.223 for Steinbok, Duiker, Klipspringer?

I just bought Tina a NIB Savage Lady Hunter in .223, mostly for practice and local varmints. I started thinking that this might be a good light rifle for Steinbok, Duiker, Klipspringer and other Tiny Ten sized game.

Would the 62 grain Barnes X be a good choice for heart lung shots? I've read some PH's advise a gut shot to anchor the animal, and the use of varmint type bullet in small calibers.

The other route is a larger caliber with solids. She's not recoil shy, but shooting a Ladies rifle in a light caliber would make her a lot happier.

What do you think?

My buddies and I have used 55 grain Sierra game kings out of .223/5.56 rifles with stunning success on caribou. They will no doubt do a fine job on smaller game.
On a later hunt I killed a nice bull with several 70 grain Barnes X bullets. It was the wrong bullet used in the wrong way, the shots were at 320 yards. The 52 grain Barnes would have been a better choice for that far of a shot but why bother when any number of jacketed soft points would do the same or better.
I love Barnes bullets but they definitely need to be used right. Can’t really recommend them for a general purpose hunting bullet when ranges might exceed a couple hundred yards. It just doesn’t have the speed.

Oh, and I wouldn’t hunt with anyone who would suggest gut shooting an animal. Theyd be going to the dentist if they said something like that to me.

The reason to center-mass shoot a small antelope is the hydrostatic shock tends to anchor them. A fast bullet going through the shoulder bones of a Tiny 10 will tear it apart. While a .223 will work, I’d suggest a bigger, slower bullet. A solid is the best option.

Most of the tiny 10 are shot from close range. So a fast bullet is still going really fast. Imagine shooting a rabbit at 50 yards with a .223!

What will her normal Africa hunting caliber be?

I think a Barnes in a 223 would do just fine.
I know folks that shoot whitetail and pronghorns with a 223 and Barnes or partions. I think they keep most or all shots under 200yards

Last trip to Africa she shot everything with her Savage Lady Hunter from the Custom Shop in 257 Roberts. She shot this Steinbok at around 40 yards with a handloaded 100 grain TSX. From front to back, things were a mess, and the animals right side would not have made good pictures.

I love my Tikka T3X in 223 and shoot a ton of groundhogs with 55 gr TSX. I think it would perform very well on any tiny antelope particularly the larger ones you listed. I’ve shot several duikers with 223 (unknown bullets I was given) and results were very good, but I don’t think it justifies bringing a 223 as a second rifle when other rifles will do the job equally well. I’ve had no issues with exit holes on steenbok and duiker with 300 Win and 375 H&H with Barnes bullets. I’d assume the same with tough bonded bullets like swift A Frame as well.

ARHinAK said:

Oh, and I wouldn’t hunt with anyone who would suggest gut shooting an animal. Theyd be going to the dentist if they said something like that to me.

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I personally find shooting a large animal like a caribou with a 223 much more objectionable. If you shoot a steenbok with a 300 win just behind ribs they won’t go anywhere. Quite a difference in distance between vitals and guts on a buffalo or kudu vs a steenbok. No one is suggesting that shot with a 223. Most cases it’s for larger faster rifles so you can still shoulder mount your trophy.

I wouldn't gut shoot a rabid skunk.

The .223 would work great, but I would load 60 grain Partitions.

375Fox said:

I personally find shooting a large animal like a caribou with a 223 much more objectionable. If you shoot a steenbok with a 300 win just behind ribs they won’t go anywhere. Quite a difference in distance between vitals and guts on a buffalo or kudu vs a steenbok. No one is suggesting that shot with a 223. Most cases it’s for larger faster rifles so you can still shoulder mount your trophy.

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I can assure you that within a couple hundred yards a .223 is enough gun, and all but the one I described above were taken that way. I hunt a fair amount in one of the harshest environments I’ve seen, try different things to see what works and what don’t, learn from my mistakes/poor choices and move on. As far as gut shooting animals I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree. My goal is to end an animals life as quickly as possible if that’s the case. Not save my taxidermist some sewing.

The reason I asked is because she is really enamored with the the Tiny Ten type antelope.

Gemsbok, Kudu, Sable? Nope, she'd shoot a Land Rover full of Gerenuk before you could get her interested in a Lord Derby Eland.

If all she wants to shoot are the little ones, why not a little rifle in a little caliber, and leave the 257 Roberts at home for Pronghorns and Deer?

ARHinAK said:

Oh, and I wouldn’t hunt with anyone who would suggest gut shooting an animal. Theyd be going to the dentist if they said something like that to me.

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I’m not that much of a tiny ten guy myself, but from what I’ve seen first hand with many different species, the biggest challenge is having enough left so that the taxidermist can sew back together a full body mount. I’ve seen a few almost cut in half. Some of the full body mounts you see with one sitting next to a rock etc, is a taxidermist working with what’s left. They are a small target, often darting and fleeting. I get the ‘center of mass’ approach. Not always intuitive, the 375 with a solid works really well. Too fast a bullet, that expands too quickly, you just have a mess.

Caribou and the tiny ten are about as similar as elephant and caribou. I’m not clear from your post what your experience is with the tiny ten (vs the 223), but I suggest holding off making people take unplanned trips to the dentist until you’re working from first hand experience.

ARHinAK said:

I can assure you that within a couple hundred yards a .223 is enough gun, and all but the one I described above were taken that way. I hunt a fair amount in one of the harshest environments I’ve seen, try different things to see what works and what don’t, learn from my mistakes/poor choices and move on. As far as gut shooting animals I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree. My goal is to end an animals life as quickly as possible if that’s the case. Not save my taxidermist some sewing.

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I haven’t shot a caribou with a 223 and probably never will. I can only assume from how your post is written you’ve never shot a steenbok. You are making it a point to call it a gut shot when it’s really just slightly further back than a normal shot with certain cartridges/bullets and at certain distances. They don’t run anywhere and there is no suffering. In something as small as a steenbok energy can kill depending on cartridge and bullets you are using. The only difference is one shot leaves a much more salvageable cape. If I had a 375 solid or a 223 I’d take a standard shoulder or slightly behind shoulder shot. If I had a 300 win at 50 yards and softer bullets I’d probably take a shot for back of ribs again.

To the original question, I recommend bringing whatever rifle your wife is most comfortable with, and relishing the fact that you get to enjoy this together. Especially if your interest lies mostly in kudu, gemsbok and the like, you have just the perfect hunting companion. My concern with the bullet would be whether it expands too much, too soon.

Separately, maybe we should start another thread “tiny ten shot placement” and let those with the most experience weigh in. My experience, with only about half of them, is that they always fall on the shot, don’t get back up, and are dead when you get to them.

I would go with .22 mag if the little guys are a primary target.

.223 will work, but greater speed means greater chance of big exit holes.

318AE said:

Caribou and the tiny ten are about as similar as elephant and caribou. I’m not clear from your post what your experience is with the tiny ten (vs the 223), but I suggest holding off making people take unplanned trips to the dentist until you’re working from first hand experience.

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Let's clear the air here: Are you advocating that there is a legitimate case to be made for deliberately gut shooting animals, as the tone of this post implies?

To be clear here guys
Most of the little animals are shot as part of a normal plains game safari in South Africa
So generally using a 30-06 or similar rifle
So shoot a steenbok through the shoulders with a 30-06 at 50yds
Usually not much left for the taxidermist to work with here
So we usually do advise the clents to shoot them a little bit back, around last rib
It works well and client still has a enough skin for a nice mount

Regards

skydiver386 said:

I just bought Tina a NIB Savage Lady Hunter in .223, mostly for practice and local varmints. I started thinking that this might be a good light rifle for Steinbok, Duiker, Klipspringer and other Tiny Ten sized game.

Would the 62 grain Barnes X be a good choice for heart lung shots? I've read some PH's advise a gut shot to anchor the animal, and the use of varmint type bullet in small calibers.

The other route is a larger caliber with solids. She's not recoil shy, but shooting a Ladies rifle in a light caliber would make her a lot happier.

What do you think?

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I would use barnes
The harder and more like a solid the bullet acts for small game the better
I assume you will be doing full or shoulder mounts. So damage to skin is something to think about
These small calibres come out at speed and can blow the little guys apart especially with a softer bullet or if u hit a shoulder

There is clearly advice being offered by people who have zero experience hunting the tiny ten and no consideration for mounting a trophy.

I've been trying to full mount most of the little critters. A 375 with a solid is hard to beat.

For @skydiver386 's wife, the 223 is probably on the list of terrible cartridges to use on the tiny ten. I like a 22 Hornet or even a 22 magnum. Heck a 22 LR is probably enough for many.

I'm afraid that even a solid in a 223 woukd tumble and tear a pretty massive exit hole. The Steenbok i have shoulder mounted was shot at the last rib with a soft in a 375 but the critter was quartering and that bullet removed the entire rumen full of grass thus blowing a massive hole out the far side. Yes the animal flopped over dead right there. We were hunting Waterbuck and I had no time to load a solid. On the other hand I shot my first duiker at about 10 yards with a soft from the same 375 through the ribs and had about a 3/4" exit hole.

I've shot several of the silent seven with a 7x57 with 173 grain Softs. The same PH recommend a 30-06 with 220 grain Remington Cor Lokt bullets because there is plenty of bullet for large PG and they move slow enough to not blow up little critters.

If you end to end a tiny ten animal with anything more than a 22 Hornet or less than a solid from a 375, you are going to likely rip it open.

...I have used the .223 to shoot the three animals listed, steinbok, duiker and klipspringer. I shot them with mil ball ammo. Little hole going in, little hole going out.
Limited experience for sure. One each, but no ruined hides.