Rob 458]

I think I can get some barnes product here in canada but can't seem to find the rest.Will practice with the crono over summer . see what happens.

thanks again everyone.