Purchasing my first double, Sabatti safari big five or Merkel 140AE - advice requested

.470 Sabatti, My favorite gun to shoot, bullets touching at 50yds, Regulated by Ken Owen although I’ve seen factory regulated ones that would shoot the same.

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Jeff Rann has enough faith in them to use as loaner rifles for his elephant hunts.
 
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deewayne2003 said:
.470 Sabatti, My favorite gun to shoot, bullets touching at 50yds, Regulated by Ken Owen although I’ve seen factory regulated ones that would shoot the same.

View attachment 679886

Jeff Rann has enough faith in them to use as loaner rifles for his elephant hunts.
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Exception, not the rule with a Sabatti.
 
ActionBob said:
Chapuis has always had a 450-400 available in the Elan line. They just recently released it in the lower cost Iphisi line.

Have your wife put the lottery ticket money in a cookie jar;) The odds of it buying anything substantial will be a lot
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deewayne2003 said:
.470 Sabatti, My favorite gun to shoot, bullets touching at 50yds, Regulated by Ken Owen although I’ve seen factory regulated ones that would shoot the same.

View attachment 679886

Jeff Rann has enough faith in them to use as loaner rifles for his elephant hunts.
Click to expand...
The key here to be absolutely confident is Ken Owen regulated. That is a guarantee from one of the two best DR men in the world the other being JJ Perodeau. Plus @deewayne2003 can shoot the eyes out of a fly
 
Rare Breed said:
The key here to be absolutely confident is Ken Owen regulated. That is a guarantee from one of the two best DR men in the world the other being JJ Perodeau. Plus @deewayne2003 can shoot the eyes out of a fly
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I am absolutely confident in the gun and yes, when I spoke with the previous owner and he mentioned that it was regulated by Ken Owen that sealed the deal.

Ken speaks highly of Sabatti doubles and I’ll trust a man who can make a 4 bore from scratch.
 
ActionBob said:
Chapuis has always had a 450-400 available in the Elan line. They just recently released it in the lower cost Iphisi line.

Have your wife put the lottery ticket money in a cookie jar;) The odds of it buying anything substantial will be a lot higher.
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A bit tongue in cheek about the lottery ticket, we always joke about that.
I have been aware that Chapuis Elan has been available in the Elan. Interesting that they now offer it in Iphisi line. Hopefully they continue with that.
My gunsmith speaks highly of Chapuis has for years.
I just want a French double, just because of my French heritage.

JJ Perodeau’s validation selling them is good enough for me.
 
Thanks again for all the great feedback.
Does anyone know who is the go to gunsmith in Aus for double rifles?
 
deewayne2003 said:
.470 Sabatti, My favorite gun to shoot, bullets touching at 50yds, Regulated by Ken Owen although I’ve seen factory regulated ones that would shoot the same.

View attachment 679886

Jeff Rann has enough faith in them to use as loaner rifles for his elephant hunts.
Click to expand...
You are the first person at this planet to see that!

HWL
 
I have owned 2 merkels and 1 Sabbati. I like both, but would go with the Merkel. I bought the Sabbati because it was in 450/400 3". All of them shoots well and yes the Merkels shoot a little better.
 
Before buying a Sabatti, take a close look at the wedge between the barrels and the soldering job. The ones I've seen just look cheaply done. A Sabatti may serve many hunters very well.... but they are just not built the way other higher quality rifles are. I have 3 doubles that are between 114 and 126 years old. Although granted the 126 year old one was redone at the factory 119 years ago when it was re-proofed for Cordite;)

I don't see a lot of Sabatti rifles attaining that kind of durability.
 
A. Swan said:
Thanks again for all the great feedback.
Does anyone know who is the go to gunsmith in Aus for double rifles?
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Rodd Flower in Vic has built double rifles. He some videos on YouTube coverig the process. He replaced a broken firing pin on my Sabatti. He does warranty for Perazzi shotguns, Sauer and Blaser.

Rob Bloomfield (Sunshine Coast Gunsmithing) is in Pomona, closer to you and has done good work for a mate on his doubles.
 
HWL said:
You are the first person at this planet to see that!

HWL
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Well here is a picture of Jeff Rann holding a Sabatti after a client shot an elephant dead.
IMG_4115.PNG


Craig Boddington also has one and likes them.

Are they a Heym.... NO, but their also not $20K to start, but they are effective.
og4WLNI.jpeg
 
I don’t like either but would go with the Merkel all day long. Have owned one merkel, decently made just did not fit me well. The few Sabattis I have seen when Cabelas was selling them some years back were regulated by grinding muzzle. Really poor quality.
 
MacJenkins said:
I don’t like either but would go with the Merkel all day long. Have owned one merkel, decently made just did not fit me well. The few Sabattis I have seen when Cabelas was selling them some years back were regulated by grinding muzzle. Really poor quality.
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Yeah that was a micro fraction of their production, but just like .458win early powder issues the reputation sticks to every ear it touches.

Ken Owen bought many of those Cabelas rifles and fixed them properly and resold them all.
 
The BGR competition is on this Sunday at Ripley. No doubt there will be a few doubles there and you’ll be able to get plenty of opinions on what is best.
From my limited knowledge of doubles, if someone offers to sell you a Sabatti …run! Run far and don’t look back .
 
deewayne2003 said:
Ken Owen bought many of those Cabelas rifles and fixed them properly and resold them all.
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I think it says enough, when you can make a business, repairing the shitty stuff of that company....

HWL
 
deewayne2003 said:
Yeah that was a micro fraction of their production, but just like .458win early powder issues the reputation sticks to every ear it touches.

Ken Owen bought many of those Cabelas rifles and fixed them properly and resold them all.
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Great points made by all. I do think we should be careful with too broad a brush. I have just about owned the major and some minor brands in my 8 DRs. My Merkle was great fine regulated working rifle. My Sabatti was regulated by Ken Owen and functioned beautifully as does the one owned by @deerwayne2003. For me, much like @ActionBob my final choice settled on a Rigby built in 1906 given without question nostalgia and the pride for just myself owning such a fine rifle built over one hundred years ago!!!
 
A. Swan said:
Good day fellow hunters and firearm enthusiasts.
As the title suggests I am at the point of purchasing my first double and now I simply need to decide on a model.
I have decided on 450/400 NE 3 Inch as a caliber.

A bit of information on myself and the intended use of the rifle:

I am South African born, currently living in Australia. My wife and I return to South Africa once every 1.5 - 2 years to visit family and hunt, where the rifle will be used on large game and buffalo (Which I have historically used my Musgrave .375 H&H)
While in Australia the rifle will primarily be used for target shooting (Big game and hunting rifle discipline)

In summary:
1 buffalo and large game hunt every 2 years
10-12 rounds of target shooting from 50m and closer once per month

I am looking for a reliable rifle that doesn't break the bank, from my research the above mentioned models should fit the bill as originally I didn't want to spend more than A$10k

Also seeing as the majority of shooting will be on a target range and i would like to keep my brass clean and in good condition, I have no preference in extractors vs ejectors - from my understanding extractors might even suit me better - happy for any advice on this as well.

The Sabatti safari big five comes in at A$12.5k (extractor) / A$13.9k (ejector)
The Merkel model 140AE comes in at A$14.9k (ejector i believe)

I personally prefer the look of the Sabatti, but i understand that looks should not be the key decider in matters like this.

So I am asking those with vastly more experience than myself, are the above rifles acceptable quality for the money?
Is there a strong preference of one over the other?

Also, for anyone in Australia. If there are other brands/dealers that I should look at please let me know, I am only listing these as they are the only models I can find South of A$20k

Thank you to anyone that is going to read this and take the time to offer a response
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Dont buy a Sabatti !!!! I have owned 2 and they need allot of work. Granted there are exceptions to the rule, some guys are lucky and get a good one, crap shoot.
Sabatti is HORRIBLE about backing there product if there is problems, you will be abandoned.
I had to spend allot to get mine re-regulated by Ken Owen so they finally shoot. Mine were post Cabelas crap, so thats not the issue. I should have bought German in the first place.
Great choice on the 450-400!
If your hard over about the Sabatti, at least be able to shoot it first and check regulation before you spend a dime. My 2 cents.
 
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