458 Lott Data Disparity

[Catahoula]

I'm getting ready to start loading for my new Lott. My intention is to get Woodleigh 500 grain softs and Hornady 500 grain solids shooting as close to the same point of aim as possible. With all of the disparity in data, I think I'm going to have to use a chrony to sort it out. Below are some examples from Nosler, Hornady and Woodleigh loading manuals with H4895.

I understand that different bullets have different load parameters, but the Nosler and Hornady data seem conservative and the fact that the Woodleighs show an additional 4 grains to attain the same velocity has me a little baffled. (Not to mention that Woodleigh's starting loads are well above the max listed by the others)

I'm not trying to hot rod the loads. I'd be satisfied with an honest 2150 fps. Does anyone have any experience with actual velocity information that they can share? I've never used a chronograph in developing loads. I'm usually happy with something in the middle of the listed loads that provides good accuracy. Looks like it's finally time to join the modern reloading world!

 

[cbvanb]

It's the reality of reloading. Every bullet made will behave differently as it moves down the bore, and you can get into trouble thinking that all bullets of the same weight will behave the same. Also, the test barrel and powder lot will have an effect. Some reloading manuals are calculated with long pressure barrels while others use actual commercial guns for a more realistic result. Personally, I wouldn't get hung up on these differences. Just select the bullet you want, use the starting load recommended, and work your way up slowly until you get the velocity you want.

 

[CTDolan]

Hornady and Nosler each publish conservative loads for the 458 Lott (Hornady's loads are really no different than what they publish for the 458 Win Mag).

The prior response is correct - many factors affect the end result. Trust the loading manuals and do no veer from published load data. Since all you want it 2,150 fps, there's no reason to anyway.

 

[stug]

My take on loading manuals is to focus on the max speed, not the max powder weight. Speed is a function of pressure, the manual writers will be using minimum spec chambers etc that will create more pressure than a mass produced factory rifle. If I take 3 or 4 more grains to reach the max speed listed I'm not worried.
Pushing past the max speed listed is where you come into problems, unless it is one of the well-known calibres that the manual writers keep to lower pressures than modern calibres because of the use in old weaker rifles, like 7x57.

 

[Catahoula]

Thanks for the input. I'm going to start with load development for the Woodleigh softs. Once I settle on a load, I will work on getting a load with the Hornady solids that shoots to the same POI. If I can't, I'll try a different solid. I'm only working with the Hornadys because I have a couple of boxes on hand.

 

[tarbe]

We've seen up to and even in excess of 5% variation in internal capacity among different brands of brass.

And a quarter-inch of freebore will really make a difference in the data!!

When in any doubt, start with the more conservative looking data and go from there, especially when starting out with a new-to-you rifle.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

I’m with @tarbe, default to the conservative side.

 

[CTDolan]

Thanks for the input. I'm going to start with load development for the Woodleigh softs. Once I settle on a load, I will work on getting a load with the Hornady solids that shoots to the same POI. If I can't, I'll try a different solid. I'm only working with the Hornadys because I have a couple of boxes on hand.

Just curious, why not use Woodleigh solids as well?

 

[Catahoula]

Just curious, why not use Woodleigh solids as well?

I may. I just happen to have a couple of boxes of the Hornady on hand. If I can’t get those to work out, I’ll try the woodleigh solids. I had great performance from the Woodleigh soft points in my 416 on buffalo, so I’m committed to staying with those in the Lott. I’ve shot a small quantity of factory Norma ammo with the woodleigh bullets in the Lott and accuracy has been good.

 

[CTDolan]

I've got some Hornady solids on hand, too, the old variety (pre-DGS). I was thinking of loading them up but then decided to keep them as a part of my collection.

 

[Catahoula]

I've got some Hornady solids on hand, too, the old variety (pre-DGS). I was thinking of loading them up but then decided to keep them as a part of my collection.

The two boxes that I have are the old version as well. I’ve not loaded them. If they don’t work out, I’ll try the Woodleighs.

 

[Luvthunt]

With my 458 Lott no powder gave more consistency then IMR 4320.

 

[Pheroze]

Thanks for the input. I'm going to start with load development for the Woodleigh softs. Once I settle on a load, I will work on getting a load with the Hornady solids that shoots to the same POI. If I can't, I'll try a different solid. I'm only working with the Hornadys because I have a couple of boxes on hand.

I have found the folks at Woodleigh are fantastic to work with. You should not hesitate to contact them if you have any concern or questions. I am sure they will be helpful.

In my experience the Woodleigh data/velocity is the most accurate of those three. I often found I did not get the velocity claimed in the Hornady manual with their loads. I have used the Woodleigh manual for 6.5x55, 3006 and 375 H&H. Btw, I also noticed the Lee Manual often had heavier loads than Hornady.

 

[Catahoula]

I have found the folks at Woodleigh are fantastic to work with. You should not hesitate to contact them if you have any concern or questions. I am sure they will be helpful.

In my experience the Woodleigh data/velocity is the most accurate of those three. I often found I did not get the velocity claimed in the Hornady manual with their loads. I have used the Woodleigh manual for 6.5x55, 3006 and 375 H&H. Btw, I also noticed the Lee Manual often had heavier loads than Hornady.

Woodleigh has been very responsive when I have contacted them in the past.

It’s interesting, as I continue to look through data, Hornady shows higher charges for some powders in the Win mag than they do the Lott. I know that the rifle used can make a difference, but it makes no sense. I think I’m just going to pick up some Woodleigh solids and work up some loads with them.

 

[Luvthunt]

Understand you support fp Woodleigh, good bullets and good people. My best combo in my lott is 500 grTrophy bonded Sledgehammers and 500gr A Frames with IMR 4320 for 2280 fps.
Over the past have tried most solids and softs, [no Woodleighs] .
Did use pre DGS [500gr] solids on two Cape buffalo in 2001. Recovered 2 bullets and they were in reusable condition.
Just for info—did try the Barnes bullets [TSX and solids]on the range but had to cut powder charges in my rifle do to the longer bullet length and had to crimp hard as powder was significantly compressed even with my reduced charges.
The Lott is fun and hope you enjoy yours as I have mine.

 

[Aussie_Hunter]

I'm getting ready to start loading for my new Lott. My intention is to get Woodleigh 500 grain softs and Hornady 500 grain solids shooting as close to the same point of aim as possible. With all of the disparity in data, I think I'm going to have to use a chrony to sort it out. Below are some examples from Nosler, Hornady and Woodleigh loading manuals with H4895.



View attachment 242599

I understand that different bullets have different load parameters, but the Nosler and Hornady data seem conservative and the fact that the Woodleighs show an additional 4 grains to attain the same velocity has me a little baffled. (Not to mention that Woodleigh's starting loads are well above the max listed by the others)

I'm not trying to hot rod the loads. I'd be satisfied with an honest 2150 fps. Does anyone have any experience with actual velocity information that they can share? I've never used a chronograph in developing loads. I'm usually happy with something in the middle of the listed loads that provides good accuracy. Looks like it's finally time to join the modern reloading world!

What load did you end up coming up with? I just recently started reloading for the Lott and noticed the same thing you did, that other published data such as Hornady, Speer etc were significantly below the Woodleigh data with the same powder. I am currently using the 500grn Woodleigh RNSN with 83.8grns of Alliant RL15, this should put the velocity at very close to 2200fps and so far the load seems to be performing very well.

 

[DrBob]

Shoot to have both solids and softs hit to same point of impact. Forget trying to match velocity. The amount of energy delivered will be enough. When I did the work up for the Magnum article with A2230, A2520 and IMR 4320 with all the bullets, I wound up with different powders and relatively different velocities but great point of impact options... and decent energy on target. Varget was my go to powder when not trying to mimic Somchem powders.