First Double Krieghoff vs Chapuis

[Ruraldoc]

I am looking at my first double rifle. Have found a like new Krieghoff in 470 as well as a Chapuis 450/400 and am deciding between them.

Any recommendations regarding Krieghoff vs Chapuis as well as 450/400 vs 470.

Rifle to be used primarily for Buffalo and hippo on land,but probably elephant at some point as well

I already have scoped bolt actions in 375, 416 and 458 Lott.

The double rifle would be paired with one of the bolt guns in future trips to Africa.

 

[AES]

I certainly wouldn’t buy the 450/400 as you would essentially have 2 of them (basically same as 416R and 404J) and that would impact your pairing choices.

 

[Ruraldoc]

I would probably pair a 450/400 with a scoped 375 unless I was hunting elephants.

Probably take a bigger bolt gun for that.

 

[wesheltonj]

Well, the Krieghoff would be my choice if I thought I I was going to use it more than once. I just can’t justify purchasing a double gun for one hunt, but if I did it would be the Chapuis in 375 H&H Mag because of pricing.

 

[sureshot375]

Krieghoff is hard to beat in that price range. In all fairness I’ve never shot a Chapuis.

 

[Altitude sickness]

If they are preowned. Ask to see real targets that the owner shot and the exact load used.

Try to buy one from someone here that has actually fired the rifle. And can pass along the load or secret sauce it likes.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

They are 2 very different systems. I prefer the Chapuis not because its better, but I prefer the cocking system.

 

[Mountaineer]

Which model Krieghoff?

 

[Ruraldoc]

This one, 470 deluxe with ejectors Not sure about model name or number.Attempting to post a picture.

 

[Ruraldoc]

 

[Philip Glass]

I am looking at my first double rifle. Have found a like new Krieghoff in 470 as well as a Chapuis 450/400 and am deciding between them.

Any recommendations regarding Krieghoff vs Chapuis as well as 450/400 vs 470.

Rifle to be used primarily for Buffalo and hippo on land,but probably elephant at some point as well

I already have scoped bolt actions in 375, 416 and 458 Lott.

The double rifle would be paired with one of the bolt guns in future trips to Africa.

The Kreighoff is the superior rifle. I have both .470 and .450/400 barrels for my Kgun. There is a difference in recoil but If you want to get into doubles and hunt DG then recoil is just part of the equation. I find the .450/400 to be akin to a .375 in terms of recoil and certainly less than .416. Be careful on the used market as there are many, if not most, out there for sale that don't Have ejectors. This is one reason I bought mine new. I have yet to hear of a real reason to own a DG gun that is slow to reload.
You will need any DG rifle inspected by a competent gunsmith (JJ Perodeau) and professionally fitted to you. Don't skip any steps in this process. Remember it is Dangerous Game!

 

[Ruraldoc]

Both guns have ejectors. Both are used but like new condition.

The price for both rifles with Tijicons is almost identical.

If I get the Krieghoff I will look into a second set of barrels in 450/400 or 500/416

 

[Ruraldoc]

How does the recoil of the 470 compare to the 450/400? Especially interesting that you have a rifle with barrels in each to compare.

I shoot my Model 70 in 416 Remington well so I can handle that level of recoil. My Model 70 in 375 is much more comfortable to shoot.

 

[Pondoro]

A Krieghoff with .470 and .375 Flanged barrel sets should be brilliant..

 

[Rare Breed]

How does the recoil of the 470 compare to the 450/400? Especially interesting that you have a rifle with barrels in each to compare.

I shoot my Model 70 in 416 Remington well so I can handle that level of recoil. My Model 70 in 375 is much more comfortable to shoot.

i’ve owned both calibers and the Chapuis. you will notice a step up from 450-400 to the 470. having said that when you get into big bore DRs you cannot scrimp on both weight for caliber and proper LOP. you will absolutely pay for it in felt recoil. also as i have stated many times on here understanding how to get your desired FPS within safe PSI using the least grains of powder gives less felt recoil. if your not a reloader then you may suffer in this. big difference in using IMR3031 at 80 grains of powder versus 112 grains of H4831SC to get the same 2050 FPS in terms of recoil in this example for my 500 NE but same principle applies for 470, etc. In DRs details really matter if you want to enjoy shooting the gun

 

[Ruraldoc]

i’ve owned both calibers and the Chapuis. you will notice a step up from 450-400 to the 470. having said that when you get into big bore DRs you cannot scrimp on both weight for caliber and proper LOP. you will absolutely pay for it in felt recoil. also as i have stated many times on here understanding how to get your desired FPS within safe PSI using the least grains of powder gives less felt recoil. if your not a reloader then you may suffer in this. big difference in using IMR3031 at 80 grains of powder versus 112 grains of H4831SC to get the same 2050 FPS in terms of recoil in this example for my 500 NE but same principle applies for 470, etc. In DRs details really matter if you want to enjoy shooting the gun

I will probably reload for the double rifle. Been reloading for many years. I talked to Ken Owen and he explained how to use lighter charges of faster powders to get to the proper velocity with much less recoil in a double rifle.

 

[Ruraldoc]

One important detail is the Chapuis 450/400 weighs 8.7 pounds. The Krieghoff 470 is more than 10 pounds.

Not sure if the 450/400 needs more weight?

 

[ACM]

I own a double, but neither of the brands mentioned so I will stay out of it. I do have an opinion on this, but it is strictly from research & not from field testing brands mentioned.

As for DG cartridge choice.
450/400 is seriously cool and recoil is very 375-like, but if you are not a hand loader, I would probably stay away. Don’t hesitate using a 450/400 on ele.
470NE is widely available, & in a 10.5-11lb gun, I bet you wouldn’t notice the recoil difference from your 416 in a 9lb gun.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

This is the action of my Krieghoff Classic 500/416.
I'd describe the fit and finish as "like a Swiss watch".
It is a precision instrument.

The large black blocks behind the sears are anti-doubling devices that function during recoil.

If the price is right, strongly consider the Krieghoff.
If priced the same as the Chapuis, well that must be a mighty nice Chapuis.
If however you desire a 450/400 rather than a 470, then buy the Chapuis or keep looking for one.

Whatever you do, don't be in a hurry.
When the right double comes available at a fair price, buy it!

 

[Mtn_Infantry]

I own a Chapuis 470 and a Merkel 500. I prefer the Chapuis and am considering selling the Merkel. I do not personally own a KGun but have played with and shot one. I wasn’t a big fan of the cocking on it, but I suppose if I owned one and practiced enough I’d learn to get over it.

My vote is the Chapuis, but I’d tell you to step up to a 470 if you plan to Ele Hunt more than once. The 450/400 as a dedicated buff gun would be a solid choice.